Thinking about PATHS, AMAZING RESULTS!!

[The Coronet]

So Ive been following all these PATHS discussions and I basically decided that whether its real or placebo either way the subconscious has a tremendous effect on the body. I wanted to get the moduale for antiaging skin cause my skin got all a bit wrinkly with too much sun and I know im not old but I used to have beautiful skin and it was getting me down.

Anyway I couldnt afford it and so I thought, if I can do it with PATHS I can do with out. So I bourght some spirulina and 24/7 I have been telling myself I am 19years old..(Im 30 in a month) and I hadnt been doing it for very long when a whole bunch of things happened. I didnt feel like my skin looked that much younger...but it seemed that everyone around me did, without me saying anything about it at all. 3 days ago I got asked for ID, that means in the UK that someone thought I was 17!!!!!! Then the person with the most amazing skin asked me how I could be almost 30 and not have wrinkle on me, and about 5 differnet people told me how young I look. One of my closet friends said to me that my skin looked amazing and what had I been doing :-)

Anyway I just wanted to share that with you all and to thank PATHs for their indirect inspiritation.

All the best to you all

[worldcitizen1]

Excuse me, could someone be so kind as to explain to me what "PATHS" is?

It sounds fascinating! How about that -- looking younger, even below legality (!) without yourself realizing ...

Ana

[Shaden]

Excuse me, could someone be so kind as to explain to me what "PATHS" is?

You don't want to know... but of course if you're curious then just do a quick forum search on PATHS.

PATHS is basically a systematic method of utilising the LOA. It's bloody expensive and I'm one person who is very suspicious of it. But if you're a LOA believer it's worth a look I guess. Just beware of how that placebo effect might be working against you.

[The Coronet]

I just checked in the mirror and ALL MY GREY HAIR HAS GONE!!!! Look i didnt have a lot, just a few strands, but enough for my friend to start teasing me! And now its just not there...could this be the spirulina, or am I just amazing at manifesting!!!!!!!!!!! Im well HAPPY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :-)

[dor]

Originally Posted by Shaden

PATHS is basically a systematic method of utilising the LOA. .

i think you give it too much credit shaden I think it's an outright scam.
in discussions with aaron the 'inventor' he clearly indicated he didnt even know what a controlled experiment is...then we're supposed to listen to him about quantum physics

anyway the placebo effect of subliminals is well documented:


Subliminal Tapes: Self-Help Snake Oil (A Scientific Perspective)

[Erki]

Originally Posted by Shaden

Just beware of how that placebo effect might be working against you.

Care to elaborate/give examples?

[Shaden]

Care to elaborate/give examples?

I can only speculate, but judging by how the PATHS organisation seem to function like a well-oiled business, charging extreme prices for their product and refusing to offer a fair refund, then I can only assume that the major focus of the business is money.

Kudos to them. I think that's a fair goal in life. But I think the people who use the product should beware of what they could be subconsciously programming you to think. If it's possible to adjust your subconscious thoughts to attract more money and wealth through one of their 'pods' then what effort would it take to adjust your subconscious thoughts in a manner that would compel you to buy their over-priced 'pods' another time?

Truth of the matter is if you believe in the LOA then you don't want to buy this product. Why not? Because you're consciously manifesting the dependence of your success with the LOA outside yourself. In other words you're limiting yourself and your power, not to mention emptying your wallet. That doesn't seem like a fair exchange to me. True masters of the LOA don't grab their 'pods' whenever they want to manifest something. This is just another facet of the 'fast-and-easy' approach that is constantly plaguing the self-help industry. True masters of the LOA (and PD) do it the hard and proper way; through meditation, visualisation, deep-thinking and consequent action.

Too much 'fast-and-easy' just leaves you behind the pack. And you'll miss all those extra dollars as well.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Shaden

True masters of the LOA (and PD) do it the hard and proper way; through meditation, visualisation, deep-thinking and consequent action.

Well, Shaden, that's what you are creating for YOURSELF, anyway!

p.s., PATHS did give impaul99 a refund after all, despite his admitting that he did not honor the terms.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by Shaden

Truth of the matter is if you believe in the LOA then you don't want to buy this product. Why not? Because you're consciously manifesting the dependence of your success with the LOA outside yourself. In other words you're limiting yourself and your power, not to mention emptying your wallet. That doesn't seem like a fair exchange to me.

And would you say the same thing about Erin, who charges a pretty penny for her readings which stimulate insights? About a hynotherapist, who charges substantially for help in quitting smoking? About a massage therapists, whose ministrations suggest muscles relax?

The people who purchase services from Erin, from a hynotherapist, or masseuse are all perfectly capable of manifesting insights, quitting smoking, and relaxing without benefit of the services -- by doing it the "hard way" through meditation, visualization, deep thinking and consquent action, as you say. Neither Erin or these other service providers would offer a no-questions asked money back guarantee, I don't think. And none of these services lives in the realm of hard & fast provable science. A reading with Erin can actually cost much more than a month of PATHS does.

Do you think Erin is "just another facet of the 'fast-and-easy' approach that is constantly plaguing the self-help industry"? If not, how are her services different from PATHS?

[BelleEnchanted]

Originally Posted by Shaden

True masters of the LOA (and PD) do it the hard and proper way; through meditation, visualisation, deep-thinking and consequent action.

Originally Posted by Angela

Well, Shaden, that's what you are creating for YOURSELF, anyway!

For me, LOA works the best when I'm having fun and feeling good. It's good that we can create for ourselves whatever feels best to us.

Belle

[Yev]

Excellent work Coronet. Now we know why Aaron kept telling everyone to eat mountains of spirulina.

But please, please, please don't tell me that you sell spirulina because I've had enough of marketing scams from the PATHS people.

To those who are worried about PATHS giving them subliminal messages to go and blow up the local MacDonalds - I don't believe PATHS has the ability to do anything positive in your life, and therefore by extension it does not have the power to turn you into a terrorist. However, if you previously had terrorist leanings, the placebo affect might just make you think now is the time .....

[The Coronet]

Originally Posted by Yev

But please, please, please don't tell me that you sell spirulina because I've had enough of marketing scams from the PATHS people.

Hahaha! no I dont have no fear! That stuff is really good though, another thing I have noticed is how strong my nails are, they have never been this strong my whole life! I heard today they give it to astronaughts, so it must be pretty powerful stuff!

[JeremyW]

How do you know that you could not have gotten the same results without using any spirulina at all?

[annie33]

I haven't heard of PATHS before 5 minutes ago, but I started manifesting looking younger a few weeks ago. Although I can't see any real difference, people around me do. I don't use Spirulina, but I do use Perfect Food by the Garden of Life company.

[dor]

Originally Posted by The Coronet

I heard today they give it to astronaughts, so it must be pretty powerful stuff!

can post a link or source for that? thanks.

[Lola]

Originally Posted by The Coronet

I just checked in the mirror and ALL MY GREY HAIR HAS GONE!!!!

Hey - me too! Yesterday I spent 90 minutes and $75 at the salon and when I walked out - no more gray hairs!

Your method sounds easier...

[The Coronet]

Originally Posted by JeremyW

How do you know that you could not have gotten the same results without using any spirulina at all?

Yes that is very possible. The question is did I manifest spirulina into my life because it was a way that my brain could concieve of providing what was necessary to precipitate this new found youthfulness? I think it works like that. Its like yea you can manifest losing weight just with your mind probably, but only if your mind would believe it....mine would probably need to do something, (like some sort of exercise) to really believe it would work.

dor there are lots of links if you google spirulina and astronoughts! Nasa is providing it as part of their diets..here are some I found:

Spirulina (dietary supplement - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) (see the bottom)

Spirulina, enjoy the benefit of spirulina from mall.coimbatore.com

Spirulina, the greatest health food discovered in human history

[The Coronet]

Originally Posted by annie33

I haven't heard of PATHS before 5 minutes ago, but I started manifesting looking younger a few weeks ago. Although I can't see any real difference, people around me do. .

Yea this is interesting, I didnt notice any difference at first but people kept saying stuff to me and it occured to me that my thoughts were project a sort of aura of youthfulness and that prehapes this was the first stage of the change. Now my body is starting to catch up. You know what is really strange, im starting to get this feeling that I had when I was younger. Its hard to explain, but different points in my life have had different feels to them. Now this feeling of being a 18/19 keeps flickering into my consiousness. Im thinking if I can hold on to it for longer I can make more rapid changes!

[Brutha]

Originally Posted by Angela

And would you say the same thing about Erin, who charges a pretty penny for her readings which stimulate insights? About a hynotherapist, who charges substantially for help in quitting smoking? About a massage therapists, whose ministrations suggest muscles relax?

First Erin, the most difficult. Lets take the point of someone who doesn't believe in ghosts:
She talks to beings she imagines and that are only in her mind. I give her that she beliefs that those ghosts are real. She gives advice to people based on her talking. The advice is based on her Intuition instead of analytical thinking. That means it isn't always the best advice but Erins is often enough right to have a good reputation among her custumers.

If Erin would start to justify her reading with bogus quantum physics talk and would quote people who make bogus claims that they could back up if their claim would be true, but that they don't back up because the can't, I would have a problem with her services.

The hynotherapist he tells the subject what he is doing. He hynotises the subject and tells the subconscious to make the changes. I don't see anything wrong with that. He does exactly what he advertises.

The therapist does also do exactly what he advertises. In addition most message therapists sell messages instant of muscle relaxation.

Neither Erin or these other service providers would offer a no-questions asked money back guarantee, I don't think.

A lot of hypnotherapists do have a no-questions asked money back guarantee, because they believe their approach is effective enough.

And none of these services lives in the realm of hard & fast provable science.

He enters the real with of science with his claims. He does more than saying PATH helps every aspect of your life. That wouldn't be as controversial as his claims.
He could get a patent and share his method without any fear, if his method would work in the way he claims.
Its is one thing to say: I have the cure to all those problems, but I don't know why the cure works. Another thing is to say: With the help of a method that is based on Quantum Physics I can cure all those problems.
I claim that I someone can speak with ghosts is acceptable. It a well known fact that some people with mental problems see strange things. Its okay when they thing those mental ellusions are real.
But claiming you have a method that is based on Quantum Physics without backing up the claim, give the impression that something shall be hidden.
That is the step from ignorance to malice.

[firehorse]

Hi Brutha,

Originally Posted by Brutha

.... That means it isn't always the best advice but Erins is often enough right to have a good reputation among her custumers.

As far as I can see, paths has a good repuatation among their customers.

Originally Posted by Brutha

If Erin would start to justify her reading with bogus quantum physics talk ....

Apologies to Erin, but some people would consider 'ghosts' to be bogus. Apologies to Erin again.

Originally Posted by Brutha

.... Another thing is to say: With the help of a method that is based on Quantum Physics I can cure all those problems.

I missed the 'I can cure all those problems', could you direct me to that post?

Originally Posted by Brutha

... It a well known fact that some people with mental problems see strange things.

So are you saying Erin has mental problems JOKE!!!



And back on topic
Coronet, well done for harnessing the power of your own subconscious

Best regards
Alan

[BelleEnchanted]

Originally Posted by Brutha

But claiming you have a method that is based on Quantum Physics without backing up the claim, give the impression that something shall be hidden.
That is the step from ignorance to malice.

Actually, a lot of quantum physics, at this point in our time/space/reality, with the scientific instruments that we have, cannot be proven. That is the current dilemma with theories like the string theory and M-theory.

[Brutha]

Originally Posted by firehorse

Hi Brutha,
As far as I can see, paths has a good repuatation among their customers.

Apologies to Erin, but some people would consider 'ghosts' to be bogus. Apologies to Erin again.
So are you saying Erin has mental problems JOKE!!!

Most people would accept the fact that some people see ghosts in their mind. I don't have to accept the reality of ghosts outside of Erins mind, to accept Erin as working on a higher level than Aaron does.
If a person who sees thinks that are only in their own mind, I would think that you can call them mentally ill (I don't add any thing else into the mentally ill label, Zen or the Art of Motorcycle Maintaince has some nice thoughts about who deserves the label).
So you can either accept ghosts as real or go with mentally ill (both options leave her better than Aaron). On the other hand I don't think that Erin the the kind of person who doesn't see ghosts in their mind and who does readings.

I missed the 'I can cure all those problems', could you direct me to that post?

You are saying that Path doesn't advertise that it can cure problem? (I have added the "those" on purpose)

Actually, a lot of quantum physics, at this point in our time/space/reality, with the scientific instruments that we have, cannot be proven. That is the current dilemma with theories like the string theory and M-theory.

You have to build very complicated devices to measure the very very tiny changes that result from those theories.
But Aaron seems to base in work on a Theory that doesn't provide very very tiny changes.
I would also agree with you that results of PATH are so small (for all pratical purposes zero) that they can't be measured by our very complicated scientific devices, but that doesn't seem to be your point?

[BelleEnchanted]

Originally Posted by Brutha

I would also agree with you that results of PATH are so small (for all pratical purposes zero) that they can't be measured by our very complicated scientific devices, but that doesn't seem to be your point?

Nope. That wasn't my point, or what I was saying. I was simply addressing one thing in your post:

Originally Posted by Brutha

But claiming you have a method that is based on Quantum Physics without backing up the claim, give the impression that something shall be hidden.
That is the step from ignorance to malice.

That is, my point is that quantum physics itself is something that does not produce currently measurable results. So it would be difficult for anyone to back up a claim that's based on quantum physics to a degree that's scientifically acceptable.

Since I don't know have any actual knowledge of what the results of PATHs are, I cannot say whether or not they are so small as to be incapable of being measured by our current scientific instruments. Of course, results on a quantum level that are so small that they are curerntly immeasurable nevertheless may have a significant impact on the non-quantum level - that is one of the most interesting things about quantum physics.

But like I said, I don't have any knowledge as to what the actual results of PATHs are. I was only talking about the challenge of backing up a claim that's based on quantum physics.

Belle

[firehorse]

Hi Brutha,

Originally Posted by Brutha

...I don't have to accept the reality of ghosts outside of Erins mind, to accept Erin as working on a higher level than Aaron does.

You also don't 'have to' accept the explanation given by paths to accept that paths (by whatever means, even by placebo) is getting a majority of satisfied customers.

I can't quite see the difference in that particular point

Originally Posted by Brutha

You are saying that Path doesn't advertise that it can cure problem? (I have added the "those" on purpose)

I'm sorry I didn't make myself clearer. I was referring to your sentence

Originally Posted by Brutha

.... Another thing is to say: With the help of a method that is based on Quantum Physics I can cure all those problems.

which implies you read somewhere that paths had stated "I can cure all those problems".

I have read several times that at the moment, paths have not been able to get it to work 100% for all people, so I was interested if you read a post by paths which stated the opposite.

Best regards
Alan

[Brutha]

That is, my point is that quantum physics itself is something that does not produce currently measurable results. So it would be difficult for anyone to back up a claim that's based on quantum physics to a degree that's scientifically acceptable.

Either you think that his method produces results that are measurable or it doesn't.

Of course, results on a quantum level that are so small that they are curerntly immeasurable nevertheless may have a significant impact on the non-quantum level - that is one of the most interesting things about quantum physics.

The current scientific consensus is that even results that are measurable on a quantum level aren't great enough to effect macroscopic (non-quantum) events. I don't see how results that are smaller than those could effect macroscopic events?
Their are some claims that could be easily back uped. For example the change in DNA. DNA normally doesn't change in humans so you can take DNA for and after the PATH therapy and compare it in a labor. Then you make a model how the PATH therapy changes the DNA and predict DNA changes in the next subject. You give those DNA samples to an accepted labor and let them check your thesis.
If you are right you do the thing also with a few other laboratioriums. That will give you press (word of mouth advertising) all around the world, and would produce a gigantic increase in your sales. All for a few thousand bucks.

Sure the question whether quantum physics is involed would still be open. But to a second question:
How does he know that quantum physics is involed. He should be able to tell, even when the method he uses wouldn't be at the level of scientific proof.

You also don't 'have to' accept the explanation given by paths to accept that paths (by whatever means, even by placebo) is getting a majority of satisfied customers.

Let take an example. I go to an therapist who advertises that he ask his imaginary friend for an second opinion. Even when I belief that this imaginary friend doesn't exist outside his mind I am still okay with his service as long as his clients get satisfied.
I would put talking to ghosts when giving advice in a similar camp.

Aaron's claims are in a different realm.

which implies you read somewhere that paths had stated "I can cure all those problems".

I have read several times that at the moment, paths have not been able to get it to work 100% for all people, so I was interested if you read a post by paths which stated the opposite.

I meant with "all those problem": All problem it claims to cure.

[firehorse]

Hi Brutha,

Originally Posted by Brutha

Let take an example. I go to an therapist who advertises that he ask his imaginary friend for an second opinion. Even when I belief that this imaginary friend doesn't exist outside his mind I am still okay with his service as long as his clients get satisfied.
I would put talking to ghosts when giving advice in a similar camp.

Aaron's claims are in a different realm.

Originally Posted by Brutha

I meant with "all those problem": All problem it claims to cure.

Thank you for taking the time to clarify this point which I misunderstood.

Putting it into context requires the first part of the sentence

Originally Posted by Brutha

Its is one thing to say: I have the cure to all those problems, but I don't know why the cure works. Another thing is to say: With the help of a method that is based on Quantum Physics I can cure all those problems.

Which goes with the first part I've requoted.

So I understand that you put talking to ghosts and imaginary friends into one category and Aaron's claims about quantum physics into a different category.

To me, ghosts and imaginary friends fall into a category of not being accepted by conventional science and would go into the 'unbelievable category' by the scientific community.
To you, Aaroon's quantum physics falls into the 'unbelievable category'.

Therefore I 'assume' (a dangerous word that ) that something has convinced you that there is some merit to ghosts. I assume that would be first hand or second hand anecdotal evidence, reading/study of the subject, or it just 'feels' right.

Is that correct?

You have mentioned are that you okay 'as long as his clients get satisfied' and 'is often enough right to have a good reputation among her custumers'. I would suggest that the majority of customers who have tried paths are satisfied even though the 'science' may be wacky (conventionally unproven like ghosts).

Thank you for your time and patience in answering my questions.

Apologies to Coronet for taking the thread off topic

Best regards
Alan

[One]

I'm back!

The results form members have had with PATHS are rather amazing, but I would have thought this forum especially would be better educated about the powers of self hypnotism and belief.

Originally Posted by impaul99

Then, yesterday I woke up right at 8:30am. And I'm not talking about slowly waking up like my normal routine, I'm talking about bolting out of bed like I heard the fire alarm go off but in a positive sense and without being tired. My wife knows how unusual that is for me. I'm a total night owl who typically goes to bed somewhere between 2am and 4am, so waking up early is like the worst torture for me.

Anyway, I woke up at 8:30 and immediately I thougth "Oh man, that's my PATHS wake up time!" and while walking to my computer room I thought "Watch, there will now be an email in my inbox from PATHS saying they 'fixed' something." Guess what? There was an email! Apperently my email got lost in someone's inbox but they found it on Monday night and at 3:00amish that night (Tuesday morning) they sent it off to their office to get fixed. Whatever they did worked because I woke up right at 8:30am that morning.

So get this... this morning she woke up early, and lay there waiting with one eye open to see what happens at 8:30am. She didn't do anything, she just watched. At 8:30am I was in a dead sleep, like I actually remember the dream I was having, and then 8:30am BANG my eyes open and I'm ready to jump out of bed. My wife is like "Shut the f&*( up! You were in a DEAD sleep! WTF!?" I just turned to her and said "Indian Yogi's honey, Indian Yogi's!"

Originally Posted by impaul99

This morning, day 3 of PATHS working for me, I woke up, lay there for a bit, rolled over and I see my wife staring at me....she asks "Did you just wake up now?" and I said "No, I woke up about 2 minute ago, why?" and she said "Shaddap!". I looked at the clock and it said 8:32am So third day in a row I've gotten up at 8:30am EXACTLY (not 8:31, not 8:29, 8:30am!) No alarm clock, nothing.

I have NOT been going to sleep earlier. IN fact last night I didn't go to bed until 3:38am, the night before it was 2:30am, the night before it was around 2:00am. My typical schedule before paths was go to sleep around 2:30ish, wake up around 9:15-9:30 or so.

This thing is doing SOMETHING. I don't know what, but it's doing something.

Originally Posted by impaul99

As of Monday, they fixed the module and starting Tuesday I have been waking up at EXACTY 8:30am for 3 days now without an alarm clock or even looking at the clock. This has been my most conclusive "proof" that this is finally starting to work for me.

Here's the problem. I just logged into my PATHS account and control panel because I was thinking about adding a few more modules, and I looked at my sleep times and I actually set my wake up time for 8:00am not 8:30am!!! I think I was originally going to set it for 8:30am but then I picked 8:00am and totally forgot about it, and that's the way it's been for 2 weeks so then this thing is NOT what's been waking me up at exactly 8:30am!

So now I've got an even bigger problem. (1) I can't trust this thing because it's been programmed to wake me up at 8:00am and I've been waking up at 8:30am...and (2) Since I HAVE been waking up at exactly 8:30am since I *thought* that was the time I originally set in PATHS it must mean that I was able to program my subconscious mind to wake me up at 8:30am WITHOUT PATHS, therefore it means that it's a placebo effect!

Originally Posted by dor

regarding sleep and autumatically waking up, I once had a professor who chastized me when i made an excuse about being late - I blamed the alarm - he said, you don't need a clock to wake up if you really want to be somewhere. He said it with such believe and intensity that i was never late again for his class.
i since have been because i forgot about that belief, but its been my experience if you REALLY want to wake up (like when I am traveling and need to catch a train or something ) you do.

impaul99 is now trying to get his refund.
PATHS Refund Nightmare

[Angela]

One, you're a little behind the times. A whole thread has appeared and been closed since you last checked in! and impaul got his refund.

[One]

Originally Posted by firehose

I missed the 'I can cure all those problems', could you direct me to that post?

You can get an overview of the claims made by Aaron and PATHS here and here. (Click the upper right thread title to enter the main thread.)

Any single one of his physics claims would win the Nobel Prize. His most reputable reference was a man with a purchased degree. He was unable to link to a single peer reviewed journal to back any of his claims, and every reference he did make was to a personal website.

The first thread was closed for Aaron's namecalling.

In the next thread, after expressing a desire to learn the identity of dor, it appears that Aaron tried to steal his IP address. He made no attempt to deny it.

After exhaustive examination of Aaron's claims I have no doubt PATHS is a scam. I am actually thankful to Aaron and PATHS for one thing. I never realized how powerful personal beliefs were. I've started experimenting in this after reading forum member testimonials.

Originally Posted by Angela

One, you're a little behind the times. A whole thread has appeared and been closed since you last checked in! and impaul got his refund.

You can't seriously expect me to be ready to swoop down with my Scythe of Skepticism all the time now can you?

[The Coronet]

Originally Posted by firehorse

Hi Brutha,
Apologies to Coronet for taking the thread off topic

Best regards
Alan

No worries Alan, Im always happy to let things go with the flow!

"I am actually thankful to Aaron and PATHS for one thing. I never realized how powerful personal beliefs were. I've started experimenting in this after reading forum member testimonials"

I am grateful for this to :-)

Yesterday someone said they thought I was 18 or 19! This is really cool :-)