Fat cells and Total Body Water

[Cantando]

Are there any experts out there who know about fat cells and total body water, as I find this area a bit confusing?
Is it true that the number of fat cells remains constant in our bodies? I read that it does, then I read something that said we can still create new fat cells. So, which is true?
Are fat cells mainly water and when they expand, it is just with more water?
I have been using weighing scales for a few years that show body fat percentage and total body water. I have noticed that the higher the body fat, the lower the total body water (and vice versa), which seems odd if fat is mainly water.
I know it would be a silly thing to do, but if I stopped drinking liquids for a few days, would my body go into survival mode and start using the water stored in my fat cells?

[Uplift]

Tom Venuto is devoted to the study of body fat. Check him out, always presenting and assessing the latest findings, all sides of the arguments. Fanatical, but fanatics are usually experts in their field.

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by Uplift

Tom Venuto is devoted to the study of body fat. Check him out, always presenting and assessing the latest findings, all sides of the arguments. Fanatical, but fanatics are usually experts in their field.

Thanks, I'll check him out.

[Minsc]

Your fat cells don't contain much water...

[WilliWibald]

Hi Catando,

I'm no expert on fat-cells, but I think I read in a book about loosing weight, that you can only decrease the size of the fat-cells and not the number of fat-cells. But when gaining extreme amounts of weight you can increase the number of fat cells.
This seems to be a very mean one way function. And that is why people who once were very obese have a harder time keeping their weight under control than people who were always slim, because they have so many fat-cells that scream for more food than the slender guys.
But that is just what I read.

[Matthew Shea]

I don't have any one reference, unfortunately, but, after spending time on Google, it seems that the body can get rid of excess fat cells, but it's very reluctant to do so (survival instincts). Most weight loss seems to be from a reduction in the amount of fat stored in existing cells. The best way to burn off that fat is to engage in exercise for extended periods, that is more than 20 - 30 minutes at a time, since that's how long it takes for your body to switch from using sugars as fuel to using its fat stores. Strength training is also essential since the added muscle will use more of the existing fat for energy.

[Cantando]

Thanks guys.
I think I was confused because I thought the fat cell itself was fat, but it contains fat (triaglycerol) along with various other chemicals and toxins.
Jogging and sweating can help release the toxins - these may include remains of drugs taken years before, apparently, which can still adversely affect you.
If anything, I tend to drink too little. I've been drinking more water the last few days and my body fat percentage has gone down by 1% and my total body water up by 2%.
Also, one trick for cutting down the hunger pangs when I get home from work is to drink a glass of water containing 3 teaspoons of psyllium husk (indigestible fibre) followed by a pint of orange squash. That bloats me up for a while and stops me from raiding the fridge!

[Matthew Shea]

I'd also suggest eating some raw veggies as snacks mid-morning and mid-afternoon. I use carrots, broccoli and celery to help stave off the hunger. They're very high in fiber and low in calories. It sounds like you're on the right track, though.

Regarding the toxins stored with the fat, I haven't heard that before. It sounds possible, though, but I very much doubt that such toxins would be released in any significant quantity at any given time. I'd also expect your liver and kidneys to have no trouble getting rid that. I did hear that fat itself can generate chemicals known to cause inflammation in the body, which is a good reason to get rid of it.

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by Matthew Shea

I'd also suggest eating some raw veggies as snacks mid-morning and mid-afternoon. I use carrots, broccoli and celery to help stave off the hunger. They're very high in fiber and low in calories. It sounds like you're on the right track, though.

Thanks. I'll give the raw veg a go, though the broccoli may take a bit of getting used to!
I also drink tomato juice rather than orange or apple, which contain lots more sugar. Tomato contains lycopene which is supposed to be good for the prostate.
I'm trying to lose 6 pounds over the next 3 weeks before I go on holiday to Italy, and put it all back on again, and more!

[openeyes]

Originally Posted by Matthew Shea

Regarding the toxins stored with the fat, I haven't heard that before. It sounds possible, though, but I very much doubt that such toxins would be released in any significant quantity at any given time.

Except during rapid weight loss, such as fasting. Hence as one's body becomes cleaner fasting gets easier. Fat sequesters toxins to take them out of general circulation in the body. Fasting/weight loss reintroduces them into circulation to be removed from the body for good.

As for water, it makes up 70-75% of muscles, and only 10% of fat.

Sports Nutrition: Fuel Movement & Sport

Regarding number of fat cells, "when fat cells have expanded to their maximum size, they can divide, thus producing an increase in the actual number of fat cells". "People with extra fat cells may be able to shrink these cells and get great results, but since their fat cells don't just disappear, they tend to regain lost weight rapidly if they're not careful. Those "insidious little sponges" are just waiting to be fed, so it takes some real commitment and care to keep the weight off permanently."

Fat Cells: Is the Amount You Have Predetermined?

[escapee]

In contrary with popular opinion, You can kill those adipose fat cells with polyunsaturated fats (Found abundantly in unprocessed seed, nuts and animal foods) , natural saturated fats and protein easily. RESULT IS GUARANTEED BY ME


Landmarks in Nutrition & Health

1. Glucose is not the body’s preferred energy source; fatty acids are. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pages: 29, 145, 203, 272, 357.

2. Excess carbohydrate [more than 4-5 ounces] prevents the body from burning fat and increases stored body fat. Textbook of Medical Physiology, pages 871, 936; Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pages 24, 394.

3. Fat does not burn in “flame of carbohydrates.” Stryer’s Biochemistry, 4th Edition, pages 612, 638.

4. Humans cannot utilize fructose [sugar] from more than 2 pieces of fruit at a time. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pg. 404.

5. Carbohydrates cause insulin levels to reach 10-15 times normal and stay elevated for 2-3 hours. Textbook of Medical Physiology, pg. 977.

6. Eating carbohydrate slows the metabolism; fat and protein digestion increase metabolism. Textbook of Medical Physiology, pg. 908.

7. Adipose tissue [fat] is stored only when eating carbohydrates. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, page. 510, Voet's Biochemistry, page 790 and Principles of Medical Biochemistry, page 372.

8. Hospital patients are not allowed more than 7 tsp of sugar per hour, yet Americans are told by the U.S. government [food pyramid] and nutritionists to eat up to 20 tsp sugar at each meal: breakfast, lunch, and dinner! Body Fluids and Electrolytes, pages: 71-72.

9. Adding extra glucose [sugar] to muscle will not make it work faster. Nutrition for Fitness and Sport, pg. 95.

10. One glass of orange juice [6 tsp sugar] provides the energy to run 1 mile. [But goes to body fat if not used immediately!] Nutrition for Fitness and Sport, pg. 59.

11. Sugar [carbohydrate] stops the body from producing growth hormone. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pg. 702.

12. Poly cystic ovary disorder [becoming rampant in young women] is associated with insulin resistance [the result of overeating carbohydrates and trans fats]. Harrison’s Principles of Internal Medicine, 13th Edition.

13. Cellulose [fiber] cannot be digested by humans. Essentials of Biochemistry, pg 185.

14. Cholesterol is necessary for the lipid bi layer of cells. Molecular Biology of the Cell, pg. 481.

15. “Bad cholesterol” [LDL] is produced from carbohydrates. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pages: 25-26, 512.

16. Insulin production in response to consuming carbohydrate, raises cholesterol levels. Basic Medical Biochemistry, pages: 475, 566.

17. Minerals are non-protein co-factors that allow enzymes to work. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pg. 109.

18. Niacin is not bio available [not usable by your body] from grains. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pg. 16.

19. Stomach acid requires chloride from salt. Body Fluids and Electrolytes, pages: 20-22.

20. Butter is used directly for energy. Textbook of Medical Physiology, pg. 843.

21. Protein is GOOD for the KIDNEYS. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach, pg. 653.

22. All cells, regardless of specialized function, oxidize fuels. Essentials of Biochemistry, pg 7.

23. Polyunsaturated fats naturally support healthy blood cholesterol levels. Textbook of Medical Physiology, pg. 873.

24. Colloids [including colloidal minerals] are held in the vascular blood system [not used at the cellular level]. Body Fluids and Electrolytes, pages: 62-63.

25. Vitamin B12 can only come from animal sources. Essentials of Biochemistry, pg. 348.

26. Brain synapses have higher levels of DHA than most tissues. Nutrition and the Brain, Vol. 8, 1990:2.

27. Vision-related problems can occur when too many trans fats are consumed. Essential Fatty Acids and Eicosanoids, 1992, pages: 107-115; Invest. Opthalmol. Vision Science, 1992, 33(11): 3242-3253.

28. 60%-70% of protein eaten is used to fuel the energy of digestion; only 30%-40% is left for body structure — like muscles — and system function — like enzyme production. Basic Medical Biochemistry - A Clinical Approach.

29. “Experts were quoting data based on inaccurate research. I never pay attention to ‘experts.’” Richard Feynman, Nobel Prize-winner: physics, A Life in Science, pg 167.

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by escapee

In contrary with popular opinion, You can kill those adipose fat cells with polyunsaturated fats (Found abundantly in unprocessed seed, nuts and animal foods) , natural saturated fats and protein easily. ]

Some of those claims and statements sound quite interesting. I'll look a bit more into it.
How odd, that our bodies have been used to natural foods for thousands of years, and now, in the last 50 years or so, we have been polluting them with deep fried rubbish which never existed before. How smart and clever and advanced we think we are, yet we cram poisons and fat into ourselves and our children every day, then we wonder why we are overweight and suffering from a myriad of diseases like cancer and diabetes.
But, as usual, it's down to money. If the food companies can get away with it and make a profit, they will.

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by Cantando

But, as usual, it's down to money. If the food companies can get away with it and make a profit, they will.

Oops! Quick edit: plus our own will power to decide whether to eat their junk or not!

[Keith]

Originally Posted by Cantando

Oops! Quick edit: plus our own will power to decide whether to eat their junk or not!

I think Anthony Robbins is right when he indicates that will power is less important than taking conscious control of our conditioning.

Like Steve pointed out in his Self-Discipline series, Willpower is a short-term tool. You can't rely on it alone to achieve long-term goals.

P.S. Yes, I cite a lot of people - they've generously gone to the trouble of packaging up my thoughts in such neat words.

[Cantando]

Originally Posted by Keith

I think Anthony Robbins is right when he indicates that will power is less important than taking conscious control of our condition.

But don't we need will power to take conscious control of our condition? By will power, I suppose I mean, like telling myself, "Yes, I will get up now and do it", whatever "it" may be.

[Uplift]

Escapees' post deserves attention. Fat is an essential part of our diet. All Indigenous cultures know how to get oils in their diet. Eliminating fat from the diet is disastrous. An emergency situation which affects metabolism and hormone profiles. Fats are essential as are amino acids.

[Keith]

Originally Posted by Cantando

But don't we need will power to take conscious control of our condition? By will power, I suppose I mean, like telling myself, "Yes, I will get up now and do it", whatever "it" may be.

Sorry, my brain misfired - that should've been conscious control of our conditioning.

Ads in particular are created by experts at creating particular neuro-associations. The best time to resist their influence is while they're being initially implanted.

[ZoFlies]

Originally Posted by Cantando

Are there any experts out there who know about fat cells and total body water, as I find this area a bit confusing?
Is it true that the number of fat cells remains constant in our bodies? I read that it does, then I read something that said we can still create new fat cells. So, which is true?
Are fat cells mainly water and when they expand, it is just with more water?
I have been using weighing scales for a few years that show body fat percentage and total body water. I have noticed that the higher the body fat, the lower the total body water (and vice versa), which seems odd if fat is mainly water.
I know it would be a silly thing to do, but if I stopped drinking liquids for a few days, would my body go into survival mode and start using the water stored in my fat cells?

I don't know about water in fat cells. I'll tell you what I do know.

Your body stops producing fat cells in your mid teenage years. After that - you're stuck with what you've got. What happens is the number of fat cells that you have will then get larger or smaller. So even when you loose a ton of weight you don't loose fat cells, the fat cells simply get smaller in size. If someone wanted to have a smaller number of fat cells they would go and have some removed (ie liposuction - but I don't recommend this)

Peace.