The College System

[pigsonthewing6]

I seem to be at a struggling point in my life. I'm half way through high school and there's a huge inner conflict going on inside me that I can't seem to resolve.

Part of me wants to follow the college system. On one level, I want to go to a good college. I want to be successful in life and have educational opportunities. I want to go to the best college possible, a tier one school or even an ivy league school. But to do so takes a tremendous commitment. I'd have to dedicate myself to the cause. It's the only way. But some part of me wants to take this journey. I want to be a good student, listen to my teachers, do all my homework and study well enough to get a high GPA. I want to pull all nighters when its necessary to pass that midterm. And I want to do enough clubs to be recognizable to colleges. And I want take classes and practice tests for the SAT and ACT.

But the other part of me has different motivations. On another level, I just want to be happy. I want to enjoy my youth and have as much fun as I can. I don't want be 40 years old looking back and wishing I'd had more fun when I was 17. I want to go out with friends, party, mess around with girls, get good sleep, play, work out and do whatever the hell makes me happy. I don't want the stress of following the college system. I don't want all my time to be consumed by clubs that I only do because they look good on applications. I just wanna be kid and enjoy life. And maybe I want to do this forever too. Sometimes I wonder if going to a good college would really do anything for me anyways. I mean, isn't the purpose of a good college just to be happy in the future. It seems like its been grounded in my head that the only way to be happy in the future is to go to a good college. Because good college means good career which means good income which means happiness right? But happiness is available right now, so why go through all the trouble?

Is there any compromise? Is there a right path? Does college really matter? Should I conform to the college system simply because that's what society dictates as the right thing to do? And, ultimately, what would really make me happy, because that's the goal isn't it?

Any thoughts would be very appreciated.

[Brutha]

Is there any compromise?

Compromising geneally isn't a good idea.

Study Hacks » Blog Archive » The Zen Valedictorian: A Radical New Model for Getting the Most Out of College
The best path isn't to overload your schedule but to do something remarkable.

[Nasir]

Originally Posted by pigsonthewing6

Because good college means good career which means good income which means happiness right?

No, it doesn't mean a good career, or even guarantee you a job once you've finished. High income does not mean happiness, it's just a bonus in life. What college gives you is an opportunity. However, opportunities can be found or made.

Basically, if there is something you need to go to school for (being a doctor, lawyer, etc), and you really want to do it, go for it. If you want to do something else that doesn't require a degree, perhaps starting your own business, you can skip college. Either path can make you happy, and provide you with a good income.

The most important thing about college is not the degree you get. It's the knowledge you absorb, and your ability to apply it in the real world. This knowledge can be obtained on your own, or through an educational institution. Only you know what's best for you.

[Monique7nuns]

Originally Posted by pigsonthewing6

I seem to be at a struggling point in my life. I'm half way through high school and there's a huge inner conflict going on inside me that I can't seem to resolve.

Part of me wants to follow the college system. On one level, I want to go to a good college. I want to be successful in life and have educational opportunities. I want to go to the best college possible, a tier one school or even an ivy league school. But to do so takes a tremendous commitment. I'd have to dedicate myself to the cause. It's the only way. But some part of me wants to take this journey. I want to be a good student, listen to my teachers, do all my homework and study well enough to get a high GPA. I want to pull all nighters when its necessary to pass that midterm. And I want to do enough clubs to be recognizable to colleges. And I want take classes and practice tests for the SAT and ACT.

But the other part of me has different motivations. On another level, I just want to be happy. I want to enjoy my youth and have as much fun as I can. I don't want be 40 years old looking back and wishing I'd had more fun when I was 17. I want to go out with friends, party, mess around with girls, get good sleep, play, work out and do whatever the hell makes me happy. I don't want the stress of following the college system. I don't want all my time to be consumed by clubs that I only do because they look good on applications. I just wanna be kid and enjoy life. And maybe I want to do this forever too. Sometimes I wonder if going to a good college would really do anything for me anyways. I mean, isn't the purpose of a good college just to be happy in the future. It seems like its been grounded in my head that the only way to be happy in the future is to go to a good college. Because good college means good career which means good income which means happiness right? But happiness is available right now, so why go through all the trouble?

Is there any compromise? Is there a right path? Does college really matter? Should I conform to the college system simply because that's what society dictates as the right thing to do? And, ultimately, what would really make me happy, because that's the goal isn't it?

Any thoughts would be very appreciated.

Take it from a confused, nearly 40 year old who's been to school, has the degrees and no job to show for it..

Do what makes you happy. If you're not sure then go do some of the things you mention. If you're truly interested in whatever field you're planning to go to school for, you can still learn and perhaps even gain experience in the field by volunteering or shadowing those who are already doing it.

College can wait.. if you're having this much trouble deciding don't make a commitment yet. Have fun, be happy! Trust me, I would go back if I could.

[Foresta Gump]

You sound like someone going places in life, you have good solid intentions, it's better to know what you want in life then to not know. You already have your path paved for you, so just follow it.

Never lose sight of your dreams, and remember you are your own best friend honey, so be true to your best friend which is yourself.

You are young, your ideals may change, but you have a whole lifetime to do the things you want to do. You will gain experience with every endeavor you pursue, so continue making your decisions good ones, you've already got a good idea of what you want from life, so you are way ahead of other kids your age. Alot of kids don't have a clue what they want and alot of them don't know how to go about to get what they want from life. All you do is think about what you want and go after it and it's important to get what you want from life. So go get it Brutha!

Foresta Gump

[Jarreddo]

Honestly, you're what, sixteen? I don't really think you can know at that age what you want to do with your life; my dream at age 16 was to be a therapist, live in the suburbs, own a big house, and write books. It's only four years later and now I want to be an artist, live in the city, and barely scrape by.

Basically, I'd say keep your options open. I'd disagree with Brutha and say compromise for now, work hard enough to get into a decent college when you graduate, but also take some classes just because they sound fun, and have a life outside of school. When you have a goal that you're excited about to the point where you don't mind missing out on the rest, then commit to that. Until then, you don't really need to think so far ahead, you're young. Live it up.

[Brutha]

When you have a goal that you're excited about to the point where you don't mind missing out on the rest, then commit to that.

Going with what society expects of you is different than committing to a goal. It's compromising.
I'm not making an argument that he should do something that reduces his chances of getting into a good college.
I am saying that the approach layed out by Cal Newport is better than the mainstream approach since it neither requires the compromise of giving up future success or present happiness.

[pigsonthewing6]

Thanks everyone for the replies!

I did some thinking and I realized that I am way ahead of most of my peers. I mean, most of them have no idea what the hell they're doing. Even the ones that get really high grades are just doing what they're told. I already have a lot of plans for the future, goals for my life, and idea of the person I want to be.

Today I came up with what seems to be a good solution. It's basically the traditional college method and it can also be considered a compromise. My goal is to work my ass of during the week and then party or do whatever I want over the weekend. I'll work hard and play hard as well.

So while I'm in school I figure I might as well bust my ass off. I'm already there so I should be working hard. And then during the week I'll mostly commit myself to my studies. The goal is to have no work or studying to do over weekends and breaks.

I also looked at Cal Newport's sight and I like some of his advice. The one that seemed most relevant to me was his article on pseudo work. The idea is that when you're working with complete focus and intense than you can get work done much more effectively. The only way to do this is to take breaks every hour and study no more than three hours. I also have to exercise, eat healthy, and get good sleep to keep good energy levels.

Well, I guess that's my solution for now.

[funchy]

One thing some college-bound teens are doing is taking a year off. They save up in highschool and let the college know it'll be a year delay before they enter. Then they spend that year backpacking through Europe, doing a missionary trip, or whatever. The time is used to learn, travel, mature, and get their fill of fun and adventure. Google "gap year". Example: SunJournal.com - More teens take pre-college 'gap year'

Or go to college somewhere really "fun". If money was no object, where would be a cool place to study? Specialty college... or a school in the heart of London or Amsterdam.... or an un-traditional college such a studying aboard a ship? College doesn't have to be drudgery or a boring local state university.

[rosegold]

Don't go to college; you are probably better off with being a bag boy; that way you can think of what you want on the job, and apply that thought to your personal job, be it starting a blog like Mr. P. or whatnot.

Alan Lakein wrote in his time management book that he knew someone who purposely got a routine job so that he could think of what he was truly passionate about--fish breeding. He would think of ways to breed fish while he was at his no-brainer work.

Think of being a bag boy (or any other routine no-mental work) as a free opportunity to exercise (that actually is productive; when you go to the gym your energy is used up just for the sake of your health, while when you do some kind of manual labor, you are at least doing something productive)

[lovelyn]

I think that's a good compromise. You can study and do well in school and still have a good time. Remember that learning, growing and applying yourself to the things that are most important to you bring more happiness in the long run than partying like a rock star.

You can take some time off once you graduate. Then if college feels like it'll be right for you go. Don't just go to college because you feel like you want to get a great job, because a college education isn't a guarantee that that'll happen.

[WRX AJT]

Originally Posted by pigsonthewing6

It seems like its been grounded in my head that the only way to be happy in the future is to go to a good college. Because good college means good career which means good income which means happiness right? But happiness is available right now, so why go through all the trouble?

Is there any compromise? Is there a right path? Does college really matter? Should I conform to the college system simply because that's what society dictates as the right thing to do? And, ultimately, what would really make me happy, because that's the goal isn't it?

Any thoughts would be very appreciated.

Hey! I'm a 22 year old college student that went through the same thing you are. First off, MOST of my good friends are all studying either Pre-Law, Pre-Med, or Pre-Dental. I, however, am not studying anything close to those. I suppose you could say I'm the "black sheep" of my friends. I'm currently studying Organization, Leadership, and Supervision (which essentially is business management but more people related). After I get my Associates this upcoming spring, I'll move to North Carolina to go to a school for Motorsport Management.

"Because good college means good career which means good income which means happiness right?" That is true for most. For me, I don't care about being super rich. I'd rather go to a school that will lead me in the right path to get a job doing something I love. You basically have to find a career that you're passionate about. In my case, it would be racing or anything that has a loud engine and goes fast. So, unlike my good friends, who are trying to start careers in high paying jobs right out of college, I'm starting with the basics and letting my passion tell me where to go. Money isn't the key to happiness. Happiness is doing what you love and not letting others deter you. People might give you a rough time like they have with me, but honestly...why not do something you love? Hopefully this will help

If you have any questions feel free to ask me considering I've already been where you are right now!

[darkw0rker]

I Just want to remind you of something profound which you already know.

Review your life. See what kind of a person you were last year. Compare that to this very moment characteristic. See how different you have become only by a year.

Now do you think you are going to think like you do at the age of 40? Do you think you are going to miss partying and playing?

If your thinking stays the same when you reach the age of 40, I should tell you that you haven't learned anything in life.

And also, it is very good that you are questioning the college system. That shows you want something more of it, not just a job requirement, resume filling ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Find your own way. There is no right way.

[Fullcrum]

Brutha, loved the links and that guy, Carl. He's been added to the RSS feed and to my school's facebook group. Hopefully other students can also benefit from his approach.

[Halffull]

College is perfect for where you're at developmentally, judging from the tone of your post... same with pretty much everybody, which is why the majority of people have a good college experience.

There seems to be some divide in your mind between going to college and enjoying your youth... which I think I may need a little more explanation of... how did you come to this belief?

[apteryx01]

Originally Posted by pigsonthewing6

Because good college means good career which means good income which means happiness right? But happiness is available right now, so why go through all the trouble?

Here's a video of Alan Watts talking about having a drag now to achieve long-term goals so you get happiness in the future.

[Stressless]

Hi pigsonthewing,

You are really pretty young to know what you want to do in life. If you don't want to get confined into a certain number of years in college there are two things you can do. One is to go to a smaller community college which will give you more free time or do some other courses so that your studying is not compromised.

The other is to take a year off - if you have the money to do so - and go travelling or try out whatever you want to do. If you don't have the money, perhaps you can work part time or for a few months and then take off. You definitely need some focus in life. However, both college and travel are learning experiences and will stand you in good stead later on in life.

Check this out - it will help you focus:

21 Stress-Stopper Formulas For a Healthy and Happy Life

[apteryx01]

Originally Posted by Brutha

Compromising geneally isn't a good idea.

Study Hacks » Blog Archive » The Zen Valedictorian: A Radical New Model for Getting the Most Out of College
The best path isn't to overload your schedule but to do something remarkable.

Thank you, thank you, Brutha, for directing me to the Cal Newport site! I've been reading it all morning. That site looks like the motherlode of info that I need to make it in grad school.

Your statement about compromising intrigues me. Do you have some more info about your notion of not compromising? I'm wrestling with this right now, regarding grad school. Here's some detail. (This is long, but here goes.)

Long ago, when I first started undergrad, I hated it, for two reasons: (1) taking multiple classes put me into "subconscious brain-clash": I feel the desire to dig deeply into one topic, but it's always time to move on to something else, resulting in a long-running, very unpleasant feeling; (2) most classes are taught as meaningless symbol-manipulation, without much regard for applications, making the material very difficult to retain (and hence the need to explore it on my own as in (1)).

I thought back then that if someone wanted to set up an organization to teach people subjects to a high level of mastery, they would not do it much like college. You would take one course at a time, and you'd focus on doing the real thing, not on exams.

So, I quit. I refused to compromise. I got a job in software development that I wasn't anywhere near qualified for (I didn't know much C, and I didn't know how compilers worked). Within a year, I had learned more comp sci than most people learn in four years in school, and I was earning money and doing well. I got what I wanted: all-day-every-day focus on one subject, oriented by doing the real thing and not exams. Life was good.

Later, I felt the calling to become a researcher and teacher (i.e. a professor). I decided to compromise and just get the degree, no matter what. I tolerated college for two years and got a degree, without getting much knowledge--too busy doing homework problems to learn the subject. And now I'm in grad school, experiencing the same frustrations I had my first time as an undergrad. "Subconscious brain-clash" is back, and I feel disgusted with the inefficiency of trying to learn while taking multiple classes.

So now I'm pondering the question of whether to compromise and go along with the grad-school system, in order to participate in the research community that interests me, or bail again and go my own way and just trust that things will work out.

Looking back, I'm happy with some compromises I've made, and unhappy with others. Some have led to logjams getting unstuck, and the other side had something valuable that I couldn't appreciate at the time. Others have led to me wasting time, doing things ineffectively, making a bad situation worse by going along with someone whose approach was as bad as it seemed at the time or that just didn't fit me.

The pattern seems to be: you can only tell if a compromise will be worthwhile later, after things have played out. Not very helpful for making the decision at the time.

Have you written any thoughts about this--when it's wise to trust that compromise will bring benefits that can't be fully understood at the time, and when it's not?

[Rapid]

Originally Posted by pigsonthewing6

So while I'm in school I figure I might as well bust my ass off. I'm already there so I should be working hard. And then during the week I'll mostly commit myself to my studies. The goal is to have no work or studying to do over weekends and breaks.

Sounds like a good plan.

On the other hand, remember though that you will have more unstructured time in college than you have now. How much free time you have will depend on your major (for instance, if you decide to major in one of the sciences, you will have less free, unstructured time). So you can have as much fun in college as you wish. You can also incorporate study abroad in your schedule. I didn't take advantage of this option when I was in college.

I would suggest that you try to get into as good of a college as you can so that you will have more options (e.g. connection to alumni with good jobs). I'm not sure that graduating from an Ivy League school is necessary to get a good job since I know a number of people who arrived at where they are without a brand-name diploma. If you decide to go the community college route, make sure that you will be allowed to transfer to a four-year college after two years.

Your major will/may have an impact on your employability. If you find yourself loving philosophy but want to go to medical school or go into finance, you can take the basic required courses and participate in internships to round out your background.

Working at a minimum-wage job might be okay for the short-term, but you might eventually become bored and demoralized (since it sounds to me that you are a thinker). Running a small business full-time is not as easy or fulfilling as it sounds. It's definitely not for everybody. You might want to start something low-cost during your summer break and see how you like it.

I'm glad that you've started to think about your life goals and are asking people for advice. I am a strong believer of conducting experiments (instead of just gathering info) to find out if you would like doing something. Sometimes you will find out quickly; sometimes it will take some time. For instance, I found out that I wouldn't like working as a journalist at a daily newspaper, after writing just two articles for the paper. I was a college student at the time and didn't get paid for my efforts, but I found this out after investing only two days of my life.

All the previous advice are based upon my own life experience. The advice may or may not be too general for you. If you want more specific advice, feel free to post more details (e.g. majors, career paths).

All the best.

[apteryx01]

Originally Posted by Rapid

I am a strong believer of conducting experiments (instead of just gathering info) to find out if you would like doing something. Sometimes you will find out quickly; sometimes it will take some time. For instance, I found out that I wouldn't like working as a journalist at a daily newspaper, after writing just two articles for the paper. I was a college student at the time and didn't get paid for my efforts, but I found this out after investing only two days of my life.

Some of the best meta-advice there is!

Most advice given out about deep topics like "how do I live well?" works for the person giving the advice and for a small percentage of other people, but not many others. The above advice, "Try a sample and see how it works for you," is one of the rare bits of advice that fits just about everyone.