Weight loss - what really gives long-term results?

[DrMartinRussell]

I am wondering what evidence there is for results of any and all weight loss treatments, therapies etc etc in the long-term ie beyond 5 years.

I'm not really after individual success stories, more the research etc.

I suspect the best evidence will be for surgical options because they will have been studied more fully, but I want to know all the results that are around.

Any suggestions of what is out there or where to begin looking?

Thanks,

[Uplift]

As a personal trainer with over 30 years experience, my observations are that the only succesful long term way to being a chosen weight, or physical condition, is to totally ditch the 'weight loss' outlook. Totally embracing the desired physical state, and the thinking which creates and supports it necessary. Then, anything that falls outside of that criteria isn't viewed as pleasurable and rewarding, so isn't sought after or missed. Otherwise, trying to lose weight is unconsciously viewed as temporary, and is still clinging to an old pattern, which is based on denial of percieved pleasure, and which is ultimately doomed.

One of the biggest scams and suck ins, are weight loss supplements in Australia. There is tons of research and evidence showing that a combination of ephedrine, caffeine and asprin (ECA) will cause weight loss, in particular fat loss. However, relying on them isn't healthy and still promotes the issue mentioned previously. The classic is, the US products based on the stack are sold in Australia, using the identical ads quoting the same research, etc as in the US, despite the fact that ephedrine is illegal in Australia, and a useless substitute is used. Off the subject, many such US products utilising substances banned in Australia, are pedalled here in the same way. Blatent rip offs.

[DrMartinRussell]

Originally Posted by Uplift

There is tons of research and evidence showing that a combination of ephedrine, caffeine and asprin (ECA) will cause weight loss

Really? Long-term, as in 5+ years. I'd like to see that material if it exists?

Is there anything other than surgery and habit-change that succeeds long-term?

[Uplift]

Originally Posted by DrMartinRussell

Really? Long-term, as in 5+ years. I'd like to see that material if it exists?

Is there anything other than surgery and habit-change that succeeds long-term?

I don't know about clinical studies of 5 years or more, but unfortunately in actual real world examples, plenty of bodybuilders have taken it for much longer and swear by it.


Industry Insider Vol. 8 - Brown Fat and the Myth of ECA Cycling

Ephedra/Ephedrine Info - Nutricraze :: Health Forum

Ephedrine and Caffeine Research Papers

ECA is one of the only supplements which has demonstrated an increase in fat burning. However it only works with continued use, which as I said is extremely unhealthy, and does nothing to alter thinking patterns. Either way, drugs, the chop, or the staple gun equals doom in my book. Sooner or later the thoughts will be expressed.

[DrMartinRussell]

Thanks Uplift,

Those links all add up to it being tough to be on this drug for 5+ years, let alone get a lasting benefit.

As to your original suggestion

>totally ditch the 'weight loss' outlook. Totally embracing the desired physical state, and the thinking which creates and supports it necessary. Then, anything that falls outside of that criteria isn't viewed as pleasurable and rewarding, so isn't sought after or missed.

I assume that's your personal approach from your decades as a trainer, but could you calculate what percentage of people who begin this have made it last for themselves long-term? Are you working off any basic plan eg Atkins, calorie-counting etc etc?

[Uplift]

Originally Posted by DrMartinRussell

Thanks Uplift,

Those links all add up to it being tough to be on this drug for 5+ years, let alone get a lasting benefit.

As to your original suggestion

>totally ditch the 'weight loss' outlook. Totally embracing the desired physical state, and the thinking which creates and supports it necessary. Then, anything that falls outside of that criteria isn't viewed as pleasurable and rewarding, so isn't sought after or missed.

I assume that's your personal approach from your decades as a trainer, but could you calculate what percentage of people who begin this have made it last for themselves long-term? Are you working off any basic plan eg Atkins, calorie-counting etc etc?

Yes, it would be tough, but so is taking steroids, growth hormone, insulin, diuretics, estrogen blockers and so on for more than 5 years, but heaps of people do it with ridiculous results, even despite the legal risk. Ephedrine is illegal in Australia, but heaps of people use it.

The links say a lot of things either way. Like:

"For example, how come they never tell the American people about the large, "double-blind multi-centre trial in general practice" in Denmark (14). That's right, when the media (and the FDA) portray thermogenic supplements as untested and dangerous, it is an outright lie. In fact, in Denmark, ephedrine and caffeine (EC) is "licensed as a prescription drug" (1) and doctors prescribed 9.6 million daily doses over a two year period (14). Ironically, its safety record is one of the reasons why it is such a popular obesity medication.

As we have discussed, if you start the stack at the full dose, some people experience transitory stimulation-related side effects (hand tremor, insomnia, etc.) And even this can be largely avoided if you start with a very low dose. The safety data from Denmark -- after 9.6 million doses -- shows nothing worse than these minor side effects!"

And:

"Anecdotally, this persistent thermogenic effect has been experienced by people who have taken ECA non-stop for many years. Personally, I have taken ECA for over a decade and it still works for me."


One of my few common, applicable to all approaches is simply look in the mirror. It costs nothing and is the most reliable guide. You'll see the facts. Apart from that, each individual requires a totally different plan, depending on mind set, goals and physical and environmental circumstances. An overweight vegetarian, who eventually wants to run distance, is totally different to an overweight meat eater that is a powerlifter trying to make a weight class, or a footballer who has been in off season mode. Is the person a heavy smoker, diabetic, other existing medical conditions, injuries, employment, etc, etc, etc, etc.


Likewise an open minded, confident, easily motivated person who truly wants to change is totally different to a person with low self esteem and ingrained habits, who deep down doesn't mind being overweight. No two people are the same.

My other common denominator is that to get lasting results, it requires embracing a lasting mental change. Its a simple premise that it is ridiculous to continue to do the same things and expect different results.

Calculating what you suggest would require tracking down every person I have trained, and monitoring them for life. Again, when people achieve awesome results, they keep them when they stay focused on that mind set. When people regain weight, they are changing that focus and accepting a new one. Thats my observation over 30 odd years.