Creating permanent fat loss and reaching you ideal weight?

[Orecle]

Originally Posted by Susanna77

I agree with a lot of what you said now.

I admit that one of the reasons why I am in deep trouble in first place is because I NEVER exercised regularly. True, a lot of slim people I know haven't either and they eat everything but hey...it's the metabolism crap.

I've been exercising but perhaps until I do it for a year in a row I shouldn't rush to call it an habit or something that I do regularly. I need to prove myself first.

There is A LOT of info out there folks. It's overwhelming.

Question: how do I cope with low blood sugar while exercising? Nutritionist advised having sugar pack (those you get at cafes), but I have those bars for sports people. Won't this make the problem worse? Do I even have an option? One day (as an experiment) I had a Mars bar before my husband and I went for a walk. When we returned my blood sugar was fine, excellent even. And so was my husband's who only had a sandwich all day 5 hours earlier

When I exercise without the "sugar crutch" blood sugar drops to dangerous levels.

Good news

You have to take this in 2 stages. Stage 1 is far harder than stage 2. Stage 2 is longer.

Stage 1 is getting all the unwanted bodyfat off you
Stage 2. On successful completion of stage 1, making sure new fat does not stay. aka maintenance of new weight.

Depending on how fat you are. I say with work you can do a stone every 7 weeks (2lbs weekly), if you work super hard (1hr cardio 2ce daily morning and evening) you can do a stone a mth(3.5lb weekly)

Stage 2 maintenance depending on quality of diet, can be done 3 x a week, if that.

I want you to try something. Eat normally, but go gym for a heavy cardio workout of an hour - 90 mins for 21 days in a row and see if you lose fat. Dont change anything in you diet. Eat what ever you like. Post it in the 30 day challenge on this forum

[Susanna77]

A diet that keeps your insulin levels down. Why? Because you burn bodyfat. Why? Because when your body is flooded with insulin, through too much carbs, fat burning stops. This is why Atkins diet,anabolic diets and typical bodybuilding diets (who by the way routinely lose more bodyfat than everyone else on the planet) work. If you notice all the current successful diets admonish the elimination or severe reduction of carbs

Do you recommend the atkins for me then? Is it OK to exercise whil on this diet? That's my issue.

I do have high insulin levels. I've been tested for that and it's pretty high.

[Susanna77]

I want you to try something. Eat normally, but go gym for a heavy cardio workout of an hour - 90 mins for 21 days in a row and see if you lose fat. Dont change anything in you diet. Eat what ever you like. Post it in the 30 day challenge on this forum

I love this idea.

I do walk on the beach - very fast pace - for an hour. I take this is OK? Maybe increase it to make it 90mins?

[Susanna77]

By the way, I have 46% body fat

I'm 83kg.

Azores :: HOLIDAY228.jpg picture by magna1215 - Photobucket

[Orecle]

[QUOTE=alexplatups;361212]

As far as weight loss, maintaining your weight, or weight gain, calories are
the most important element, period!if you consume more calories during the day than your body burns, then this
excess calories will be converted to body fat and driven into your fat cells

So if it takes a person 3500 cals to maintain weight, and less to lose. If fat loss is calories burnt. Can i eat 3400 calories of hershey bars, fried chicken and chips and milk shake and lose fat like a person who has 3600 calories from veg and lean source protein and rice?

Is the calories from a donut equal to that of a chicken salad, where fat loss is concened

Originally Posted by alexplatups

plus meal frequency is only third in line as far as importance for weight loss,
with calories being first, and nutrient ratios second

See for us endomorphs, nutrient ratio is far more important. Ectomorphs and mesomorphs can out eat us and not gain. For us endomorphs, carbs espieacally with fats (cakes, chips, burgers, ice cream ) is what makes us fat.

Originally Posted by alexplatups

I eat four meals per day (from 800 to 900 calories per meal) about every
four hours and I eat only natural products, that have not been processed,
I do eat fish and lean protein sources, but in the future will look into
switching to soya protein and other non-animal protein sources

Currently about 50% of my daily calories come from natural complex cabs,
both starchy and fibrous, 30% of my daily calories come from lean protein,
and 20% of my daily calories come from good dietary fat

as far as exercise, doing both cardio and weight training I have found to be
the ultimate approach for permanent fat loss

for example, I do cardio training M,W,F,S for 60 minutes and do weight
training T,TH, SAT for about 45 minutes per workout, using a two day split
routine. This allows me to consume 3500 calories per day, and maintain my
ideal weight without any problem (175 pounds/80 Kg)

Your regime is preety solid. Keep it up

[Orecle]

Originally Posted by Susanna77

I love this idea.

I do walk on the beach - very fast pace - for an hour. I take this is OK? Maybe increase it to make it 90mins?

Originally Posted by Susanna77

By the way, I have 46% body fat

I'm 83kg.

Azores :: HOLIDAY228.jpg picture by magna1215 - Photobucket

Judging by your picture, you do not look overweight. You just look like you have a few jiggly bits I do not say this to patronise you eiether.

Low carb is very tough. If you are tempermental, it will times it by 1000. Besides I would rather you eat moderate carbs but do alot of physical exercise (for which you would need fuel) than to be lethargic from low carbs.

I would rather you go to a gym and maybe hire a personal trainer for a week who can help push you by running besides you or walking you through an exercise that will build up a sweat ( I am talking enough sweat to drench 2 tshirts). Besides a personal trainer can set you goals to see you progress from day 1 - 21, where as a walk in the beach on day 1 is the same as day 21. Besides I dont see many walkers pouring with sweat at the end of the workout

[Susanna77]

Originally Posted by Orecle

Judging by your picture, you do not look overweight. You just look like you have a few jiggly bits I do not say this to patronise you eiether.

Low carb is very tough. If you are tempermental, it will times it by 1000. Besides I would rather you eat moderate carbs but do alot of physical exercise (for which you would need fuel) than to be lethargic from low carbs.

I would rather you go to a gym and maybe hire a personal trainer for a week who can help push you by running besides you or walking you through an exercise that will build up a sweat ( I am talking enough sweat to drench 2 tshirts). Besides a personal trainer can set you goals to see you progress from day 1 - 21, where as a walk in the beach on day 1 is the same as day 21. Besides I dont see many walkers pouring with sweat at the end of the workout

The reason why I posted the photo was because a lot of people do not believe me when I say how much I weigh. I was just testing to see if they were being nice or being true.

Jiggly bits? Yep

I really can't afford personal trainers. The only places that have them around here are 5 star resorts. Gym is not currently within our budget. Both husband and I need it (in his case it's a cholestrol problem) but I am willing to do the walk (and we do sweat a lot, maybe because this is a hot climate and we're not fit ). Soon we'll be swimming as well, once the weather is hot enough.

Here's what I'll do. I'll carry on my walks and decrease the carbs at my main meals (basically going back to what it was before crazy nutritionist told me to up the carbs in my diet). If that fails gym will be plan B (following your plan to a T). I'll post this on the challenge forum.

[joelr]

Diet is by far the most important factor in weight loss. I've done many many pre-contest type diets initally for bodybuilding when in my 20's then I continued doing one every winter with slight modifications just to get in shape for summer.
Once I finish 8-14 weeks of dieting, losing 3-4lbs weekly and am at around 6% BF I return my complex carbs to normal but still eat a very strict diet just for the summer. Even with morning cardio and evening weights or boxing/grappling class PLUS a 20 min walk to the subway I still slowly see my abs start to fade over the next few months. One summer I was unemployed and lived pretty much like a pro-athlete. Training, running, walking all day.
I still slowly gained weight just from eating clean foods but eating until I was full and only a few cheats here and there.

One year I tried using less cardio and it didn't hinder my progress in a big way. What did however was one year I used protein bars as meals up to 3x daily and kept my complex carbs at a comfortable level. The first few weeks were ok but getting off the final 20 lbs never happened. My diet ran over my end date and even with extra weeks I never got below 10% BF.

So Dieting is key! Anyone who has ever achieved a Cover of Health and Fitness type body will tell you that.

[liamona]

Originally Posted by newdad

Our bodies convert carbs into energy really easily, and what we don't use at that time is stored (Body fat). On the flip side, it takes more time to digest fat and convert it into energy. Therefore the body is expending more energy in the process and doesn't store nearly as much energy (Fat) in the process. Also, you feel full, so you don't eat as much.

That's exactly what I've found. High fat low carb dieting is the only one way I can lose weight and keep my blood sugar stable. It works so well, that I end up eating far too few calories if I'm not careful.

Yes, there is an adjustment period in the beginning of the diet as your body makes the conversion from using carbs to using fats for energy, but that's about the only down side for me.

This is a great group to get some support and look up information on the diet:

LowCarbHighFat : Low_Carb_&_High_Fat_Diet

Almost all of our fat and cholesterol is produced from our bodies when we consume carbohydrates. We don't absorb it through eating fat or cholesterol. Plus, many, many of our nutrients that we need are found in fat.

Not to mention, you can't absorb very many nutrients unless you also eat fat with the food. There's been quite a few studies that show you make a higher carotenoid to vitamin A conversion when you eat fats with food, for instance:

Carotenoid bioavailability is higher from salads ingested with full-fat than with fat-reduced salad dressings as measured with electrochemical detection -- Brown et al. 80 (2): 396 -- American Journal of Clinical Nutrition

Originally Posted by Susanna77

Last year I lost approx. 14 kg on a low carb, low cal diet. But I felt ill most of the time. By ill I mean: dizziness, unfocused brain, tiredeness, bad mood, etc. And I was hungry all the time and often had to grab something which then led me to feel guilty.

You probably weren't eating enough fat.

If I wanted to do a round the clock high protein diet (with no fruit or very limited fruit) is it OK to have those protein poweder shakes sold at sports shops?

It's best to just stick with whole food sources of protein. And just moderate amounts—isn't the formula to take your weight in pounds, divide the number in half and eat that many grams of protein a day?

Originally Posted by newdad

80% of weight-loss comes from diet 20% from exercise. There is also evidence in Good Carbs Bad Carbs that shows more exercise doesn't necessarily equate to more weight loss.

That is an excellent book, I can't recommend it enough. He's also well-known for this great article published in the New York Times:

What if It's All Been a Big Fat Lie? - The New York Times

He gave the following presentation to UC Berkley's Public School of Health, but I've been having trouble viewing it with my Real Player:

"The Quality of Calories: What Makes Us Fat and Why Nobody Seems to Care"

UC Berkeley Webcasts | Video and Podcasts

Also, a calorie deficit doesn't always equate to weight loss. There are pockets of severe poverty where the population is completely malnourished, often surviving on a slice of bread and some coffee each day yet are obese.

Sad, isn't it? To be fat and malnourished?

I gained a lot of weight on a low fat diet. It's just impossible for me to stick to, because by the end of the day I'm starving. It didn't help to exercise, either, which really sucked.

Originally Posted by Susanna77

By the way, I have 46% body fat

I'm 83kg.

Azores :: HOLIDAY228.jpg picture by magna1215 - Photobucket

What a lovely picture!

[alexplatups]

[QUOTE=Orecle;361271]

Originally Posted by alexplatups

So if it takes a person 3500 cals to maintain weight, and less to lose. If fat loss is calories burnt. Can i eat 3400 calories of hershey bars, fried chicken and chips and milk shake and lose fat like a person who has 3600 calories from veg and lean source protein and rice?

Is the calories from a donut equal to that of a chicken salad, where fat loss is concened

Orecle,

A person who eats 3600 calories from veg and lean source protein and rice,
would burn a lot of those calories during digestion, because protein has about
30% thermic effect, and vegs and rice about 10-15%, this means that the
net calorie would be about 2800 when the thermic effect is factored in

but if a person at 3400 worth of chocolate bars, fried chicken, chips and
milkshake, and split this up into four meals with 850 calories per meal, then
they would lose weight, because there would be a 100 calorie deficit

the health factor would matter though, the person would feel like sh**,
after eating that, especially if he/she had a slow metabolism, this person
would have to weigh a lot actually to have a metabolism that can burn
3500 calories per day, but for this example we can imagine that this is so

and as far as calories being the most important does not mean that nutrient
ratios, and meal frequency is unimportant, this all has to be taken into
account, and since you seem to know about healthy eating and the way our
bodies work with digesting food, you must also know there is nothing
exact when it comes to food

this is why there has to be a way of tracking the results you get from your
nutrition and exercise program, weekly is best, bi-weekly is better

I track my total body fat weight and lean body mass bi-weekly, using a
weight loss chart, and when I see my total fat weight going up, then I stop
my cheat meals, and do my cardio with a little more intensity, and within
a month I get it back down

I simply love to eat things like chocolate cake, brownies and cheese cake,
and allow myself 3-5 cheat meals per week, the only thing is I eat them
in the morning with breakfast, and most of the time my exercise seems to
take care of these calories, but sometimes I overdo it and gain a pound or two

and then of course I cut down to only 3 cheat meals and use more intensity
during my cardio work outs, plus sometimes I use morning fasted cardio,
which for me does wonders, and it is how I lost most of my body fat that
I gained when I was in my early twenties (now I am 39)

the rest of the time I eat only healthy food and stay within my calorie limit
and stick to my 50-30-20 nutrient ratio, and this allows me not to feel
anything after eating the unhealthy cheat meals in the morning

by the way, when I tried eating my cheat meals in the eve (this is when I truly
want to eat them) I gained weight so fast I did not know what hit me,
those fat calories, just go straight into fat cells in the evening and during
the night when I sleep, so I stick to morning cheat meals

[alexplatups]

Originally Posted by Susanna77

The reason why I posted the photo was because a lot of people do not believe me when I say how much I weigh. I was just testing to see if they were being nice or being true.

You look excellent in that photo, you know women do carry 5% more fat
than mean (on the average) and where did you find out you have 46%
body fat? Sure does not look like it to me?

[liamona]

Originally Posted by alexplatups

by the way, when I tried eating my cheat meals in the eve (this is when I truly
want to eat them) I gained weight so fast I did not know what hit me,
those fat calories, just go straight into fat cells in the evening and during
the night when I sleep, so I stick to morning cheat meals

That's interesting! I think it's important to incorporate a few cheats (at least once every two weeks), but I usually have done so in the evening. I'll have to keep that in mind for my next one.

I have to admit that I do eat more carbs in the summer, because it's too hard for me to resist fresh fruit.

You look excellent in that photo, you know women do carry 5% more fat
than mean (on the average) and where did you find out you have 46%
body fat? Sure does not look like it to me?

Me neither.

[Orecle]

Originally Posted by alexplatups

Orecle,

but if a person at 3400 worth of chocolate bars, fried chicken, chips and
milkshake, and split this up into four meals with 850 calories per meal, then
they would lose weight, because there would be a 100 calorie deficit

and as far as calories being the most important does not mean that nutrient
ratios, and meal frequency is unimportant, this all has to be taken into
account, and since you seem to know about healthy eating and the way our
bodies work with digesting food, you must also know there is nothing
exact when it comes to food

I track my total body fat weight and lean body mass bi-weekly, using a
weight loss chart, and when I see my total fat weight going up, then I stop
my cheat meals, and do my cardio with a little more intensity, and within
a month I get it back down

I simply love to eat things like chocolate cake, brownies and cheese cake,
and allow myself 3-5 cheat meals per week, the only thing is I eat them
in the morning with breakfast, and most of the time my exercise seems to
take care of these calories, but sometimes I overdo it and gain a pound or two

and then of course I cut down to only 3 cheat meals and use more intensity
during my cardio work outs, plus sometimes I use morning fasted cardio,
which for me does wonders, and it is how I lost most of my body fat that
I gained when I was in my early twenties (now I am 39)

by the way, when I tried eating my cheat meals in the eve (this is when I truly
want to eat them) I gained weight so fast I did not know what hit me,
those fat calories, just go straight into fat cells in the evening and during
the night when I sleep, so I stick to morning cheat meals

I do not deny the importance of watching calories, but i still see it as equal or even less than nutrient ratio as partaining to endomorphs.

Also timing - even eating the same calories later in the day as opposed to later at night will have a major difference to fat burning. this why people are adviced to forego carbs after 6pm.

As you said - tracking calories eaten or burnt is an impossible task. I think wen people advice people to cut calories , the client just guesstimates wat they think is enough. But then how many peoples go on starvation diets and then after 2 weeks their weight loss stops. then they introduce more calories and fat loss begins again.

In my opinion if you dont know or cant watch the calories entering your mouth, then blast up your met and burn calories with cardio.

As you know alot of overweight people dont eat more than skinny people. Pesky genetic metabolism is wat gets them fat.

[Susanna77]

Originally Posted by alexplatups

You look excellent in that photo, you know women do carry 5% more fat
than mean (on the average) and where did you find out you have 46%
body fat? Sure does not look like it to me?

The nutritionists had a fat measuring machine, where they insert your data (weight, age, height, gender), then you place your thumbs on the said machine, and that was the result. I have one of those machines at home now and they both confirmed the same score.

One nutritionist (they had various at the chemist where I used to go for the appointments) said I am "big boned" and my ideal weight would be 70-75kg and that it wasn't realistic to go any lower. Yet another one wanted me to get to 56kg which even I know it's impossible. I was that weight once at 18 after severe dieting and people told me quite bluntly I looked awful like that.

It's quite overwhelming the amount of information available out there and having "experts" in nutrition having completly different views of the same issues.

Before I exercised today I had to eat sweets so I could stand the exercise, which I was told to do if blood sugar levels were below 100. It was 87. My doubt is also can someone with low blood sugar issues exercise without resorting to carbs? Is it safe for those with sudden drops in blood sugar levels?

[alexplatups]

Originally Posted by Orecle

I do not deny the importance of watching calories, but i still see it as equal or even less than nutrient ratio as partaining to endomorphs.

Also timing - even eating the same calories later in the day as opposed to later at night will have a major difference to fat burning. this why people are adviced to forego carbs after 6pm.

As you said - tracking calories eaten or burnt is an impossible task. I think wen people advice people to cut calories , the client just guesstimates wat they think is enough. But then how many peoples go on starvation diets and then after 2 weeks their weight loss stops. then they introduce more calories and fat loss begins again.

In my opinion if you dont know or cant watch the calories entering your mouth, then blast up your met and burn calories with cardio.

As you know alot of overweight people dont eat more than skinny people. Pesky genetic metabolism is wat gets them fat.

I guess in reality, when it comes to endomorphs, for us everything is
important, and calories and nutrient ratios and meal frequency/timing, at
least when it comes to nutrition, plus of course drinking plenty of water

except for my morning coffee (black no sugar) at work every day, the rest of
the day I drink close to a gallon (4 litres) of water

and the frequency/timing is without a doubt makes the biggest difference,
in the evening for my last meal I mostly eat the smallest portion of the day

I eat at 7am, 11 am, 3 pm and then 7 pm, no snacks in between, only
water (my favorite snack now a days)

and yes about the metabolism, the only reason I maintain my weight is
because of the four cardio sessions that I do weekly, and to lose the extra
50 pounds of body fat that I gained in my early twenties I was doing double
daily cardio almost every day, plus the first cardio was fasted morning cardio

worked great when I had a lot of body fat, but when I got to about 15%
body fat it stopped working so well, and I started to lose muscle, so I had
to switch and start doing cardio four days per week, after work, before my
last meal, this way I do not have to burn my dinner, and can burn some
body fat during my session

but you know the biggest problem that I see with most people that can't lose
unwanted body fat permanently, is that they are focused on the process, the
steps that they must take toward their major health goal (ideal weight)

and this is what I was doing when I started my first attempts many years
ago, but then I designed a system for myself where I focus on a vision of
future myself and track my current reality on a daily, weekly and bi-weekly
basis. When I started doing this, I started doing double cardio and did
everything possile to learn about nutrition and how our bodies work

this is also when I discovered about my body type, that I was an endomorph,
and that there are ectomorphs and mesomorphs, that are born with high
metabolisms and if I wanted to get lean, I will have to do cardio for the rest
of my life, and will have to eat almost perfectly (except for my 3-5 cheat
meals, that I eat during my breakfasts) these meals are not really additional
calories, I just replace my regular food and eat a cheesecake, or something
else that I love, and eat smaller portions during the rest of the day

it is not easy to maintain my weight, meaning I have to do a lot of exercise,
and most of the time I eat food that is not the most delicious thing in the
world, but my desire is so strong to have a lean, healthy body, that I will
never stop what I am doing for nothing in the world

[alexplatups]

Originally Posted by Susanna77

The nutritionists had a fat measuring machine, where they insert your data (weight, age, height, gender), then you place your thumbs on the said machine, and that was the result. I have one of those machines at home now and they both confirmed the same score.

One nutritionist (they had various at the chemist where I used to go for the appointments) said I am "big boned" and my ideal weight would be 70-75kg and that it wasn't realistic to go any lower. Yet another one wanted me to get to 56kg which even I know it's impossible. I was that weight once at 18 after severe dieting and people told me quite bluntly I looked awful like that.

It's quite overwhelming the amount of information available out there and having "experts" in nutrition having completly different views of the same issues.

Before I exercised today I had to eat sweets so I could stand the exercise, which I was told to do if blood sugar levels were below 100. It was 87. My doubt is also can someone with low blood sugar issues exercise without resorting to carbs? Is it safe for those with sudden drops in blood sugar levels?

In that photo it looks like the nutritionest that said your weight should be
between 70-75kg is closer to being right. You definately do not look like you
are even close to 46% BF

And I think questions about what to do when you have low blood sugar
issues should be answered by a medical proffesional that you can find through
recommendations, because when it comes to health, it is important to get
advice from people that have some serious experience in these areas

[alexplatups]

here is another page I created using SBI block by block builder on my site

Weight Loss Plans, Permanent Fat Loss, Create Ideal Weight, Low Calorie Diets

these are the simplest and most effective steps someone can take toward
creating permanent fat loss...imo