manifesting a loan from a mean man

[WordKeeper]

My bank account is riding low. I have not income currently. I have two low cost entry businesses in the shoot almost ready to go.

I have a wealthy father and would like to borrow some money from him to get me through this lean period until I am generating an income.

He is a mean man and has been diagnosed with a number of diseases out of DSMIV including NPD, OCD, Bi-polar, ADD ....

He taught me as a young child that "if you ask for something the answer is, 'No.'"

My mother is also wealthy. She won't help because she is afraid that she will not have enough. She had enough before her sister died and left her enough money so that her wealth doubled.

Both of my parents are in their late 70s and in ill health. My mother is leaving her money to her children. My father is not.

I am a chicken. I want to use I/M to generate the courage to ask my father for a loan to help me move into a self-sustaining state.

Wayne Dyer suggests that we imagine ourselves at the end of our desires and hold onto and nurture that feeling. I would like to do that. For some reason the feeling of fear is a hard one to shake.

Just talking out loud.

[Angela]

If you were to believe that I am mean and mentally ill and you ask me for money, I'm pretty sure I would advise you to go jump in a lake.

Yes, even if you don't say so out loud. Those sorts of beliefs tend to get communicated nonverbally. Fear would be an appropriate emotion, because there is a chance I might squash you like a bug, figuratively speaking, if you were to come to me with that attitude.

On the other hand, if you were to view me with compassion (not pity) and see me as someone who was really brilliant at building internal and external resources, and you were to come to me with gratitude and confidence and ask me for some help in building internal or external resources, I would be delighted to share myself with you. I might even be open to your suggestion about a business arrangement, if you were clever enough to think about and communicate to me how you think it might benefit ME, and not only yourself.

[Angela]

p.s... why don't you ask your mom instead?

[WordKeeper]

I would be delighted to share myself with you. I might even be open to your suggestion about a business arrangement, if you were clever enough to think about and communicate to me how you think it might benefit ME, and not only yourself.

Nice, feel good words. Have you spent much time with the mentally ill and personality disorders in particular? It might change your perspective.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by WordKeeper

Nice, feel good words. Have you spent much time with the mentally ill and personality disorders in particular? It might change your perspective.

Do you mean that you are right and I am wrong about someone who is mentally ill or has a personality disorder? Because you may be right, but what I'm talking about is getting the results you want. If you approach a person with the attitude that they are mentally ill or disordered, and that they are mean, I just don't see you as being in a prime position to get what you want -- in this case, for him to loan you money.

To answer your question, I have spent lots of time around people who have had such diagnoses, yes. Lots of personal experimentation in this regard! My experience is that I (and they) get better results when I believe they are magnificent and limitless human beings, as opposed to when I believe that who they are is ill or disordered or mean or a douchebag.

A person may be doing behaviors that look mean or douchebaggy, but that doesn't mean anything about Who He Is. It only means a limitation for ME on what kind of results I'm likely to get. Do you see what I mean?

[WordKeeper]

Not really Angela - I think it sounds all nice and happy but is somewhat naive and not helpful.

It is not about "I am right and you are wrong" from either side here but about one experience is not a "fits all" rule.

My point is really that you are not able to hear me or stand in my shoes on this one. But it has certainly shifted the conversation from my original post.

[StacyT]

I would say to just manifest the money and don't worry about where it comes from. Make it come from a source of bliss.

[WordKeeper]

hmmm.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by WordKeeper

My point is really that you are not able to hear me or stand in my shoes on this one. But it has certainly shifted the conversation from my original post.

Really? I don't see it that way. I see you as wanting money and self-sustenance, seeing a potential source (your dad), and thinking that courage is the way to get what you want. I'd like to see you get what you want. I think that's pretty much on topic.

I think Dr. Wayne Dyer would probably agree with me that you're not going to have much luck in changing the external (your dad), but you have infinite power in changing yourself.

And one really easy thing to change is your attitudes and beliefs -- it's an easy, effective way to transform who another person is for you, and thereby change your whole way of being with that person. And vice-versa! When you change who you're being with a person, you can transform who that person is for you.

If you're thinking of your dad as mean and sick, it makes sense to approach him with fear, and it makes it harder to generate courage -- one of the things you said you want.

And if you'd like to generate courage, abundance, and to receive resources from your dad, my point is that it would make sense to be those things for your dad -- be a source for him of courage, abundance, and resources. Be what you want to see. It looks like it boils down to: if you want him to believe in you, try believing in him.

The same approach would go with your mom, as well -- sounds like she's afraid of lack, and that's why you consider that she wouldn't loan you the money. If you were to take on being the source of what she wants -- feeling safe and abundant -- you might be really effective at influencing her to be feel safe and abundant about loaning you the money (and feeling confident that she still has enough.)

Or don't -- it's just something I've found works.

[WordKeeper]

hmmm.

[ns123]

Originally Posted by Angela

one really easy thing to change is your attitudes and beliefs -- it's an easy, effective way to transform who another person is for you, and thereby change your whole way of being with that person. And vice-versa! When you change who you're being with a person, you can transform who that person is for you.

This approach to the people in my life works for me too. It's more a gradual change over time though - as it is a gradual process for me to change how I see and relate to the other person.

But with my own parents, this has worked for me.

Another solution: you could get a temporary job instead of trying to find a way to get a loan from your dad. Or, you could also get a bank loan? Or ask a friend?

[CarolM]

Originally Posted by Angela

Do you mean that you are right and I am wrong about someone who is mentally ill or has a personality disorder? Because you may be right, but what I'm talking about is getting the results you want. If you approach a person with the attitude that they are mentally ill or disordered, and that they are mean, I just don't see you as being in a prime position to get what you want -- in this case, for him to loan you money.

To answer your question, I have spent lots of time around people who have had such diagnoses, yes. Lots of personal experimentation in this regard! My experience is that I (and they) get better results when I believe they are magnificent and limitless human beings, as opposed to when I believe that who they are is ill or disordered or mean or a douchebag.

A person may be doing behaviors that look mean or douchebaggy, but that doesn't mean anything about Who He Is. It only means a limitation for ME on what kind of results I'm likely to get. Do you see what I mean?

Personal experimentation with the mentally ill? How about this thought. We are no different than anyone else. We ARE the mentally ill. You're on the right track, but it sounds like you still see a separation. Why do we hold ourselves higher or different than anyone else? That is dualistic thinking. When we become one with all, then we're actually getting somewhere. Is an ant any less worthwhile or any different in this universe than the richest most powerful person, or a homeless man lying drunk on the sidewalk? Simple answer no.

To address the OP: Here's what I would do. Instead of seeing all the obstacles, just imagine yourself with the money in your hand/ or in your bank accounts paying for the busineses you want to start. Just vibe with it, and you will see it! Bring it into the NOW. Do I sound overly optimistic? Well, I have seen what most people would call miracles happen, and it was just that they vibed so perfectly with what they wanted, it came true. They actually vibed so much they could feel what they wanted in their hands. Believe it's already here...NOW. That's manifestation.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by CarolM

Personal experimentation with the mentally ill?

Ooops! A more careful reading of that post will let you see that I referred to personal experimentation with people who have been diagnosed with mental illness.

[CarolM]

Originally Posted by Angela

Ooops! A more careful reading of that post will let you see that I referred to personal experimentation with people who have been diagnosed with mental illness.

I dont' think I read that wrong. I still observed the separation. Just my opinion. But I fully accept your resistance to addressing what I wrote.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by CarolM

I dont' think I read that wrong. I still observed the separation. Just my opinion. But I fully accept your resistance to addressing what I wrote, rather than pointing out semantics.

Ohhhh, another semantics person! (Daffy, where are you?! )

I don't think you are understanding what I meant, but maybe that's because you think I don't understand what you meant.

No resistance to what you were saying: if I were judging a person as being mentally ill, and approaching him with that belief, you are right, there is a separation there -- a sense of being higher (or well) and him being lower (sick, broken, etc.) Same with a belief or attitude that someone is "mean." That's part of what I was saying earlier in this thread -- holding beliefs like that actually generate a feeling of separation, and it gets in the way of either of us getting the results we want. Does that jibe with what you're saying?

On the other hand, I was talking about having experience with people who have been diagnosed with mental illness. Just because a person (let's say, my mother) has been diagnosed as bi-polar, or another person (let's say, a boyfriend) has been diagnosed with ADHD, that doesn't require me to believe that the person is or has bi-polar or ADHD. See what I mean? It's acknowledging the "reality" that the person has had a doctor proclaim that the person is bi-polar or attention deficit, but that doesn't mean anything about the person hermself, and it sure doesn't mean anything about my belief that the person is limitless and magnificent.

By the way, isn't it interesting that doctors say that someone IS bi-polar, or that they ARE ADHD? Like the disease or disorder is the patient's identity. That's not how I see people. (But it's a good way to sell drugs!)

Now wait, why were we talking about this? Oh, yeah, it's because the OP asked me the direct question: "Have you spent much time with the mentally ill and personality disorders in particular?" and my answer was: I have spent time with people who have been diagnosed as such. And in my experience, the difference that makes a difference in relationship with people who have heard such diagnoses about themselves is to believe them to be limitless and magnificent, rather than reinforcing any beliefs about how they are sick or broken, either mine or their own.

Get what I mean?

[Lil Chris]

Angela is making a good point... Who determines what the reality is?

People can make a suggestion (eg. a doctor) but it's you who determines whether to observe it or not (to believe in the suggestion). Alot of times doctors can't even test for the diagnosis they suggest.

[CarolM]

Originally Posted by Angela

Ohhhh, another semantics person! (Daffy, where are you?! )

I don't think you are understanding what I meant, but maybe that's because you think I don't understand what you meant.

No resistance to what you were saying: if I were judging a person as being mentally ill, and approaching him with that belief, you are right, there is a separation there -- a sense of being higher (or well) and him being lower (sick, broken, etc.) Same with a belief or attitude that someone is "mean." That's part of what I was saying earlier in this thread -- holding beliefs like that actually generate a feeling of separation, and it gets in the way of either of us getting the results we want. Does that jibe with what you're saying?

On the other hand, I was talking about having experience with people who have been diagnosed with mental illness. Just because a person (let's say, my mother) has been diagnosed as bi-polar, or another person (let's say, a boyfriend) has been diagnosed with ADHD, that doesn't require me to believe that the person is or has bi-polar or ADHD. See what I mean? It's acknowledging the "reality" that the person has had a doctor proclaim that the person is bi-polar or attention deficit, but that doesn't mean anything about the person hermself, and it sure doesn't mean anything about my belief that the person is limitless and magnificent.

By the way, isn't it interesting that doctors say that someone IS bi-polar, or that they ARE ADHD? Like the disease or disorder is the patient's identity. That's not how I see people. (But it's a good way to sell drugs!)

Now wait, why were we talking about this? Oh, yeah, it's because the OP asked me the direct question: "Have you spent much time with the mentally ill and personality disorders in particular?" and my answer was: I have spent time with people who have been diagnosed as such. And in my experience, the difference that makes a difference in relationship with people who have heard such diagnoses about themselves is to believe them to be limitless and magnificent, rather than reinforcing any beliefs about how they are sick or broken, either mine or their own.

Get what I mean?

Yes, I surely get it. Thanks Hahaha I caught myself, I was going to say more, but I think that just gets people riled up. So I'll leave it at that. Have a great day

[Wax Frog]

Originally Posted by CarolM

Well, I have seen what most people would call miracles happen...

I'd very much like to read your take on what blocks or slows deliberate manifestation

[Diandra25]

let´s see:

i would only reach my Dad (if i were you), when in fact,i could really feel and know,that he is,in the end,just as perfect as you and everybody else.

i know a person with bipolar and he is adorable and kind - he shows me that when i look at him and see his goodness.

i can really see why you feel fear - but this is the hardest part - transforming fear into faith.

fear is energy misdirected . so you have to re-direct it or transmut it into faith.in this case,faith that you are with the money you desire.

faith that your father will loan you the money.

i am reading a wonderful book from florence scovel,avaiable free on e-book called the Game of Life.

if you read it you will understand so much more...believ me,I AM

repeat this when you feel ready and believe:"i cast this burden ( of lack of money)on Christ within,and i go free to have plenty". i say this a lot to myself,i am more and more faithfull in life.

this would be you affirming that your subcounscious ( Christ within) is impressed with plenty,not with lack.but this only works with a basis of Active Faith.always.

another thing which is very important is this:Love and forgiveness.

i bet that it might exist some issues between you and your dad,right?maybe you carry some resentment or sorrow,anything that makes you feel that he is not the one you love anymore,not in the way you loved him when you were a little girl?

maybe cause of the diseases he have,you see him like a being that is somehow "less"?

well,it is my deep belief that...love and forgiveness have the power over everything.and when in the moment you actually only feel love for him,for yourself,for all....and forgive all things...it is the moment you will actually see your desires fullfilled.

sorry for any mistake,i wished i could be as expressive as i am with my mother language...

[CarolM]

Originally Posted by Wax Frog

I'd very much like to read your take on what blocks or slows deliberate manifestation

Hey Wax Frog, thanks for asking.

Essentially I think we block or slow our manifestation. I wrote a bit about the process I learned in the "pink drumset" thread. I'll write more here. I think, the key in all our manifestations is actually figuring out what we want, and why we want it. Our wanting discovery will tell us a few things. "Is this right for me?" "Am I sure this is really what I want?" and the biggie...."Am I really ready for this in my life?" If we ask these questions and still come up with a resounding YES, then we are ready.

If we try to manifest 200 million dollars into our pockets overnight, could we really handle that kind of responsibility? I don't think it's a secret that people who come into big wealth very quickly usually end up losing it. e.g. lottery winners, overnight celebrities. They simply weren't ready for the responsibility of having that much money at once.

Or...how about this, an unemployed person says: "I want a brand new car! (fill in the blank with specifics)" Yet, they have no way of paying for the car payments on a new car, or the money needed to maintain a car, insure it, register it, or even the money to keep the tank filled with gas. Even if said person manifested a brand new car for free. There are still expenses involved. They may actually even manifest a dealership willing to give them a loan, but then what? How do they maintain the car if they don't have a job? I see that as a block or slowing down process on a big level. That person was not ready for a brand new car. See what I mean? I feel this...that the universe will give to you, when you are truly ready.

Yet another way we slow a manifestation down is by not making/creating space or allowing room for it to come into our lives. We want a new car, do we even have a place to park it? We want a new bf or gf. Look at your bed, (if you're looking for a sexual partner in a bf/gf). What is on the other side of your bed? Is it empty? Or is it covered with pillows or clothes or stuffed animals or books? Or is it ready for a new bf/gf? We can't sleep in the middle of the bed and expect anyone else to be next to us can we? We must make room for what we are asking for or it slows the manifestation down. "Where can we put this new car or bf or gf?" the universe wonders, ..."Well, we'll just wait until that person finds some room for what they want." Files the manifestation away under "NOT READY". The manifestation is already HERE, ready, waiting...for us to accept it, and that means creating space for it.

I think doubt, and lack of faith, can be an interference in slowing down a manifestation too. Letting our resonation waiver at all with what we are trying to manifest is doubt. We have to listen carefully to our inner self our inner voice, is there still that little voice inside saying, "this can't happen", "this isn't real". Or even worse, is it not believing we deserve what we are asking for.

So if we are trying and trying and nothing comes, then we must find out why. Could it be that we didn't even have enough faith in ourselves, the universe, or the process of manifestation to allow it to come? Questioning, at all, after we have put it out to the universe to provide us with what we want, will slow down the vibration. With each dip in vibration caused by lack of faith, doubt, not being ready, not creating space for what we want, or feeling that we don't deserve, we slow our manifestations down from coming to us. Keeping ourselves at a higher level of conciousness is where we must be to manifest. There is little chance imo of manifesting perfectly in the 3rd dimension. 'Half manifestations', or 'almost manifestations', or 'hey it was pretty close manifestations', like the approved car loan, but no way to pay the monthly payments, is an example of that. The higher our conciousness, the more we can manifest, the faster they appear, the more perfect our manifestations are.

If we have carefully explored our wants, and we know we are ready, and we are on a perfect vibrational level with said want, and we can literally FEEL what we want in our lives right NOW, it will be ours. There is no other way for it to be, but HERE for us. Now. Imagine what happens when we bust out of the 3D and start working in 4D or 5D or higher!

Look around at nature, at the universe, it IS abundance, and so it will be in your life. The universe is brimming with everything you could ever dream possible. If you want it, really want it. Be prepared.

I hope this made sense.

[Wax Frog]

Originally Posted by CarolM

I hope this made sense.

Yep! It fits well with tips I've picked up so far.

[WordKeeper]

Diandre - I find a number of your points very interesting. I would like to address a few.

You wrote, "i know a person with bipolar and he is adorable and kind - he shows me that when i look at him and see his goodness."

I have no doubt that people who have been diagnosed can be adorable and kind that does not mean that ALL such people are.

Lil Chris writes "Who determines what the reality is?

People can make a suggestion (eg. a doctor) but it's you who determines whether to observe it or not (to believe in the suggestion). Alot of times doctors can't even test for the diagnosis they suggest. "

I think we have a different concept of reality. My father does not believe the suggestions made by the doctor. And though it is true that alot of times doctors can't even test for the diagnosis there now exists marvelous scanning technology (PET scans and fMRI) can actually show the brain functioning and demonstrate a correlation with specific behaviors and brain function. These are magnificent innovations that could make it possible to relieve horrendous suffering.

Diandre, you write, "i bet that it might exist some issues between you and your dad,right?maybe you carry some resentment or sorrow,anything that makes you feel that he is not the one you love anymore,not in the way you loved him when you were a little girl?

maybe cause of the diseases he have,you see him like a being that is somehow "less"?"

You are right that I carry some resentments and pain but I do not see him as "less" in any form. I do, however, see his behavior as harmful and dangerous and I am cognizant that I prefer to protect myself and my son from his destructive and self-destructive tirades.

I subscribe to your belief that forgiveness can be transformational. My favorite book about forgiveness is "Forgiving Dead Man Walking" in which the author describes her experience as a victim of a horrid crime and her damaging life in a state of unforgiveness. But when she found her way to forgive the perpetrator of the crime she made it clear that such forgiveness did not mean that she would put herself in physical danger of that person and she still held that forgiveness did not absolve this person of responsibility nor consequences for his actions. That is the forgiveness to which I subscribe - one that frees me from the poison of unforgiveness.

But forgiveness is a complex process. Think about the Austrian woman who was kept prisoner in her own home by her father who raped her and produced 7 children by her over 25 years. While I would without question hold that forgiveness would be essential for healing in her case I do not believe for one moment that forgiveness could be a simple event - spoken, said, complete but rather a complex and sordid process with bumps and pain and agonizing shuffling and sorting. I often sense that "forgiveness" is thrown about as though it is a pillow to be caught or thrown away, as in "I have forgiveness" oh no "I lost forgiveness". Forgiveness is far less concrete and far more abstract and amorphous in my experience.

You also write:
"faith that your father will loan you the money.
repeat this when you feel ready and believe:"i cast this burden ( of lack of money)on Christ within,and i go free to have plenty". i say this a lot to myself,i am more and more faithfull in life."

I connect with this and will begin to live this belief today.

You also write:
"i am reading a wonderful book from florence scovel,avaiable free on e-book called the Game of Life.
if you read it you will understand so much more...believ me,I AM "

How can I not?

Angela - I don't think it is your philosophy as a whole that irritates me but the tone. I write that not to start an argument but simply to offer a suggestion about your approach. You clearly have something to offer but your wording made your gift unaccessable to me. I also maintain that you have not yet fully heard me because what you had to say was more important to you than hearing what I was saying.

Waxy - where did you come from? You always ask or say the right thing. How you do dat?

[Wax Frog]

Originally Posted by WordKeeper

Waxy - where did you come from? You always ask or say the right thing. How you do dat?

I'm always on the lookout for posters or topics that resonate with me; also, I guess everyone here is pretty much looking for the same answers... Or maybe it's just that we-are-all-One thing

[Kanzeon]

I'm sorry your parents aren't generous.

But, if they were to loan you money - would you be able to pay it back?

Is there anything you've done to earn the money? Is there anything you can offer them in exchange?

If not, then the money isn't yours, and never will be, whether you manifest, visualize, intend, etc. Money comes from work. Find a way to get by that doesn't include relying on people who are unreliable, then outgrow the need.

[wellbeing]

WordKeeper, I hope one or both of your upcoming businesses rely on your asking thought-provoking questions because, if they are, (seeing what you've provoked here) they are sure to be resounding successes!

But to your question:

Originally Posted by WordKeeper

...I want to use I/M to generate the courage to ask my father for a loan to help me move into a self-sustaining state.

Wayne Dyer suggests that we imagine ourselves at the end of our desires and hold onto and nurture that feeling. I would like to do that.....

I wonder if it might better serve you to broaden your intention to starting your businesses and having the cash and resources flow to you so that you are comfortable during your businesses (short) start-up phases. To me, this is what you really want, if I understand your situation correctly. Your parents are, as I read your post, merely your most obvious sources of your desired cash and resources.

One of the reasons why I-M/LOA teachers ask us to focus on the achievement of our desires is so that we are in a position to allow our desires to come to us via any avenues, including those we had not been able to previously see.

I am reminded of the old story of a supremely religious man, who was trapped on the roof of his house during a flood that had wiped out all as far as his eye can see. He prayed to his deity, "God, I have been a devout man and have served you all my life. Save me from this flood and I will redouble my service to you." As he was praying, an empty row boat lazily floated by, close to the roof on which he was perched.

The sun was blazing down on him and the man was not in strong health but he continued to pray with all his might, entreating his deity to save him. Another boat floated by, grazing his roof. And the man prayed and bargained on, even though the bright sun was parching him and sapping his life force. He prayed, with his dying breaths, while a 3rd boat floated by, bumped into his roof and floated away on the currents.

The man died on that roof and, afterwards, had an opportunity to meet his deity. The first question he asked was "Why didn't you save me?" To which his deity replied, "I sent 3 boats; what more were you expecting?"

I would wonder if, by focusing on your parents and their resources, you might be less open to other manifestations your intentions may produce.

I believe another reason for Dr. Dyer's suggestion is so that we can immerse ourselves in the high vibration of achieving our desires. Those high vibrations are said to energize our intentions in order to attract them to us and bring them into manifestation. When our intentions and their vibrations become "diluted" by our stresses, fears, etc., their manifestation becomes delayed or "distorted" by these troublesome feelings. By focusing on the manifestation as completed, we get to "skip over" these distracting feelings.

If you do explore a solution via your parents, imagining that your solution comes to you with surprising ease and in perfect order (especially contrary to what you're currently imagining) will help your explorations along this path.

[WordKeeper]

mmm Kanzeon - some money comes from work but not all. Some money comes from gifts! Some money comes from happenstance! Sources of money can be quite varied - only limited by imagination.

Loans have some amount of risk - some riskier than others. In the free market - the higher the risk the greater the payback. But there are no universal rules about loans - the rules are usually made between those borrowing and lending. Some types of loans are governed by laws but not all and even those governed by laws still have room for variations to be agreed on by lender and borrower.

"Find a way to get by that doesn't include relying on people who are unreliable, then outgrow the need. "
Great idea.

We-are-All-one thing Waxy. That's nice.

[Angela]

Originally Posted by WordKeeper

You clearly have something to offer but your wording made your gift unaccessable to me. I also maintain that you have not yet fully heard me because what you had to say was more important to you than hearing what I was saying.

Me and your dad both! (the unaccessible gift problem )

It sure is true -- some people don't like my tone, and they don't get what I give because of it, and that's fine. I read something today that I found interesting: "Rich people are good receivers; poor people are bad receivers." That's what I was trying to say earlier: pegging your dad in your thoughts (he's mean, mentally ill, and his answer is "no") doesn't mean anything about HIM -- it only closes you off from being a good receiver of the resources that he might be able to give.

I think the same thing happened for you with me; and I'm sorry if you feel bad about what I've said, but not sorry for what I've said. Sometimes the most valuable advice comes from the most irritating sources. And sometimes money does, too!

It's not your dad's meanness or mental illness, or my wording, that makes gifts unaccessible to you -- it's your thoughts about these things that make gifts unaccessible to you. Basing your ability to receive on what other people are doing, saying, or being is a great way to cut yourself off from abundance. And if you can train yourself to be a good receiver, you'll be wealthy as all get out!

Good luck to you!

[WordKeeper]

WordKeeper, I hope one or both of your upcoming businesses rely on your asking thought-provoking questions because, if they are, (seeing what you've provoked here) they are sure to be resounding successes!

LOL Wellbeing. That is lovely.

One of the reasons why I-M/LOA teachers ask us to focus on the achievement of our desires is so that we are in a position to allow our desires to come to us via any avenues, including those we had not been able to previously see.

Very nice. I get it.

I am reminded of the old story of a supremely religious man, who was trapped on the roof of his house during a flood

Very good reminder.

I would wonder if, by focusing on your parents and their resources, you might be less open to other manifestations your intentions may produce.

I think that my focus on my parents and their resources is a reflection of where I am stuck. I recognize that my stuckedness came from aspects of our relationship that existed over a period of time - that my sense of scarcity was a complex lesson that I accepted as a price of "belonging" to family and that had I at any age understood that I could have made a different choice. Now is as good as any time to make that choice - to accept abundance even if it is NOT sanctioned by family.

My stuckedness and "need" to be helped by parents is from blocked energy from childhood and young adulthood. Now I have to navigate a different path.

I see how I got here. I know there is information here shining the light on the path out. I'm still struggling to pick my foot up and take that step. Inertia I think. Not fear - some part teenaged tantrum I suspect - you know, "It's not fair." Time to pick up my baggage and tap into my determination and relentless persistance, set my goal for self-sufficiency, self-determination and abundance.

Boy am I glad this is anonymous. Hard to work this stuff out in public - ya know? But then - it is precisely that I am not alone here, precisely due to the input here - that I am able to see a shadow of the path forward. This is not easy for me but I am sensing the the burden is being shared by some here, making this transition possible. For that I am greatful.

[Kanzeon]

Originally Posted by Angela

Me and your dad both! (the unaccessible gift problem )

It sure is true -- some people don't like my tone, and they don't get what I give because of it, and that's fine. I read something today that I found interesting: "Rich people are good receivers; poor people are bad receivers." That's what I was trying to say earlier: pegging your dad in your thoughts (he's mean, mentally ill, and his answer is "no") doesn't mean anything about HIM -- it only closes you off from being a good receiver of the resources that he might be able to give.

I think the same thing happened for you with me; and I'm sorry if you feel bad about what I've said, but not sorry for what I've said. Sometimes the most valuable advice comes from the most irritating sources. And sometimes money does, too!

It's not your dad's meanness or mental illness, or my wording, that makes gifts unaccessible to you -- it's your thoughts about these things that make gifts unaccessible to you. Basing your ability to receive on what other people are doing, saying, or being is a great way to cut yourself off from abundance. And if you can train yourself to be a good receiver, you'll be wealthy as all get out!

Good luck to you!

I don't get this. Obviously, the father chooses whether he wants to give money or make a loan. Whatever his mental state, attitude or illness is, it is the largest part of why he hasn't helped.

You can certainly try to influence him - be nice to him, make him a partner in a new venture, try to heal old wounds, etc. But it's his money: he decides what to do with it.

There isn't any "receiving" or mental adjustment that will change that. It's two people, interacting. It would be nice if he were supportive, but if he is not, that isn't anyone's fault but his.

This whole thread is pretty weird. I don't know why I would want a gift from someone mentally ill. I'd want to help them, not manipulate them. I wouldn't expect to change someone who I thought was mentally ill - people who are mentally ill find it much harder to change behaviors than the rest of us, and it is plenty hard for almost all of us. Be kind to him, express the need, try to give him benefit: then move on.

[WordKeeper]

Whew Angela - I can't quite cut through the packaging of your offering. It seems to be encapsulated in a bitter covering. You seem to want to cram your "gift" down my throat and expect me to be thankful. Your self-satisfied smugness is not palatable nor is it a gift regardless of what you call it.

Me and your dad both!

Yes - you and my father both.

A gift comes without strings. I respectfully decline your offer.