i got the h1n1 vaccine and....

[funchy]

I got the H1N1 vaccine this week and... nothing happened.

I didn't get sick. I didn't feel any different. No fever. No flu symptoms. This will be my 5th vaccine this year, as I enter into the health care field. And despite so many shots, I did not end up with autism, brain damage, mercury poisoning, or end of free-will. The only thing that I am sure of is that I should have immunity to H1N1.

Why did I get it? It is now required for health care workers (me). My own opinions aside, it would be wrong of me to bring h1n1 or seasonal flu to the high-risk people I care for.
Would you want a doctor or nurse caring for you if you knew they might be a carrier for a potentially fatal infectious disease? All it take is to inhale airborne mist to contact the flu.

How much did it cost? It was free, the cost covered by the government.

Don't you need 2 shots? No, one is proven to be effective enough, based on the research they've done so far.

Which did you get? I got the intra-muscular injection (a killed virus). There is a weakened-live-virus nasal spray out there, but some people have issues with inhalation medications/vaccines. The spray is also not as easy to get right now in my town.

Is it right for everyone? Not necessarily -- talk to your doctor. If you're a higher risk group for the h1n1 strain if flu, then yes, consider it. For example, my 70 yr old father who as active cancer & some asthma is a high risk, so he got it. My mother who is only a few years younger did not.

Aren't you worried about the side effects? Everything has a side effect. Refusing a vaccine has a side effect. Getting terrible sick has physical, psychological, and financial side effects. Spreading it to another person also is a side effect. I don't believe in needless vaccinations, but not all vaccinations are pointless.

What about that rumor that getting the h1n1 shot the same year as the seasonal flu makes one less effective? or makes side effects worse? I am not aware of such a thing, I did not see it firsthand, and I've not seen any scientific proof of this.

Haven't people died of the vaccine? In my state of Maryland, I am not aware of any deaths. We do have quite a few people dead from the h1n1 itself already, and the flu season for this area is just starting. Also, I'm at the county hospital once a week, and right now a good portion of their med-surg rooms are now isolation rooms. I cannot speak for all areas, but h1n1 is huge problem in my county.


I welcome your questions or comments. I'll probably get a few replies about how I'm going to get die of a painful weird brain-cancer due to this vaccine, and I know everyone has their own opinion. But I felt it was important for me to share about my firsthand experiences with the vaccine.

[bman]

1. You will be sterilized.

2. You will get cancer and die slow death. You're going to be a statistic soon.


The effects would not be instant because that would be too obvious.

5 to 10 years down the road you'll start feeling it.

[Beuford]

Originally Posted by funchy

Would you want a doctor or nurse caring for you if you knew they might be a carrier for a potentially fatal infectious disease? All it take is to inhale airborne mist to contact the flu.

Or, you could be carrying another flu. Or something totally different. Or a thousand other things not covered by vaccinations. I'd rather a healthy doctor, to one filled with vaccines. While vaccines may or may not help, I feel the bigger part in disease is proper nutrition, a healthy lifestyle, and proper sanitation.

[stanmrak]

I'll just respond to 3 points.

Originally Posted by funchy

The only thing that I am sure of is that I should have immunity to H1N1.

How much did it cost? It was free, the cost covered by the government.

I've not seen any scientific proof...

How are you sure that you have immunity? Because the CDC told you so? The CDC has been caught lying about the vaccines numerous times already.

The cost was covered by the government? How naive. Where do you think the government got the money to pay for these? Do you not pay taxes?

Speaking of scientific proof... there is NONE for flu vaccines. Clinical studies that have been done, in the words of an independent vaccine expert, are "rubbish." These studies are all done by the pharmaceutical industries, who have a enormous profit motive, and are hardly a reliable, objective source. Double-blind studies (the only acceptable type of scientific proof we have) have never been done on long-term effects or safety of vaccines — or even if they actually work!

Since you've been in the healthcare field a long time, I realize you've been thoroughly indoctrinated. Some of us like to think for ourselves, though. Like about half of your fellow healthcare professionals, who refuse to get flu shots.

See my post under the previous H1N1 vaccine thread for complete documentation to back up my points.

[JSB]

Originally Posted by funchy

I got the H1N1 vaccine this week and... nothing happened.

I will be skipping this vaccine, simply because the risk/reward calculation doesn't add up for me. Whereas negative reactions from seasonal flu vaccine usually number around 1 per million, this vaccine will likely show adverse reactions in as many as 100 per million. Yes, most people will be fine, but why would I choose the higher risk for a vaccination of unproven effectiveness against a disease with a lower mortality rate than normal seasonal flu?

I could see how healthcare workers might want to get it -- they are almost guaranteed to be exposed to H1N1 and they can't afford to infect other patients.

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by bman

1. You will be sterilized.

2. You will get cancer and die slow death. You're going to be a statistic soon.


The effects would not be instant because that would be too obvious.

5 to 10 years down the road you'll start feeling it.

I want to see the studies showing that flu shots cause significant increases in a) sterilization and b) cancer, and that these effects can be specifically linked to the vaccine even though they don't appear for 5 to 10 years.

[Jthorn]

I don't believe that anyone taking the vaccine is doomed. Remember how powerful our bodies are and how the effectively they deal with all sorts of crap from our environment.
It's hardly surprising that you and most of the people don't notice anything. It's still quite possible that you may never suffer from it. Nonetheless, that still doesn't make it something you should put in your body.

[stevo75]

Originally Posted by moonrambler

I want to see the studies showing that flu shots cause significant increases in a) sterilization and b) cancer, and that these effects can be specifically linked to the vaccine even though they don't appear for 5 to 10 years.

I think bman was joking....

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by stevo75

I think bman was joking....

Ah. Cool. I guess I've just seen so many of these sorts of unsubstantiated comments laid forth in total seriousness, that I can't even tell them apart from jokes anymore!

[blossom]

I think it's probably too early to tell if any side effects have taken place!

In the sixties they used to dump "agent orange" onto civilians in the States while they swam in public pools with their kids in certain places, just to see what the effects would be, without informing these people by the way...and it wasn't until a few years later that the incidence of increased rate of deformity in children began to be noticed in these areas, not to mention general malaise and fatal illness increased also.

The human body is wonderfully able to adapt to all the harmful influences that are the norm these days, without any visible signs, but that doesn't mean that cells don't mutate and can easily be triggered into becoming activated, such as with cancer, which already exists in all of us, just remains dormant until it is awoken.

It would be very difficult to prove either way, that in 10 years from now, if you were to be told you had cancer or were sterile, that it could be specifically traced back to this particular vaccination, especially since you have had so many by the sounds of it. Different bodies can adapt to different amounts of any kind of poison, whether it is vaccines, or alcohol, or even McDonalds hamburgers...I wouldn't worry about it now though.

[ginkgo]

So if you did not get it, you would have been fired. You would not get another job in your profession. With this economy you may not get any job and no unemployment and you would be homeless. That would shorten your life more than the vaccine will. So I understand your decision.

[Trezker]

Originally Posted by ginkgo

So if you did not get it, you would have been fired. You would not get another job in your profession. With this economy you may not get any job and no unemployment and you would be homeless. That would shorten your life more than the vaccine will. So I understand your decision.

Priorities are funny. I happen to value doing the right thing over having the longest possible life. I don't fear death and I see life as an adventure where I may die at any turn.

[Writertype]

Originally Posted by bman

1. You will be sterilized.

2. You will get cancer and die slow death. You're going to be a statistic soon.


The effects would not be instant because that would be too obvious.

5 to 10 years down the road you'll start feeling it.

Someone pointed out that bman is probably joking. I really hope so, but from the stuff I read on this health forum I really don't know.

stamrak follow up with "some of us like to think for ourselves." That is condescending and ignorant. Blindly rejecting all the claims put forth by modern medicine is (drumroll please...) not thinking for yourself! Hard as that may be for some of you to believe, reading on the internet that big pharma is the devil and the stuff they make just screws your body up for profit and then repeating it ad nauseum is intellectual laziness. To believe that pharmaceutical companies always produce good products that will be maximally helpful and minimally harmful is intellectually lazy as well. Realize that there are shades of grey.

For those of you who do not understand the science behind what is going on, you might want to consider trusting a professional on this stuff. There is a reason most doctors get their own kids vaccinated, and it's not to make a few bucks!

Now if you are thinking "yeah, but all those doctors are in the pocket of big pharma! They don't know better! They were taught by big pharma and can't think for themselves like I do!" you might want to take a brief time out and wonder when healthy suspicion becomes paranoia.

[SomeRandomGuy]

funchy, I'm glad to hear that you have not experienced any negative side-effects from the vaccination. Hopefully that does not change. Like others have mentioned, it will probably be difficult to recognize effects a few years or decades down the. Hopefully you will not have any.

[Andrew Brunelle]

No job should require you to get a vaccine. Some health care workers fought this and won. I don't know why you would submit to an untested and potentially dangerous vaccine with the knowledge you have about it. Sure, it won't damage some people, so you are the exception, not the rule.

[Double]

Originally Posted by bman

1. You will be sterilized.

2. You will get cancer and die slow death. You're going to be a statistic soon.


The effects would not be instant because that would be too obvious.

5 to 10 years down the road you'll start feeling it.

You better have som proof before you say something like that. I would never take a vaccine voluntarily, but i dont go around scaring people into doing the same.
You best start informing people, instead of this scare stuff. Untill then you are really no better than those you apparently are against.

I dont take the vaccine, the body doesent need it, especially not against a flu. As long as you stick to the human beings natural diet you will be fine. Maybe you will catch the flu at one point, if there is an epidemic, but your body will be in a strong condition to flush it out of your system again, and after this fight the immune system will be even stronger

[bman]

Originally Posted by Double

You better have som proof before you say something like that. I would never take a vaccine voluntarily, but i dont go around scaring people into doing the same.
You best start informing people, instead of this scare stuff. Untill then you are really no better than those you apparently are against.

I dont take the vaccine, the body doesent need it, especially not against a flu. As long as you stick to the human beings natural diet you will be fine. Maybe you will catch the flu at one point, if there is an epedimeic, but your body will be in a strong condition to flush it out of your system again, and after this fight the immune system will be even stronger

Bet you never heard of the polio vaccine scandal, tainted with SV40 cancer causing viruses.

[blossom]

I agree, it was beyond harsh...but then, as I've learnt about that person, sarcasm is his humour of choice...not that funny really

C'mon, be real...EVERYTHING is BAD for us...even the water, the air. So if a vaccine doesn't kill him something else might. Some people can smoke their whole lives and NOT get cancer while there are loads of health conscious people who end up getting cancer because they are constantly worried about what might kill them, and the stress and worry of it all actually triggers existing cancer cells in their body.

Scare mongering is just the same as what the government, whom you proport to hate does...so are you really that different to your 'enemy?

[Double]

Originally Posted by bman

Bet you never heard of the polio vaccine scandal, tainted with SV40 cancer causing viruses.

That is not much of a proof

[Double]

Originally Posted by blossom

I agree, it was beyond harsh...but then, as I've learnt about that person, sarcasm is his humour of choice...not that funny really

C'mon, be real...EVERYTHING is BAD for us...even the water, the air. So if a vaccine doesn't kill him something else might. Some people can smoke their whole lives and NOT get cancer while there are loads of health conscious people who end up getting cancer because they are constantly worried about what might kill them, and the stress and worry of it all actually triggers existing cancer cells in their body.

Scare mongering is just the same as what the government, whom you proport to hate does...so are you really that different to your 'enemy?

But the problem is people are lead to believe the vaccine is good for their health, people smoking know its bad so its ok, they are capable of making a relatively informed choice. But this whole take the vaccine, dont take the vaccine debate is mostly based on fear!
I simply ask for some more evidence, and information. Other wise we are getting no where

[liamona]

Originally Posted by Writertype

To believe that pharmaceutical companies always produce good products that will be maximally helpful and minimally harmful is intellectually lazy as well.

I don't think it's a stretch to believe that for BigPharma, profits come first. And always keep in mind that they are immune from prosecution if you have a reaction to the vaccine. Nice work if you can get it!

For those of you who do not understand the science behind what is going on, you might want to consider trusting a professional on this stuff.

I'm glad you brought that up. My answer is this: until there is a real study, and by real I mean one that compares a vaccinated group against a non-vaccinated group, I will continue to be skeptical of the "science."

There is a reason most doctors get their own kids vaccinated, and it's not to make a few bucks!

Aside from stories that HMO doctors get financial bonuses for how many kids they vaccinate, what do you think those "well" baby visits are for? They center around the vaccine schedule for infants.

Strangely enough, if you take your kid to a family doctor rather than a pediatrician, they aren't as concerned or aren't concerned at all about whether or not your kid is vaccinated. Could it be because that's not their bread-and-butter? Or is it just that pediatricians are soooo much more altruistic than general practitioners?

I have HMO insurance, but I also see a doctor who doesn't take insurance. I wonder if it's a coincidence that he has NO BigPharma posters, pens, cups, etc. etc. in his office, and he is against vaccinations.

The HMO docs always have the BigPharma goodies.

And strangely.....they are the ones who are really interested in prescribing you meds, often the ones that are featured in the posters, paper pads, and coffee cups.

Oh, but that's got to be a coincidence, right?

[Writertype]

Originally Posted by liamona

Aside from stories that HMO doctors get financial bonuses for how many kids they vaccinate, what do you think those "well" baby visits are for? They center around the vaccine schedule for infants.

Strangely enough, if you take your kid to a family doctor rather than a pediatrician, they aren't as concerned or aren't concerned at all about whether or not your kid is vaccinated. Could it be because that's not their bread-and-butter? Or is it just that pediatricians are soooo much more altruistic than general practitioners?

I have HMO insurance, but I also see a doctor who doesn't take insurance. I wonder if it's a coincidence that he has NO BigPharma posters, pens, cups, etc. etc. in his office, and he is against vaccinations.

The HMO docs always have the BigPharma goodies.

And strangely.....they are the ones who are really interested in prescribing you meds, often the ones that are featured in the posters, paper pads, and coffee cups.

Oh, but that's got to be a coincidence, right?

You go to a doctor who is against vaccinations!? That is insane! Not to mention wildly irresponsible. Your doctor opposes every vaccination that is out there?

I go to a good medical school in the United States (ranked higher than a couple of the Ivy League med schools) where pharmaceutical companies are not allowed to give us as much as a pen. We cannot accept gifts in any form from these people. I have yet to meet a single doctor here who is against vaccinations, and I have yet to meet a single doctor here who did not get his or her own kids vaccinated.

Here is one study on the efficacy of a flu vaccine in a certain cohort, if you google scholar search you can find more: CIDRAP >> Study finds flu vaccine benefits for older workers.

And what about facts like the following:
"A physician entering practice today will most likely never see a case of Hib meningitis. Before the introduction of effective vaccines, approximately one in 200 children developed invasive Hib disease before five years of age -- about 20,000 cases annually. Hib was the leading cause of bacterial meningitis in children under age five C accounting for 50 to 65 percent of all cases. From 15 to 30 percent of affected children became hearing impaired and 2 to 5 percent died in spite of effective antibiotic therapy."

The science behind vaccines is sound, the antibody titers are very testable, and although vaccines are not 100% effective in all cases they are an excellent tool from a public health perspective. Those doctors who are getting paid more for getting kids vaccinated are getting paid because it reduces the disease burden (and thus the payments that must be made for treatment) in those children later.

[bman]

Originally Posted by Writertype

You go to a doctor who is against vaccinations!? That is insane! Not to mention wildly irresponsible. Your doctor opposes every vaccination that is out there?

I go to a good medical school in the United States (ranked higher than a couple of the Ivy League med schools) where pharmaceutical companies are not allowed to give us as much as a pen. We cannot accept gifts in any form from these people. I have yet to meet a single doctor here who is against vaccinations, and I have yet to meet a single doctor here who did not get his or her own kids vaccinated.

Here is one study on the efficacy of a flu vaccine in a certain cohort, if you google scholar search you can find more: CIDRAP >> Study finds flu vaccine benefits for older workers.

And what about facts like the following:
"A physician entering practice today will most likely never see a case of Hib meningitis. Before the introduction of effective vaccines, approximately one in 200 children developed invasive Hib disease before five years of age -- about 20,000 cases annually. Hib was the leading cause of bacterial meningitis in children under age five C accounting for 50 to 65 percent of all cases. From 15 to 30 percent of affected children became hearing impaired and 2 to 5 percent died in spite of effective antibiotic therapy."

The science behind vaccines is sound, the antibody titers are very testable, and although vaccines are not 100% effective in all cases they are an excellent tool from a public health perspective. Those doctors who are getting paid more for getting kids vaccinated are getting paid because it reduces the disease burden (and thus the payments that must be made for treatment) in those children later.

The science behind vaccine is sound but the people behind the vaccine are not.

Science is not the problem here. It's the people.

You can't trust these corrupt bigpharmas with an agenda.

With mad scientists and science czars going around, esp those who are closet nazis and eugenics supporters of population control, we're not taking chances.

You cannot trust many people nowadays especially those in corrupt institutions that monopolizes health and food industry.

Financial institutions are the first to have been exposed as extremely corrupt, that's why your American economy is rotting.


I dread to think what other corruption have set foot in your Medical and Food corporations.

The financial collapse is a warning sign to the sheeple to start waking up and don't trust these institutions easily.

[rei]

bman, you were encouraged to provide some kind of proof instead of scare tactics. are you not interested in finding proof (from a neutral or relatively neutral source, not an intensely fringe website)?

funchy i am glad you have had no negative effects from the vaccine. i'm not interested in getting one as i don't think this flu is that bad (and i am a little bit too old to be in a high risk group, and too young to be in the senior risk group), but it's your body and if that's what you want to do to your body, who am i to preach at you?

[bman]

Originally Posted by rei

bman, you were encouraged to provide some kind of proof instead of scare tactics. are you not interested in finding proof (from a neutral or relatively neutral source, not an intensely fringe website)?

Vaccine frauds

[Maximum Jack]

Im not sure why of all places you would come to this forum to tell everyone you got vaccinated. You also seem to imply that the medication you received is safe and beneficial. Why don't you promote powerful anti virals like garlic that occur naturally and don't cause side effects worse than garlic breath. How about good nutrition and positive thinking? I have no plans to accept medication from a profit driven enterprise that can be better achieved through good diet and proper hygeine.

[JSB]

Vaccines have saved millions of lives, and vaccination ranks with antibiotics and water/sewage treatment as among the most beneficial medical discoveries for the health of humanity.

That being said, there are legitimate and reasonable questions regarding the safety, efficacy, and necessity of the newly produced H1N1 vaccines, and many of these issues are being raised within the accepted scientific medical community.

Presentation On H1N1

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by Maximum Jack

Im not sure why of all places you would come to this forum to tell everyone you got vaccinated. You also seem to imply that the medication you received is safe and beneficial. Why don't you promote powerful anti virals like garlic that occur naturally and don't cause side effects worse than garlic breath. How about good nutrition and positive thinking? I have no plans to accept medication from a profit driven enterprise that can be better achieved through good diet and proper hygeine.

People shouldn't have to feel they aren't allowed to express their opinion here about which actions are healthy, including receiving vaccines.

[seeker5]

Writertype, you write:

Originally Posted by Writertype

Blindly rejecting all the claims put forth by modern medicine is (drumroll please...) not thinking for yourself!

Then you say:

For those of you who do not understand the science behind what is going on, you might want to consider trusting a professional on this stuff.

Ie, not thinking for yourself.

I'm sure the doctors all mean well, and they truly believe they are doing something well, but that wouldn't be the first time in history the mass of doctors were honestly wrong in something.

[Writertype]

Originally Posted by seeker5

Writertype, you write:



Then you say:



Ie, not thinking for yourself.

I'm sure the doctors all mean well, and they truly believe they are doing something well, but that wouldn't be the first time in history the mass of doctors were honestly wrong in something.

A lot of people on this forum seem to 'rage against the vaccine machine' without really understanding the science behind it. They see a few catchy articles from fringe groups, still don't really understand things, and then decide that they will be 'independent thinkers' and convince themselves that they know more than the doctor who spent twelve years or more of his life being educated on the topics and then practiced for however many years in a real clinical setting.

I will grant that just trusting your doctor is not thinking for yourself, but what I was trying to point out is that just trusting scare tactics about vaccination is not thinking for yourself either.

Ask yourself: how do vaccines work? Why do people need them? What diseases are best addressed with vaccines, and why? Why do some vaccines use adjuvants? What are adjuvants? Skewing the immunoglobulin response to what type would provide the best long term immunity?

If you can't answer the above questions (and more) then you don't understand vaccines. How can you think independently about something you don't even understand? And if you are not thinking independently either way, maybe you should trust your doctor.

These anti-vaccine posts bother me because, I feel, they spread misinformation about vaccination. I am going to spend the rest of my life trying to help people avoid illness, and it sucks to see people who don't truly understand the issue scaring people into increasing their risk for disease.