Fluoride in County Water

[Dan.Linehan]

I wrote the Marin County water board to see if the water has fluoride in it.

Sure enough, it does.

Hi Dan,

Yes, the water provided by MMWD contains fluoride. Fluoride occurs naturally in almost all surface and ground waters. In this area, the natural concentration is 0.1 milligrams per liter. Following a voter initiative by MMWD customers in 1972, the fluoride level was increased to 0.9 milligrams per liter, the optimum for cavity prevention. California now requires fluoridation by all public water supplies that serve populations over 10,000.

State and federal regulations have set limits on the maximum concentration of fluoride in drinking water. These limits take into consideration that fluoride is also consumed via toothpaste, mouthwash, foods, and beverages. The primary federal standard is 4 PPM to prevent skeletal fluorosis and the federal secondary standard (for aesthetic factors) is 2 PPM to prevent dental fluorosis, a cosmetic darkening of the teeth. California regulations are typically more stringent than federal standards. The California primary and secondary regulatory limits in California are 2.4 PPM and 1.2 PPM respectively. For drinking water meeting either regulation, there are no adverse health effects and the limits provide for an ample margin of safety.

Please consider that there are many water sources (particularly groundwater) with naturally occurring fluoride levels at optimal (about 1 PPM) concentration and also at levels far above optimum (2 to 4 PPM). People have consumed naturally fluoridated water for generations and health researchers have studied the effects on generation after generation. The vast body of science-based, peer-reviewed research has found that there is a comfortable margin of safety between the optimal dose for cavity prevention and a dose that would create any health effect.

Here are some links to information about fluoridation:

From the National Cancer Institute
Fluoridated Water: Questions and Answers - National Cancer Institute

And from the American Dental Association
ADA.org: A-Z Topics: Fluoride & Fluoridation

And from the American Medical Association
JAMA -- Achievements in Public Health, 1900-1999: Fluoridation of Drinking Water to Prevent Dental Caries, March 8, 2000, 283 (10): 1283

Fluoride Fact Sheet from Los Angeles, which has recently started fluoridation and has compiled many links to national and California health organizations that support fluoridation including American Dental Association, American Medical Association, US Surgeon General, US Center for Disease Control, and many others.

LADWP: Fluoridation Fact Sheet

Sincerely,
Libby Pischel

[RRR]

The other day I was researching Monoamine oxidase inhibitor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And I stumbled across a little fluoride nugget.

Many formulations have forms of fluoride attached to assist in permeating the blood-brain barrier, which is suspected as a factor in pineal gland effects.

MAOI inhibits MAO-A and MAO-B, these enzymes break down a wide array of brain chemicals. As well, they are responsible for destroying N-N-DMT, which is a drug naturally produced by the pineal gland (the third eye in eastern mysticism).

I'm curious if fluoride directly interacts with and potentially damages the pineal gland.

Fluoride & the Pineal Gland

It is now known - thanks to the meticulous research of Dr. Jennifer Luke from the University of Surrey in England - that the pineal gland is the primary target of fluoride accumulation within the body.

The information I have gathered talks mostly about the pineal glands role in puberty, and fluoride could be responsible for increasing the onset of this. My current hypothesis is that the damage caused by fluoride on our pineal gland directly affects our ability to secrete DMT aswell. DMT may directly be responsible for our ability to dream and potentially connect spiritually with entities beyond our dimension (study dmt, its fascinating).. If you go a step beyond that, Fluoride was first introduced into water supplies in German concentration camps, they found it promoted docility. This campaign was spurred by Sigmund Freuds nephew Edward Bernays, the creator of public relations, author of the book Propaganda...A very important yet unrecognized world figure.

To summarize:

DMT - talk to other dimensions.
Fluoride - Nazi's discover promotes docility. Nazi's are the benchmark of evil for the century. Destroys DMT.

Perhaps there is a spiritual reason fluoride is being placed in our water?

[silicon toad2000]

In adelaide in south australia they add flouride to the city water. Our tooth decay rates dropped signifacantly within a short period of time following the rollout of this addition.
The docility issue is interesting. Adelaide has always been considered a bit docile compared with the rest of the country, with the exception of our northern territory, but thats because they replace the drinking water with beer (kidding)

[sepiagal]

Originally Posted by silicon toad2000

In adelaide in south australia they add flouride to the city water. Our tooth decay rates dropped signifacantly within a short period of time following the rollout of this addition.

A short period of time? How could that be? How did they gather the data to know that tooth decay dropped significantly AND in a short period of time?

I like how Marin County claims how humans have been drinking naturally fuoridated water for years or generations. Why has tooth decay been a problem for so long with naturally fuoridated water and why is adding more fluoride supposed to be better?

[funchy]

Interesting video sharing concerns about fluoride, from Australia:
YouTube - Australia has open eyes to Fluoride (Alex Jones)

Overview of fluoride in US water (Scientific American article), including concerns about it being a endocrine disruptor:
YouTube - The Dangers Of Fluoride

[RRR]

Duhhh.. All new ideas involving chemicals and eugenicists are really old ideas that are completely natural. Now shut up and drink your poison

Most of the fluoridation information is spread by the people selling it, its likely Marin county is just ill informed and trying their best to promote health.

[missing]

Oregon is the only state I know about that doesn't use fluoride in it's municipal water supply. I've often wondered how that effects the state's culture. Portland, for example, is one of the most politically active big cities in the country. All kinds of things have been pioneered here (ie; widespread cycling as transit, the urban growth boundary, etc). Many people here think for themselves, and it isn't just progressive leftist stuff although that is the general culture of Portland. In rural Oregon there is a strong libertarian streak. There are actually many clashes about things like the urban growth boundary between land use regulator and property rights advocates.

Then again it could just be a big coincidence and the only real difference is that Californians make fun of our "bad" teeth.

[lovelyn]

The fluoride put in the water supply is industrial waste. It's not good to ingest industrial waste. That's just common sense.

If your water supply is fluoridated, you should get a water filter that will filter the fluoride out. If you have good oral hygiene and don't chow down on sweets, your teeth will be fine.

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by sepiagal

A short period of time? How could that be? How did they gather the data to know that tooth decay dropped significantly AND in a short period of time?

Of course they can gather data to show that tooth decay dropped significantly and in a short period of time, simply by looking at dental records before and after.

I had answered a post about fluoride in another thread and remembered seeing this one somewhere, and came looking for it.

If you believe fluoride in water is poisonous or otherwise bad for you, then you can avoid it. But attacking fluoride in water as being ineffective in cavity prevention weakens the argument, because scientific studies comparing the same populations before and after fluoridation consistently have found a significant decrease in cavities after fluoridation. It was highly obvious in the 1950s and 1960s when most of the fluoridation was going on.

You can't compare two separate populations, or populations in different countries. It has to be the same community, and within a relatively short time frame, to control for widespread changes in lifestyle in the community that take place over many years.

[missing]

Originally Posted by moonrambler

If you believe fluoride in water is poisonous or otherwise bad for you, then you can avoid it. But attacking fluoride in water as being ineffective in cavity prevention weakens the argument, because scientific studies comparing the same populations before and after fluoridation consistently have found a significant decrease in cavities after fluoridation. It was highly obvious in the 1950s and 1960s when most of the fluoridation was going on.

irregardless of tooth decay prevention, the bolded is a bad argument. Fluoride is not that easy to avoid. Most people use municipal, not well, water. Many water filters do not remove fluoride, and those that do can be expensive (discriminating against lesser income people). Plus, I don't know if there is official verification for if they even work. Reverse osmosis and distilled water works but it removes ALL minerals which can cause health problems. Bottled water is pricey and many brands (as Steve has noted) still fluoridate, and it's often not even labeled! Even if you block fluoride in your home water supply, what about when out in public? Water fountains are no good, you need to buy (more $$$) bottled water. What about when eating out or at a friends? The food was probably cooked in fluoridated water.

sorry but the "you can avoid it" argument simply does not fly with me. If you are rich and have lots of time on your hands, avoiding it is easy. If you have to manage money and have other concerns in life, it's a PITA. How about people can add it if they go out of THEIR way to choose? Other wise leave forced medication OUT of our public water supply.

[moonrambler]

Originally Posted by missing

sorry but the "you can avoid it" argument simply does not fly with me. If you are rich and have lots of time on your hands, avoiding it is easy. If you have to manage money and have other concerns in life, it's a PITA. How about people can add it if they go out of THEIR way to choose? Other wise leave forced medication OUT of our public water supply.

Ok, I worded my response wrong. What I should have said was that if you believe fluoride is poisonous or otherwise bad, you certainly can continue your fight against its being included in the water supply. However, it will be tough if part of your argument is that fluoride doesn't do what dentists claim it does, because research results are extremely strong in that regard. The argument has to be that the positive results are not worth the health hazards.

Earlier, sepiagal said: Marin County claims how humans have been drinking naturally fuoridated water for years or generations. Why has tooth decay been a problem for so long with naturally fuoridated water and why is adding more fluoride supposed to be better?

Certain small regions have naturally-occurring fluoride in well water, which is how dentists originally discovered fluoride's beneficial qualities, because people in these areas had significantly lower rates of cavities. I don't know if studies have been done to see if these people had other health issues relating to the fluoride, other than tooth discoloration because the fluoride levels were rather high.