It's hard being Vegan

[Bruce Achterberg]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

PF chang's is especially accomodating. You can order any of their meat dishes and substitute tofu. So we get the sweet and sour tofu, or orange peel tofu, etc. Their coconut curry veggies are wonderful too. Schezuan green beans. Rice. Tofu lettuce wraps. Etc. [...]

Cheeseless pizza with all the veggies is wonderful.

Thanks for your response, Erin.

If any one is interested in recipe ideas, I managed to find the websites for PF Chang's, The Cheesecake Factory, and the California Pizza Kitchen, all with menu information (which, again, is great for stealing recipe ideas ):

Welcome to P.F. Chang's China Bistro

The Cheesecake Factory :: Menu :. Welcome

California Pizza Kitchen | Menu (the pizza from here looks really great. It's not just that Pizza Hut cardboard rubbish)

I found The Cheesecake Factory menu to look particularly appetising, although overwhelmingly diverse in what is available. Do you (or anyone else) have any recommendations or favourite meal choices from there?

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

They [PF Chang's] use separate oil for all their dishes.

Other Asian restaurants I've been to do the same. I find it fascinating to see that process in action (maybe I'm just weird, heh ). The places I've been to that do that have these large gas stoves things mounted on a stainless steel... err... “appliance” that has a constant stream of water flowing over the surface, kind of like a fountain. Took me a while to figure out what the hell they were at first, but once I saw one of the staff cleaning a wok using the water fountain-thingy after he had made a meal (and hence, getting rid of old oil), it clicked.

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

But if you're used to making great home made meals, you may be disappointed with veganizing foods at restaurants. I, however, don't get much time to cook so it's a nice treat to have an interesting meal out.

I too find it nice to be able to go out into a different environment and eat something different to what you would usually make at home. It's a different experience. Plus it's great not to have to deal with the cooking or washing up. (Although I do find cooking quite educational and especially rewarding when you can make something well.)

[ReallyGoodIdeas]

Yeah - I've been dairy free for 24 years now (with short lapses), last September, I stopped buying and cooking meat (note the "out" there to make it easy going out) from last December I went grain free as well. This year I've moved slowly towards raw vegan with no grains. I still break out and get fish and chips or chocolate occasionally.

My friends have given up inviting me for dinner as they think they have the hang of it then I change again!! I usually eat at home or order a salad. My old favourite lunch place knew my order as "the warm chicken salad with no chicken and extra salad". The only way I could get a meat free salald there!

Because of my dairy thing, I've been reading ingredient labels for ever. Egad - I wouldn't buy something unless I knew what was in it!! I buy mostly fruit and vegies now, so labels aren't a problem! I'm finding my food processor to be my best friend and meal preparation a cinch!

Occassionally I still go out and get a cooked vegie thing or even meat if I feel the urge, but it's becoming less and less since I've been on the green smoothies.

I find saying "no thank you", usually fine, and I bore a lot of my friends with my rapture over my increased health and vitality, which I put down to diet mainly. If everyone knew how good it feels they'd all do it! I also always keep some nuts and dried or fresh fruit in my bag just in case. If I were working over the weekend I'd be bringing my own these days, I just know it's going to be nicer tasting and better for me! It's a positive choice!

joy to you all
Hazel

[free spirit]

Going vegan was the most natural and beautiful thing I have ever done for my body. And it was so easy. The hard part was coming to terms with how people are so dependent on meat and dairy!

Initially I lost 17lb, without doing a thing. Believe me I like my food!

The most amusing thing I find is the typical response I get from people when it comes up in conversation...

1) You're vegan?! (incredulous tone)
2) What do you eat?
3) I couldn't live without meat/cheese/cream ect ect

Like I havent heard that a million times before.

However, on the plus side, my family have been supportive, and I now get requests to cook "weirdo food" as everyone really likes it! My partner has decided to give veganism a go for a month as he has seen some very positive changes in me. My work collegues, have been very tolerant, organising Christmas dinner with my dietry requirements in mind, and scanning the back of food lables on my behalf when we have goodies brought into the office for us. Friends/associates have been very curious about the change in lifestyle and I have now become the local "vegan expert"!

[VeganMelissa]

Originally Posted by Cynic

What's the problem dietwise with the gifts of chocolate you got over the holidays?
Chocolate is fulla' great antioxidant compounds and a great lipid profile.
100grams a day is excellent food!

I agree. The chocolate I recieved was all milk chocolate. I made the best of it by bringing the chocolate with me to party's and offering it to guest when they came to visit. I had a rough first holiday season as a vegan. I didn't expect to feel this way but then day after day I was being questioned about being vegan and then handed a box of milk chocolates. It was very frustrating. I'm learning to deal with it differently now, thanks to everyones advice!

[usagi]

Well, I am vegan now, but a few months ago I was not and one good friend of mine was. I would often get a little annoyed when we went out to eat and he only got vegan food, usually there was some small reason, like we wanted to get two dishes and share. Thanksgiving at his apartment was a bit unusual as well. Also it was really easy to forget he was vegan and what exactly that meant, like we'd go to a restraunt and I'd ask if he wanted to try whatever I had and totally forget it had cheese or something in. There are so many things that have animal products that it's quite easy to forget - chocolate is one of those that's just so just common, you wouldn't think twice about giving it to someone (although everyone I know knows I hate milk chocolate and love dark chocolate I'm very vocal about that). There were some chips I wanted the other day, but in reading the ingredients I saw they contained milk.. who would think that CHIPS had animal products in them? In my experience being vegetarian is a lot easier to deal with just because it's pretty obvious when something has meat in it or not. That's just my experience, having recently been non-vegan.

[seeker5]

Originally Posted by VeganMelissa

I didn't expect to feel this way but then day after day I was being questioned about being vegan and then handed a box of milk chocolates. It was very frustrating. I'm learning to deal with it differently now, thanks to everyones advice!

Well, I've certainly learned something from this thread. Today is my second day of trying a 30 day trial of being a vegan, and until I read your thread, I didn't realize Chocolate contained dairy...! I had made a list of everything I wouldn't eat that I would previously eat, I had done some reading and some research but I just didn't come across that fact about chocolate. It's possible that those people at your office, who aren't even interested in being a vegan may not have known that, or may have forgotten about it if you told them?

[SunnKali]

Seeker -- you can find chocolate that does not contain dairy. From the labels I've read, dark chocolate is usually not made with dairy. You can check the labels at the store. The flavor is more intense, but still good. There are several good brands at the health food store, and if you have a Trader Joe's near you, they have excellent dark chocolate.

[seeker5]

Originally Posted by SunnKali

Seeker -- you can find chocolate that does not contain dairy. From the labels I've read, dark chocolate is usually not made with dairy. You can check the labels at the store. The flavor is more intense, but still good. There are several good brands at the health food store, and if you have a Trader Joe's near you, they have excellent dark chocolate.

Oooooh ok. Thanks.

[saharady]

i've been vegan for 2 months now
and i find the same problems as you do
this information here truley helps me stay true to the decision i have made
becasue at times it gets really though when other people don't care to change their lifestyles and continue eating unhealthy.

i always have to remind myself that i should still be respectful and considerate for where they are at in their lives.
i tend to get frustrated at them for not making a change. but everyday i have to remind myself that everyone is doing the best that they know of.

peace
saharaw

[saharady]

hi agian,

by the way if you like more support and motivation there is a great site that i enjoy visiting where i am a member and recieve great newsletters:
http://www.rawvegan.com/

hope this will help
it has helped me in many ways.

cheers
saharaw

[Amandaaa]

Do I just work with a bunch of inconsiderate people or has anyone else experienced this?

well, regardless of whether you're vegan or not, people can get cranky if you make special requests specifically for yourself. i generally don't go around announcing that i'm vegan, and i try not to be an imposition on anyone- at any time. there's almost always at least one option on the menu that i can eat. so unless i'm going to a vegan/vegetarian restaurant, i don't ask the wait staff to whip up a special meal with vegan cheese and vegan this-and-that. you can always fall back on a big salad with a plate of steamed vegetables. or sushi (vegetable rolls), edamame, or something like that.
i get enough variety on my own time, so i try not to make a big scene when i go out. i think those kind of events are more about socializing than eating, anyway.

...many people react negatively to people choosing a healthy lifestyle because it seems to others that this person thinks that he or she is "better"

^i agree. i don't want to come off as being "superior" or "special" or whatever, so i've always been pretty hush-hush about my dietary choices. i only speak up when asked. if i'm offered a piece of chicken, i don't say, "i can't, i'm vegan" -- i just say, "no thanks, i don't eat meat."

most people, once they get to know you, will be more accepting of your personal choices.
my friends used to think that i was really weird with food, but now, all of my close friends and family get it. they know how i feel about animals (and consuming animals), so they respect my personal decisions. and a lot of them have started to develop the same empathy.

so now, if me and my friends make dinner together, they voluntarily offer to cook the meat (and cheese) separately so that i can serve my plate first. we go to restaurants where we know there's more than just meat dishes. my roommate has even adopted many of my dietary habits. she used to think it was weird, but now when we make dinner together, all i hear is: "wow, that was really good- and really filling!" she always acts shocked.

so anyway, be patient. and try not to get annoyed with people if they offer you non-vegan food. in their mind, they live in a non-vegan world, so they probably don't even think twice about it.

[Amandaaa]

(actually, on second thought, i really like Erin's ideas:

At events, I like to contact the catering manager directly and ask for a vegan meal. I make a simple request like a fruit plate or grilled veggies in just oil.

go up to the person in charge of ordering for the event and say, "Hi Mary, as you know I'm vegan. I was wondering if you were planning to order anything for this event that I'll be able to eat. If not, I'll just plan to bring my own food or eat before I come. I just wanted to find out the situation in advance."

...i guess sometimes it is a good thing to speak up!

and maybe if they see that there's a higher demand for vegan food, they'll start providing more options, and it'll become more widespread. )

[Bruce Achterberg]

Originally Posted by Amandaaa

(actually, on second thought, i really like Erin's ideas:

...i guess sometimes it is a good thing to speak up!

and maybe if they see that there's a higher demand for vegan food, they'll start providing more options, and it'll become more widespread. )

I've been vegan for over a year now, and I'm still going great. It's much easier then it was when I started. I originally thought the diet would be difficult to maintain, but it's more of a slump of lessons you have to learn, and once you've learned them, you're more equipped so it's easier.

In actually done both of the things Erin's describes, and everything worked out fine. In fact, I was actually pretty pleased with a vegan meal that was made for me by a catering service at a local RSL.

So long as you're dealing with reasonable people, you won't really have any problems (or so I find). Unreasonable people who have resistance to your diet choice can cause problems, but you eventually learn to avoid them. At first you may think that they are resisting you, but their resistance is really they're own and you're just acting as someone they can project onto. It's not pleasant, but people will be people.

You'll still find them people who don't support your diet choice, but you learn to live in harmony with them more effectively with experience. Before I didn't know what *I* had to do to do this (you expect people to act the same as they always do -- reasonable -- but alas, sometimes they don't), so encountering such people was unpleasant, but now it's fine.

Be aware that you are the one who has to make a change in yourself usually. That said, I've since found that a lot of people who were previously resistant to my vegan diet have either (A) accepted that "ok, he's serious, my protest won't really do anything so I won't bother", or (B) started to take a few lessons from me by dropping things like milk. Oh, the irony.

Do be aware that you have to take a lot more responsibility as a vegan because the world doesn't really cater to you any more, but it's part of the territory. At least it's good that most people these days actually know what a vegan is.

If I was to offer some simple advice to people going vegan, it would be this:

Enjoy the positive reports people often share about the diet, but understand that they often don't share the full story (ie. they may leave out info about their transition phase), and you won't always experience the same results they get. Be prepared to have your own unique experiences, and even if things seem difficult at first, hang in there -- you'll learn a lot from experience, so the more you stick with it, the better equipped you'll be.

Ultimately though, hold true to your intention for trying out veganism and don't let the pro- or anti-vegan hype impact your vision. Intelligently consider information from all sources, but do be aware of who is giving you the information (ie. where it came from), and try to see the whole picture instead of just the attractive (or sometimes, negative) fragments of information.

[Groundless]

For what it's worth"

As a meat eating cave-man style mostly raw food eater it is just as difficult as you describe at social events.

I feel best when I eat meat. Vegan was/is not for me. But I would not try to shove meat/animal on someone who overtly stated they were eating Vegan. It's a kind of social aggression isn't it, if I would do that? The whole meat-vegan argument can get pretty heated.

[VeganMelissa]

Well, It's been well over a year now since I changed to a Vegan diet and I'm still going strong. There is one woman who does the ordering for food when we have to work the weekends and she now always orders veggie sandwiches for me. I have to get there first to get one because if I wait they are all gone in a matter of minutes. Which just proves the point that other people do like the types of food I eat. (Just don't call it Vegan. )

On to Chocolate.... Whole foods had a good selection of vegan chocolate and it's not dark, dark chocolate. Most regular grocery stores, Shoprite, Stop & Shop etc do not carry vegan chocolate. This is because they carry the hersheys chocolate, dove, etc... Even dark chocolate in these brands almost always have some sort of milk in it. I have found Rose City Chocolates. They are in Boonton NJ but the have a website and they ship all over the country. They are the freshest chocolates I've ever had. My girlfriend now orders them for me for my birthday or valentines day. Check them out...
Gourmet Chocolate, Belgian Chocolates, and Chocolate Gifts from Belgium

[Erin Pavlina]

Rose City Chocolates are my current favorite. I love their hazelnut collection. When I was still running VegFamily I had them make me up a special hazelnut only collection and I was going to sell it through VegFamily. Good stuff over there!

[Trezker]

I'd like all you vegans to say "No thanks, I'm driving" whenever someone offers you something non-vegan. Just as if it's a completely rational explanation to why you don't want that cookie.

[VeganMelissa]

Originally Posted by Trezker

I'd like all you vegans to say "No thanks, I'm driving" whenever someone offers you something non-vegan. Just as if it's a completely rational explanation to why you don't want that cookie.

That's a good idea. I'm going to try that!