stumped - figuring how my body works - lost ten lbs in 12 hours

[DerekMB]

It happens to me a lot actually. The few times that I mentioned it to someone they disbelieve. Sister too. She's a nurse and wouldn't believe me. Read about some other guy who's a ufc fighter (What I also want to do) who managed to lose 10 lbs in a day but only after some really intense and serious training... Where it happens to me whether I want it to or not.

Last night when I weighed I was at 139 (omg ate so much food yesterday) . When I woke up this morning I used the bathroom and weighed myself again: 135

Did my morning stretches after I got read and then did a few miles on a ten speed and then went to work.

I usually try to eat breakfast in the morning, but it's usually hard to keep solids down that early as I start my workout almost immediately after I wake up so I tend to drink liquids.

first 2-3 hours after waking I ate:

-Coffee (about 60 ca. w/ sugar & cream)

-marathon energy bar (210 Ca.)

-about (~) 6 oz of energy drink (~100ca?),

-1 scoop creatine/arginine/supplement mix (150 ca),

-gatorade (200 ca)

After that I had lunch about 5 hours after waking. By this time the physical part of my job is over with (20-80 lbs, w/ 40-50 lbs being avg. weight picked up of regular lifting, throwing, moving, etc...)

-I don't know how many calories was the casserole but I would say about 300-400 (potatoes , broccoli, cauliflower, some egg, tuna, & cheese)

-2 cookies (100 ca. each)

-O.J. (130 ca.)

-1 kiwi (~100 Ca.)

After that I took my last break (about 7 hours after waking) and ate:

-3 cookies (100 ca. each)

-mt. dew (130 ca. If I remember)

After work I did another few hours on the ten speed and ate some more:

-2 cookies (100 ca)

-low fat yogurt (120 ca.)

Then I decided to hop on the scale to see where I was at. Surprised the hell out of me (Always does) but I was only at 131. I usually consume between 4000-6000 calories a day, depending on what I'm doing. Generally the more active I am, the less I eat but usually not less than 4k, 2000 in the first part of the day (All the above listed) and another 2000 in the second half. Basically I don't even understand how it is possible that I could have burned off so much weight though. Even if I discount 4-5 lbs for liquids that I pissed out, that still leaves another 5 lbs worth of weight that "miraculously" dissappeared?! This is so frustrating to me as my goal is to reach another 5-10 lbs of muscle. So I don't understand why the heck can't I keep my weight up. Guessing this has a lot to do with my metabolism, which I unfortunately understand very little so if anyone can offer some advice or tips that would be very helpful to me. & here is the link to the ufc guy I mentioned earlier: How To Lose 10 Lbs. In A Day | Dan's Muay Thai MMA

His body type is very similar to mine but he weighs about 10lbs more. How can I get like him more? The most common weight I read on the scale is 133 or 134 and I've never seen it below 129. I feel like I am gaining weight but just extremely slowly (5 oz weight in a month is considered a good month for me- currently about 4 mo. been training like this). On top of everything else I mentioned I workout about another 30 min to 2 hours or so every couple of days, doing more/longer depending on how I feel (Energy levels, if any injuries, etc...) In the days that I don't do muscle workouts I gorge myself. I didn't count my calories yesterday but it was probably anywhere between 5000-8000. I'd say right about 7k if I had to guess. I also do bone conditioning but have only recently started getting more serious with it. so any ideas, tips, suggestions, advice etc... ? Oh, and I'm 5'8"

[joelr]

The weight you lost was water. I've seen people burn over 20lbs in 1 day of water.

Bodybuilders on a mass phase eat about 1.5 grams of protein per lb of lean body weight, spread out over the day. You might need about ~150 gr protein per day.

Trying to gain weight while doing TRIPLE CARDIO is impossible.
Your doing morning cardio, cardio at work then cardio at night?? That's like a pre-contest cardio plan.

How are you going to build muscles on cookies and soda? Every time you eat it should be a protein/carb/fat mix. Like a protein shake, handful of almonds and a bagel or 2. Each of the 6 meals you should have every day should have 25 gr protein, plenty of complex carbs and some fat. For mass gaining a liberal amount of healthy fats helps quite a bit. It keeps your body anabolic.
Besides more red meat I will add 1T of flax oil to my shakes and my tuna/rice meal gets 1T olive oil or more

On mass phases bodybuilders usually go light on the cardio for a while. Every other day. But if your job is very physical that should be plenty while you spend some time gaining weight.

Bodies don't really want to add extra muscle or lose fat. It takes daily motivation and effort. The workout part is easy, the real effort is eating what you need to.

Concentrate on eating the maximum amount of protein/carb/fat before you start adding sweets and candy. That stuff doesn't help much with muscle gain but it's great for fat gain. If you're eating enough to gain mass then you will be slightly overeating as it is (some fat gain) so adding desserts just increases that. Then when it's time to cut down some of the fat it makes it that much more work.

[ginkgo]

You said that you woke up, used the bathroom and weighed yourself. Maybe you should take the time to weigh yourself before and after bathroom. Feces or stool contains a lot of water.

You can try weighing yourself before and after an enema. Now if the difference is 10 pounds, then that means that you were full of it. Full of what? Full of it.

[Michelle]

Just out of curiosity, does your mood fluctuate in accordance with your weight loss?

[DerekMB]

Originally Posted by Michelle

Just out of curiosity, does your mood fluctuate in accordance with your weight loss?

Not that I have noticed, why?





joelr:

1. some of the weight I lost was water and some of it wasnt

2. I've been doing what you term "Triple cardio" for months and have in fact gained weight/muscle, just not very much. (I would state though that my strength has increased drastically)

3. Cookies and soda are good for carbs, the bodies main source of energy. Nothing wrong with a few cookies and I find it ridiculous that you would imply as such. Furthermore, I get more than enough of my daily vitamins, minerals, prophenols, antioxidants, etc... I do it all. And did you fully read what I wrote before you responded, because it doesn't seem like it and you come off as somewhat rude in your post. Hopefully I am mistaken somehow.

[rei]

i am curious how you would know how much weight was water and how much wasn't? is there some type of test one can use to know this with confidence?

[joelr]

Originally Posted by DerekMB

joelr:

1. some of the weight I lost was water and some of it wasnt

Fat and muscle do not drop off that fast. It's possible 1 lb or less was fat. There is also water IN your muscles that can be lost. There is no way to tell the difference 100% without a floataion tank so the obvious must be assumed. That's how it is no matter how much you want to have lost fat that fast.

Originally Posted by DerekMB

2. I've been doing what you term "Triple cardio" for months and have in fact gained weight/muscle, just not very much. (I would state though that my strength has increased drastically)

Whatever. You said you want to know how to gain weight FASTER, it's known in the bodybuilding world that too much cardio slows that process down. I'm giving you that information to help you, not so you can nit pick me. I think you may have even said you were "stumped"??

Originally Posted by DerekMB

3. Cookies and soda are good for carbs, the bodies main source of energy. Nothing wrong with a few cookies and I find it ridiculous that you would imply as such. Furthermore, I get more than enough of my daily vitamins, minerals, prophenols, antioxidants, etc... I do it all. And did you fully read what I wrote before you responded, because it doesn't seem like it and you come off as somewhat rude in your post. Hopefully I am mistaken somehow.

The only thing you are mistaken about is that there is "nothing wrong with cookies and carbs". That's candy. Made from the simplest carbohydrates. They suck as nutrients. Your body will benifit most from COMPLEX CARBS.
The point I was making was that if you increase your good carbs (complex carbs and fruit carbs -fructose) to gain weight that will work MUCH better but it usually causes a bit of fat gain along with the muscle so adding candy could make that worse. That's just advice. You can also eat more complex carbs to gain muscle weight AND eat cookies all day long. Or continue to just eat cookies and sugar water. I do not care how fat or not fat you get. I'm just relaying some weight gain bodybuilding info.

Was trying to be helpful. In high school I was around 175 but through years of effort I learned quite a bit about weight gain. My max is 304 lbs but I had more fat at that time than I wanted. I have competed at 210 and am usually around 250.

If you feel something is rude and or ridiculous I cannot help with that. I don't have control over your reactions and emotions.

[rosalyvera]

thanks for sharing.[img]

http://www.photosnag.com/img/4713/n09x0302vnsn/clear.gif[/img]

[DerekMB]

I checked out that bmi calculator. Anyone heard of that?

It said I need to consume 3k calories a day. I checked the box for the 'most active' lifestyle. 3k doesn't seem very much. I need at least 4.

Originally Posted by joelr

Fat and muscle do not drop off that fast. It's possible 1 lb or less was fat. There is also water IN your muscles that can be lost. There is no way to tell the difference 100% without a floataion tank so the obvious must be assumed. That's how it is no matter how much you want to have lost fat that fast.

-Never said I wanted to lose fat

- It is said that 1lb of body weight is equivalent to 3500 calories. 10lbs is therefor equivalent to 35000 calories of energy. Half of the body weight is water already so I would think it would be understood that for every lb gained of solid matter, another pound would be added in water. So, if you burn that much calories then yes body weight does drop off "that fast". Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it isn't happening to someone else.

Originally Posted by joelr

Whatever. You said you want to know how to gain weight FASTER, it's known in the bodybuilding world that too much cardio slows that process down. I'm giving you that information to help you, not so you can nit pick me. I think you may have even said you were "stumped"??

I don't know why you feel I nitpick you. If you say/write something that I view as incorrect then I'm going to point it out.

Originally Posted by joelr

The only thing you are mistaken about is that there is "nothing wrong with cookies and carbs". That's candy. Made from the simplest carbohydrates. They suck as nutrients. Your body will benifit most from COMPLEX CARBS.
The point I was making was that if you increase your good carbs (complex carbs and fruit carbs -fructose) to gain weight that will work MUCH better but it usually causes a bit of fat gain along with the muscle so adding candy could make that worse. That's just advice. You can also eat more complex carbs to gain muscle weight AND eat cookies all day long. Or continue to just eat cookies and sugar water. I do not care how fat or not fat you get. I'm just relaying some weight gain bodybuilding info.

Simple carbohydrates are just as essential, if not more so, as complex carbs. They are particularly beneficial in providing energy at a quicker rate.

I eat fruit. A lot of it.

I eat starch. A lot of it.

-I don't want to gain fat and don't know how you got that impression. I have very little fat as it is and am happy with that. I don't know how you got that impression. Carbohydrates can add fat though. This sounds like what you are referring to. If you have an excess in the body, then your body will work to convert and store as fat. Carbs however are not raw material for muscle tissue as you seem to think. That's proteins job. Carbs are there to provide energy -particularly in the form of ATP- to those muscles. Eating simpler carbs get's faster energy to those muscles and the more you use-overuse them, the more they will swell/tear which in turn leads to growth. I find it is best to eat simple carbs before, during, and after workouts and the more complex like starch & whole grains during periods of rest and especially before going to sleep (as most athlete's do). I usually consume about 2 lbs of some kind of (Preferably) raw/unprocessed, starchy foods before sleep.

Originally Posted by joelr

Was trying to be helpful. In high school I was around 175 but through years of effort I learned quite a bit about weight gain. My max is 304 lbs but I had more fat at that time than I wanted. I have competed at 210 and am usually around 250.

Well thank you for trying but what works for you doesn't work for me. Everyones body type is different.

Originally Posted by joelr

If you feel something is rude and or ridiculous I cannot help with that. I don't have control over your reactions and emotions.

If that were true then it would follow that human interaction would be something to avoid in future.

[joelr]

Originally Posted by DerekMB

-Never said I wanted to lose fat

- It is said that 1lb of body weight is equivalent to 3500 calories. 10lbs is therefor equivalent to 35000 calories of energy. Half of the body weight is water already so I would think it would be understood that for every lb gained of solid matter, another pound would be added in water. So, if you burn that much calories then yes body weight does drop off "that fast". Just because it hasn't happened to you doesn't mean it isn't happening to someone else.

Nope. First the food in your system is burned. There are carbohydrate stores in muscles that are used after that. Muscle can be catabolized also. Your body will only give up so much fat at once. Based on what you described eating and your activity level I understand that you dropped some water weight and a small amount of fat. This is fitness 101 level knowledge.
I'm not just talking about my experience, I have worked with many many bodybuilders and fitness experts and studied this stuff extensively for my personal use.

Originally Posted by DerekMB

I don't know why you feel I nitpick you. If you say/write something that I view as incorrect then I'm going to point it out.

Because you ARE nit picking. I gave you general advice as to why your body was having a hard time gaining weight. Then you turned around and said "oh that's not true because I HAVE gained weight doing triple cardio.."

I have overstated the negative effects of triple cardio by saying it is IMPOSSIBLE to gain weight. But really, I don't care if you HAVE gained weight on triple cardio the point is that it SLOWS THE PROCESS DOWN and that you ARE complaining about slow weight loss. So there you go.

Originally Posted by DerekMB

Simple carbohydrates are just as essential, if not more so, as complex carbs. They are particularly beneficial in providing energy at a quicker rate.

I eat fruit. A lot of it.
I eat starch. A lot of it.

No carbs are essential nutrients. None. The body actually adapts to a carb free diet and mental clarity improves after an initial period of weakness. Protein, fat, vitamins/minerals, phytochemicals and water are essential nutrients. One must eat vegetables so a 0 carb diet is actually impossible. Everything has a few grams.
Simple carbs though totally suck at giving energy. What is the use of a 5 minute rush then a crash that makes you want to lie down and take a nap. They can be used to power through a workout of course but for the actual weight gain food is needed.
Complex carbs give stable long lasting energy. I eat sweets when I'm not trying to lose weight but I only eat them after I've eaten the proper amount of good carbs, protein, fat.
Complex carbs are essential for maximum growth. They are used to transport protein to muscles and increase the effectiveness of protein.

Your asking for advice and then upon hearing something that goes against your beliefs your arguing against it? Your frustrated and can't figure it out yet when I tell you the problem you won't have any of it? I dunno, stay small.

You are what you eat. The axiom has truth to it. Your eating like a small man eats. If you want to be a big man eat what a larger man eats. Make yourself anabolic - your testosterone will go up and so will your weight.
4 to 6 meals, high protein, high complex carbs, high fat, 1 gallon water daily.

Have candy too if you like.

Originally Posted by DerekMB

-I don't want to gain fat and don't know how you got that impression. I have very little fat as it is and am happy with that. I don't know how you got that impression. Carbohydrates can add fat though. This sounds like what you are referring to. If you have an excess in the body, then your body will work to convert and store as fat. Carbs however are not raw material for muscle tissue as you seem to think. That's proteins job. Carbs are there to provide energy -particularly in the form of ATP- to those muscles. Eating simpler carbs get's faster energy to those muscles and the more you use-overuse them, the more they will swell/tear which in turn leads to growth. I find it is best to eat simple carbs before, during, and after workouts and the more complex like starch & whole grains during periods of rest and especially before going to sleep (as most athlete's do). I usually consume about 2 lbs of some kind of (Preferably) raw/unprocessed, starchy foods before sleep.

Uh, I don't know how you got the impression that I WANT you to gain fat??

Bodybuilders on a mass phase eat 60% complex carbs. I do also on a mass phase. It works like crazy. I'm not sure why you are telling me what "works" best for you? You weigh in the 130's and can't gain weight! Unless you started out at 90 lbs nothing has really "worked" for you yet.

Originally Posted by DerekMB

Well thank you for trying but what works for you doesn't work for me. Everyones body type is different.

You have no idea if what I'm saying works for you or not because you haven't tried it. There are different body types yes, you sound like an ectomorph.
Your right, what I'm saying might not apply. Take my advice and DOUBLE it. You need to eat real food and lots of it.

These principles have been proven over and over again by athletes attempting to gain weight. You must have googled this by now and realized what must be done.
I struggled with trying to gain weight from 18 to ~30 years old. I lucked out by finally joining a gym with loads of bodybuilders and huge dudes all over the place.

Originally Posted by DerekMB

If that were true then it would follow that human interaction would be something to avoid in future.

Yeah it's true. We each own our own feelings. If someone flips you off while driving you can just consider it part of the scenery and continue feeling peaceful or you can get all bent out of shape. That finger has no control over you. Your ego does. Egos love getting pissed off and blaming other things.

[Michelle]

Originally Posted by DerekMB

Not that I have noticed, why?

This discussion was started a few weeks ago after I started noticing my weight fluctuate in accordance with my mood as opposed to my food intake. A few other members shared similar experiences.

Love + Joy = Health + Weight Loss

[DerekMB]

Originally Posted by Michelle

This discussion was started a few weeks ago after I started noticing my weight fluctuate in accordance with my mood as opposed to my food intake. A few other members shared similar experiences.

Love + Joy = Health + Weight Loss

That's very interesting. Never though about it like that.

I tend to believe that how we feel is a personal choice we make and that things generally tend to influence us one way or another but that we ultimately decide how we should feel/be either consciously or subconsciously. I might like to try blessing my food though. Great advice

[rei]

i will ask my question again...
i am curious how you would know how much weight was water and how much wasn't? is there some type of test one can use to know this with confidence?