The Universe is one cruel SOB.

[Karanime]

First, I must state the obvious so the essence of the question isn't ignored in favor of self-righteous spouting about "morality" and "ethics." This is awful. In many belief systems, I am an awful person. The opinion of a lot of you is going to be that I should stop. I won't.

Now, onto the post:

I hurt him. Deliberately. For some reason, I like seeing tears. I don't believe I deserve his love, and I've tried to show him that he needs to get the **** out of this relationship. Which includes just telling him straight up.

How is it that the Universe permits this? Inadvertently (well, not anymore), I'm intending for this boy to continue being miserable. And he won't budge. He insists he loves me with all the love in the world. I say I don't love him back. I say I don't care. He doesn't waver.

I can call him every name in the book, root out all of his insecurities and hit them head on, and yet he doesn't leave.

Why the hell is this even possible? There are no obvious side effects from intending something infinitely harmful to someone (and having it manifest). Isn't there supposed to be karma to protect this kid? Something? Anything?

Where's the force that's supposed to be stopping me?

/<3

[Plays With Life]

Maybe you're practicing to be a devious seductress secret agent

In my experience, no. There's no universal "wrong" action, and there's no "lashback" from the universe for doing any particular action. That only happens when the person who did it believes there will be a response like that.

[newmark]

I don't know what force you're expecting. It sounds like your friend is drawing this treatment from you himself.

Perhaps you were meant for each other. You want to give what he wants to take.

[joelr]

Besides mythology and television/movies where do you get the idea that the universe intervenes in those matters?

Deism is one thing but theism has very little support. Even though each new generation continues to believe that some deity will surely jump in and fix bad situations.
If you think on it you might realize that there are untold numbers of murderers and rapist who are free and unpunished. 64 million praying Christians dies in the black plague, 28 million in WW2. These things all took their natural and most probable course of action. No deity helped.

I do think individuals can preform miraculous things but not when waiting around for divine intervention.
If karma is real it may still take years or decades for you to experience a similar energy to what you are now putting out.

[cylon]

There is a deity and that deity is you. It is kind or harmful on your terms. There is no outside force to step in and make things right or wrong. There is only your focus on the present moment.

More love and peace in the world? Create those feelings. More hurt and war and pain? Focus on those feelings.

There is no right or wrong, but there is such a thing as an effective or ineffective way to get what you want. When something hurts, it's a sign that you are using an ineffective method to get what you want. When something feels good, it's a sign you're using the effective method.

[rei]

maybe the universe is allowing it because the underlying goal, the reason the two of you decided to meet up at this point, is for you to see not everyone can be pushed away. and not everyone stays just to be masochistic.

or maybe this is a reversal of the way he treated you before this lifetime.

the universe doesn't always step in though. sometimes we specifically ask it not to, because we would rather be responsible for the actions and the consequences.

and some people think the idea of cosmic intervention is a bunch of mumbo jumbo.

[blossom]

Nothing can stop you from what you intend or what you do, except YOU! Consequences come later...and you may find yourself in the reverse position at another time in your life, experiencing things from his perspective now, to learn what it is like...or you may recieve another lesson?

If you are looking for something to stop you doing this, then that tells me that you really don't like that you are doing it! You want to send him away because you feel undeserving, so really you are punishing yourself through him!

Maybe you are both suckers for punishment?

Originally Posted by Karanime

First, I must state the obvious so the essence of the question isn't ignored in favor of self-righteous spouting about "morality" and "ethics." This is awful. In many belief systems, I am an awful person. The opinion of a lot of you is going to be that I should stop. I won't.

Now, onto the post:

I hurt him. Deliberately. For some reason, I like seeing tears. I don't believe I deserve his love, and I've tried to show him that he needs to get the **** out of this relationship. Which includes just telling him straight up.

How is it that the Universe permits this? Inadvertently (well, not anymore), I'm intending for this boy to continue being miserable. And he won't budge. He insists he loves me with all the love in the world. I say I don't love him back. I say I don't care. He doesn't waver.

I can call him every name in the book, root out all of his insecurities and hit them head on, and yet he doesn't leave.

Why the hell is this even possible? There are no obvious side effects from intending something infinitely harmful to someone (and having it manifest). Isn't there supposed to be karma to protect this kid? Something? Anything?

Where's the force that's supposed to be stopping me?

/<3

[Karanime]

I think the verdict here is that I'm trying to punish myself because I don't feel deserving of love. I've deliberately tried to see how far I can push, and he still won't leave.

So the Universe is trying to tell me that sometimes people just won't leave, right? Not everyone is going to go running. In fact, when I find someone who really clicks with me on some level, it's going to be incredibly difficult to get them to hate me (my worst fear), so I shouldn't worry about it.

Man, I am so glad I don't believe in God, because I would be SO disappointed right now. :P

/<3

[Dharma]

Originally Posted by Karanime

How is it that the Universe permits this?

Err it doesn't. You permit this. And since you won't move from the point of stuckness inside you, it keeps repeating... he keeps holding on... you keep hitting him with your barbed tongue... and it goes on and on. Feel good yet?

Have you realized the poor boy is you? And every insult you say to him is said to you? This is an externalized presentation of how you treat yourself inside. Maybe you're asking yourself to stop the internal name calling, and the self-rejection, because you will still love yourself anyway.

[blossom]

He sounds like a good guy, who knows what's going on with you...but there is only so much a person will put up with (if they're smart) so it may be your lesson to lose someone great and be left with the hurt you have caused him AND yourself.

...oh well, there will be other opportunities to learn this lesson, it's just a question of whether you are willing to get it, and start accepting that you do infact deserve love, or not...the latter will obviously result in you never experiencing love! That would be a real shame for you! But it's your call...

As for the title to this thread, no the universe isn't cruel...WE are the ones who are cruel to ourselves!

[brendannz]

Tell him that he needs to love himself and deserves better than you.

Not meant as an insult to you, but if you feel that way about him.. he probably does deserve better than to be feeding you his energies..

[nicbrahms]

I read your post and it is refreshing to read something so different to what is normally posted.

You seem very self-effacing to write about yourself like that.

Anyhow, the minute I read your post I got the vibe that you like the guy being there, you like testing him. You know you deserve him and/or better, it has nothing to do with your self-esteem.

You just like the fact he is giving you unconditional love, if you really did not want him in your reality he would not be there.

So either seriously decide you want him gone and he will faze out or accept him and be mindful of your treatment of him. If you prefer him as a friend then tell him that, and move on to someone else.

You are a very confident person, and you consider yourself to be something of a catch, and you are. (We each are beautiful).

You make me smile for you know all this and you just enjoy the games you can play with people. Even with the people responding to your request for advice.

You don't need the universe, God to intervene or protect him or you, you are a powerful being unto yourself, I think you even enjoy scapegoating to a higher power to absolve yourself of your games.

You have been very entertaining my dear.

Love and light

Nic Brahms

[JSB]

In this particular case, the Universe isn't being cruel; you are.

I'm not telling you to stop, but you may find that things make more sense when you acknowledge the role that you are playing in this situation. He may also want to acknowledge the role that he is playing in this situation.

This is a clarification, not a criticism.

[SatvikBeri]

Having been a guy in that situation (with a girl who deliberately tries to drive me away due to various emotional issues/fears), I can offer a possible perspective on what he sees:

He sees someone amazing, who is worth staying with. Furthermore, he sees that she is hurt, deeply, and doesn't know how to handle it. He sees that you aren't acting out of your highest desires, but out of a pain and a fear-and he wants to heal you. And at some level, he probably recognizes that he is helping you heal by being there. And he really, really wants to be there and help you heal.

Be happy. You've found someone with amazing perspective.

[aelle]

Originally Posted by blossom

Nothing can stop you from what you intend or what you do, except YOU!

Absolutely.

What do you get from this relationship? Why are you still with him? It takes two, you know.

[blossom]

I agree with this. You're a very clever girl Karamine...I was quite refreshed also to read all your posts so far.

Originally Posted by nicbrahms

I read your post and it is refreshing to read something so different to what is normally posted.

You seem very self-effacing to write about yourself like that.

Anyhow, the minute I read your post I got the vibe that you like the guy being there, you like testing him. You know you deserve him and/or better, it has nothing to do with your self-esteem.

You just like the fact he is giving you unconditional love, if you really did not want him in your reality he would not be there.

So either seriously decide you want him gone and he will faze out or accept him and be mindful of your treatment of him. If you prefer him as a friend then tell him that, and move on to someone else.

You are a very confident person, and you consider yourself to be something of a catch, and you are. (We each are beautiful).

You make me smile for you know all this and you just enjoy the games you can play with people. Even with the people responding to your request for advice.

You don't need the universe, God to intervene or protect him or you, you are a powerful being unto yourself, I think you even enjoy scapegoating to a higher power to absolve yourself of your games.

You have been very entertaining my dear.

Love and light

Nic Brahms

[nicbrahms]

Originally Posted by blossom

I agree with this. You're a very clever girl Karamine...I was quite refreshed also to read all your posts so far.

Thank you my dear.

[icutoffheads]

You call the universe cruel and pretend that your actions do not bother you. But the fact that you judge the universe as cruel for not stopping, shows that on some level it does bother you. You are actually judging yourself and your actions as cruel, but using the universe as a scape goat for "not stopping" you. You seem to enjoy not being bothered by your cruelty to this boy, but the truth is that you are. When we blame GOD or THE UNIVERSE or even our genes, we are actually blaming ourselves. By labelling your actions as cruel, this means that on some level you actually do feel bad, but for some reason known to you, you justify your actions and continue doing it.

I'm not judging you, I could care less what you do, just pointing out that you judge yourself, pretending to judge the universe. The universe is not some big monster that lives in the hillside. It seems like this is how some people refer or think of the universe. The universe is EVERYTHING including you.

Be honest about how you feel about your actions and the way you treat this kid. I feel like the guilt you may have about this situation may reflect in your reality at some point and bite you on the ass........

[Karanime]

Originally Posted by brendannz

Tell him that he needs to love himself and deserves better than you.

Not meant as an insult to you, but if you feel that way about him.. he probably does deserve better than to be feeding you his energies..

Lol, I've witnessed you change your avatar.

I told him that. I told him everything. I agree with Nic, though. Somewhere, I know I'm the only one that can help him. So I guess I don't actually know what he deserves or needs.

A note to you and everyone else on this board--insult me. There's little you can tell me that I don't already know, and if you happen to find something new, I'll be eternally grateful.

/<3

[Karanime]

Originally Posted by learningwarrior

... and you are losing because he doesn't think of you until he sees you, but you keep thinking about him even when he's not there.

Oof, that's a wake-up call.

Also, icutoffheads (great name, btw), I think we both can see that the title of the thread was more of an attention-seeker than admission of guilt.

I wanted to see what the outside opinion was of what I was doing, and whether there was any opinion other than what I was doing was cruel.

I think I have my answer. I really love this forum. :P

/<3

[nicbrahms]

Originally Posted by Karanime

Lol, I've witnessed you change your avatar.

I told him that. I told him everything. I agree with Nic, though. Somewhere, I know I'm the only one that can help him. So I guess I don't actually know what he deserves or needs.

A note to you and everyone else on this board--insult me. There's little you can tell me that I don't already know, and if you happen to find something new, I'll be eternally grateful.

/<3

My dear you do not deserve insults.

You encapsulate what everyone should be doing, playing with their reality and you are doing it, so far as to even show disdain for the universe and God.

I think you have a lot of power in you and you are clever enough to know it and include us all in your game and I thank you for that for you have been refreshing and entertaining.

I think you are going to have a great and very entertaining life, you have moxie girl and are doing what you want regardless of people's views.

I bet you are sitting there laughing.

Love and light

Nic

[Karanime]

Originally Posted by Dharma

Err it doesn't. You permit this. And since you won't move from the point of stuckness inside you, it keeps repeating... he keeps holding on... you keep hitting him with your barbed tongue... and it goes on and on. Feel good yet?

Have you realized the poor boy is you? And every insult you say to him is said to you? This is an externalized presentation of how you treat yourself inside. Maybe you're asking yourself to stop the internal name calling, and the self-rejection, because you will still love yourself anyway.

This is brilliant. I forgot about this kind of projection. Yet another wake-up call. Thanks.

/<3

[nicbrahms]

Originally Posted by Karanime

This is brilliant. I forgot about this kind of projection. Yet another wake-up call. Thanks.

/<3

Lol