Martial Arts: which one?

[The Big D]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

I certainly hope the answer is "never."

One would certainly hope so. If one can't avoid attending a knife/gun fight, the correct "martial art" is modern infantry skills.

[OccamsPhaser]

That 90% of all fights going to the ground statistic has a kind of qualifier to it - it's "90% of all fights go to the ground when you or your opponent want them to". It is a very simple thing to coax an enemy to a ground position, because it isn't always you on top.

As for what martial art you should try, OP, I'd suggest either Muay Thai or Krav Maga. I myself studied Tae Kwon Do for around eight years, and can say that it wasn't quite as thrilling or informative as when I took, for instance, Ninjutsu. From what you've explained you want to learn close quarter combat with an emphasis on stopping your opponent, and the aforementioned will help you do that.

As for the validity of learning an art for self defense, regardless of whether you are in a position to use it... that's up to the practitioner to decide. Martial arts exist to share the wisdom of previous generations, including when to fight and when to solve things with words.

[rocksupreme]

Originally Posted by OccamsPhaser

That 90% of all fights going to the ground statistic has a kind of qualifier to it - it's "90% of all fights go to the ground when you or your opponent want them to". It is a very simple thing to coax an enemy to a ground position, because it isn't always you on top.

That's like saying "90% of all car accidents end in singalongs if everyone involved wants them to." Fights are like car wrecks - you can't control them just because you think you are well-trained. There is no aspect of fighting that I would characterize as "a very simple thing."

Also, it's not a statistic unless it comes from a documented study.

[OccamsPhaser]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

That's like saying "90% of all car accidents end in singalongs if everyone involved wants them to." Fights are like car wrecks - you can't control them just because you think you are well-trained. There is no aspect of fighting that I would characterize as "a very simple thing."

Also, it's not a statistic unless it comes from a documented study.

I think fighting itself is "a very simple thing". The difficult part is attempting to apply tactics. I'll rescind calling that 90% estimation a statistic, but to get back on subject it's notable that that particular idea comes from the world of MMA and not practical combat. Outside of the realm of fair play fighting itself is completely different, and more like the car wreck. Martial arts are supposed to give you the advantage in a fight, just like airbags or roll cages give you an advantage in a car wreck.

In any case, yes, I agree with you. I think it's silly that people put so much stock in ground fighting when its validity anywhere else is questionable. One tries to stay off the ground when attacked, because one then loses the ability to flee. When confronted by multiple opponents, the ground means defeat immediately. And even if it's only one guy, you don't know if he's got friends or not.

[ginkgo]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

That's one of the funniest things I've ever read. Defend yourself from whom? Get viciously attacked my ruthless street thugs often? I'd suggest moving to a different neighborhood. Barring that, I'd say the best sport for not being attacked is powerlifting (or anything else that makes you huge and intimidating).

On the news in America they have this beautiful woman who is a model. She looks hideous. Her boyfriend threw acid in her face. Actually it is is big news here but happened in the UK. Daily Express | UK News :: Model opens up about jealous boyfriend's acid attack

[bruce22]

Have you tried Tai-Chi? It's a soft form of martial art but it is extremly powerful. It focus not only training the physical strength but also internal energy that the Chinese call Chi.

[vartann]

you shall reap following to the level to which you have staked your life

[A GROWING MIND]

I have always wanted to get into Capoeira...

[Scipio]

Originally Posted by ginkgo

On the news in America they have this beautiful woman who is a model. She looks hideous. Her boyfriend threw acid in her face. Actually it is is big news here but happened in the UK. Daily Express | UK News :: Model opens up about jealous boyfriend's acid attack

Her boyfriend did not throw acid in her face.

[rocksupreme]

Originally Posted by ginkgo

On the news in America they have this beautiful woman who is a model. She looks hideous. Her boyfriend threw acid in her face. Actually it is is big news here but happened in the UK. Daily Express | UK News :: Model opens up about jealous boyfriend's acid attack

And which martial art could have prevented that?

[Scipio]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

And which martial art could have prevented that?

'No nonsense self defense' could have prevented that (the website posted in this thread). She was raped and beaten bloody by this hookup (he was not a boyfriend, he was an online hookup), she didn't report it to the police, then he called her and told her to go outside a week later and asked her to describe what she was wearing and where she was so his friend found her and threw acid on her.

Her first mistake was being intimate with a random guy who had a previous criminal history of throwing boiling water on people's face. She was a "ask no questions let's hook up" kinda girl. Of course the crime is not her fault, but awareness would have prevented it. He was showing signs of being violent and crazy early on but she never left him, probably because she was addicted to getting sex from a big strong black guy instead of being aware about her safety.

[joelr]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

And which martial art could have prevented that?

Martial arts can't defend against nuclear weapons either. But they can still be useful for defense in many circumstances.

[Marc D]

Originally Posted by Scipio

Her first mistake was being intimate with a random guy who had a previous criminal history of throwing boiling water on people's face. She was a "ask no questions let's hook up" kinda girl. Of course the crime is not her fault, but awareness would have prevented it. He was showing signs of being violent and crazy early on but she never left him, probably because she was addicted to getting sex from a big strong black guy instead of being aware about her safety.

And I would argue that if she was part of any martial art school/practice worth its salt, she would have been less inclined to make such a mistake and her overall awareness would be heightened.

Technique is very important, but it is more about the mindset & lifestyle that comes with practicing any worthy martial art that makes it so effective.

[Scipio]

Originally Posted by Marc D

And I would argue that if she was part of any martial art school/practice worth its salt, she would have been less inclined to make such a mistake and her overall awareness would be heightened.

Technique is very important, but it is more about the mindset & lifestyle that comes with practicing any worthy martial art that makes it so effective.

I've never gone to a martial arts class that taught how to effectively judge a potential date for longer than they practiced physical techniques. If you read this thread you'll see that I've fought professionally, I'm no slouch to martial arts, and I still advocate awareness techniques as much more valuable than any martial arts training.

[Marc D]

Originally Posted by Scipio

I've never gone to a martial arts class that taught how to effectively judge a potential date for longer than they practiced physical techniques. If you read this thread you'll see that I've fought professionally, I'm no slouch to martial arts, and I still advocate awareness techniques as much more valuable than any martial arts training.

For some reason you seem to think that martial arts training and awareness techniques are mutually exclusive. Through my experiences, I can't imagine training in martial art without it being influenced by and grounded in, excellent awareness of yourself and people around you.

My only point is that a person attending a martial arts school worth its salt would be less incined to make the choice to date someone of such questionable character who was on steroids with a history of throwing boiling water on peoples faces. Unless you are a professional sport fighter like yourself (much unlike the general public), the physical techniques you learn, while still quite important, are almost secondary.

[joelr]

Originally Posted by Marc D

My only point is that a person attending a martial arts school worth its salt would be less incined to make the choice to date someone of such questionable character who was on steroids with a history of throwing boiling water on peoples faces.

The anabolic (unlike the androgenic steroids which also give big muscles) do increase sex drive and sometimes give a sort of outgoing extroverted confidence but they do not cause one to hire hit men in pre-planned assaults.

Countless pro athletes and local weightlifters all use with nothing more than increased protein synthesis and big appetites.

That assault was pure psychopathic hatred of women.


I wish the media would make booze out to be as bad as they have made steroids. There would be less people killed every day by drunk drivers.

[FknTmo]

This is going so off-topic.

My votes all go for Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu.

You can train pretty often and not die or get injured.

[ginkgo]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

And which martial art could have prevented that?

I was making the point that there is violence all around even with people that you sleep with. I could have also used the example that on the day Obama gave his speech about staying in school, a 13 year old boy was shot and killed by another boy in school. To avoid the above (acid in face) you need lightning fast reflexes that I was born with, I think. Or maybe the tai chi and other training made them faster since I was learning them at age 12. According to a lady on Twitter that does martial arts and yoga, she says that to be doing that at such a young age can only be because I was doing it in my past life. Henry Ford, who invented the car, said that he had been working on inventing the car in his past life.

No I must have been born with it unless doing yoga can do that. Before martial arts, I was learning boxing at 12. At this school the students only box with the instructors. But the owner of the school (Golden Gloves winner) had me box with his son. My grandfather was there and knew that I had no chance at all. He could tell that his son had been training for years. But I guess the owner wanted me to box his son since he noticed that I had lightning fast reflexes.

So I start boxing the son and he could not hit me at all. My grandfather was laughing (he told me this after it) and when the owner would look at him, he hid his face behind a heavy bag. I hit the son a couple of times and they had to stop the fight since he was hurt.

Actually I think the higher your consciousness, the less chance you have of having a significant other that is in a state of covert hostility. Although you can only recognize this state if you are in a state above it. If you are a woman and on a date, watch how the guy treats the waitress.

[ginkgo]

Originally Posted by Scipio

Her boyfriend did not throw acid in her face.

That is what the headline said (MODEL OPENS UP ABOUT JEALOUS BOYFRIEND'S ACID ATTACK) and what they said on the TV news but it was a friend of her lover that did it on the lover's behalf. In the U.S. a lover is someone that you are having sex with.

[joelr]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

I certainly hope the answer is "never."

My main criticism against saying "MMA is the best for fighting," is that MMA is not one defined thing. Being a mix, different schools teach different elements. Since MMA is so popular now, everybody claims to teach it, but a lot of instructors are simply not qualified to do so (and simply teach basics that they learned from watching videos, etc.).

We also need to remember that most MMA schools focus on sport fighting, which is different from self defense in that terrain, numbers of opponents, and types of attacks are limited.

Good MMA schools bring in a separate boxing, grappling, maui tai coach as well as at least 1 competent MMA guy.

All you have to do is find the school that people are actually fighting out of.
In Boston we have Sityodtong where Kenny Florian and about 1 dozen other UFC people train or have trained at. Plus another school - Red Line Fight Sports with equal qualifications.

MMA is better than you think. It's because most training time is focused on real fighting - defense, footwork, hitting MOVING people - it's still better than even krav in a real situation. Even with more than 1 person. Maybe with the rarest exception of one getting kidnapped and forced into an arena knife
fight or something.
Otherwise if someone pulls a weapon you are not supposed to try to disarm them!

I'm familiar with all this stuff. In some of my boxing/grappling classes I have worked with krav maga people and other styles who have come in to mma classes to learn (they usually suck at sparring), have screwed around with having multiple people attack us (pretending like they don't know how to grapple) and all that. I think the skillset transfers just fine to different situations. I'm not just talking out of my butt here. I started out with straight boxing lessons 2x week, about 7 years ago at the Boston Golds Gym with a golden gloves guy - Dave Thomas and went from there.

[MartialDev]

You can't believe anything written on the Internet about martial arts (unless I wrote it, obviously).

I guess you don't know exactly what you want in a martial art, which is fine. You won't know what is on offer until you visit your local schools. Do not make any assumptions based upon the name of their style. Do not choose what someone else told you is best.

[rocksupreme]

Originally Posted by MartialDev

You won't know what is on offer until you visit your local schools. Do not make any assumptions based upon the name of their style. Do not choose what someone else told you is best.

The best possible advice.

[Majesticzero]

Originally Posted by rocksupreme

The best possible advice.

And exactly what I'm going to do. I'll check out some schools and different styles. From watching videos I love Krav Maga. But it also has to feel good to be there. If I don't like the students and/or the teachers I will never be good at it.

[joelr]

Originally Posted by MartialDev

You can't believe anything written on the Internet about martial arts (unless I wrote it, obviously).

I guess you don't know exactly what you want in a martial art, which is fine. You won't know what is on offer until you visit your local schools. Do not make any assumptions based upon the name of their style. Do not choose what someone else told you is best.

If that's really your advice then the disclaimer is meaningless and your blog contains no information that can be believed. Why make a blog with information that no one can believe?