the book Truth vs. Falsehood,please read Erin,if you can!

[Rockchick26]

I feel like the floor just got pulled out from underneath me. I just read the book Truth Vs. Falsehood by Dr. David Hawkins,and it's about the muscle test (kinesiology) used to determine the level of consciousness (or truth) about ANYTHING. The book was very believable and made total sense until i got to the very end when he talked about astral realms,spirit guides,dreams,psychics,astral projection,etc. He said all this stuff was false!! In one line,he says highly evolved sages and teachers have warned "not to go there" because astral realms were not spiritual. He relates these things to having paranoid delusions,which trick the mind into thinking something is real when it isn't. I really hate to believe these things aren't real but then this whole book would be one big joke!

So Erin (if you're reading this),are you familiar with kinesiology,or this book? If so,what do you think of what he said? Anyone else have knowledge of this test or this book?

I really hate when two things that i believe in contradict each other

[eskimo]

Rockchick, I can certainly understand what it feels like to have your paradigm called into question. I've experienced it before and I'm sure most people have as well so rest assured you're among kindred spirits.

I'm not familiar with the author or the book but I have been using something called duck-bill muscle testing in my life as a tool for guidance. Although I'm not well-versed on kinesiology, I know there are other forms of muscle testing and the use of a pendulum in divination is also a related tool.

I won't tell you whether what this author says is truth or not or whether what you had believed in up to this point is truth (or not). I will say that the author's ideas are just one man's statements of truth (based on his knowledge and experiences) and that no single being can know ultimate truth, whole truth, and nothing but truth. I believe we can only get closer to ultimate truth (God-perspective) by taking into account and integrating the unique perspectives of all other beings around us.

I hope this gives you some solace. You have people who can understand your predicament. Perhaps some of the others can share with you their account of truth.

Steve

[Rockchick26]

Thanks Steve! What is this duck bill test you were talking about? Oh and speaking of divination,this book says that is false too LOL And i realize that no man can know the whole truth about everything,but this guy isnt claiming he just miraculously knows this stuff,he is saying it is because of kinesiology. Which isnt limited to him,he didnt even discover it. I guess my question is more about kinesiology itself,since other authors and teachers talk about it also. But what i hate is that,according to this guy and this particular test,you can't do it yourself,and you have to be of a certain consciousness to get accurate results. I should post a link to it here for anyone who is unfamiliar with it. Let me find one.

Here's the link to the book on Amazon Amazon.com: Truth vs. Falsehood: How to Tell the Difference: Dr. David R. Hawkins M.D. Ph.D.: Books

[supertom]

from what i remember the book is a trick, he wants you to test the book itself to see if the claims are true, he also says that ACIM and seth books are real, which are channeled.

A paradigm that might help you is that its the I consciousness or god speaking through mediums such as spirit guides

[Erin Pavlina]

I've never had success with kinesiology, and most people I know find muscle-testing ridiculous. I suggest you try it yourself for a while and see what happens. There's no substitute for personal experience.

I think a lot of what Dr. Hawkins has to say is extremely fascinating but I don't really resonate with most of his work. I do know people who swear by him and I know people who think it's ridiculous. Test for yourself and see if it works for you.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by supertom

from what i remember the book is a trick, he wants you to test the book itself to see if the claims are true, he also says that ACIM and seth books are real, which are channeled.

I just bought ACIM but i bought it before i read Dr. Hawkins brag it up. I have never once read anything bad about it. So are you saying channeled things are false? I'm looking forward to reading it and i'm taking it very seriously so i hope i don't get people saying its fake now LOL That would be all i need,i already feel like everything i trust is falling apart!

A paradigm that might help you is that its the I consciousness or god speaking through mediums such as spirit guides

i feel like an idiot, but i'm not quite sure what "paradigm" means and i also dont get what youre saying exactly...are you saying that i should believe that when people talk to spirit guides they are talking to God? Cuz that wasnt really my question,i do want to believe in spirit guides,i just dont like it when something else i really believe in contradicts something else i beleive in. Cuz then obvoiusly one of them is false.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

I've never had success with kinesiology, and most people I know find muscle-testing ridiculous. I suggest you try it yourself for a while and see what happens. There's no substitute for personal experience.

I think a lot of what Dr. Hawkins has to say is extremely fascinating but I don't really resonate with most of his work. I do know people who swear by him and I know people who think it's ridiculous. Test for yourself and see if it works for you.

Interesting! I'm glad you replied Erin! I really hate how something can be so right for some people and so wrong for others,that really doesn't help me at all,it just makes it harder to make a decision! Unfortunately i can't test it for myself because you can't do it alone,and both people have to calibrate over 200 for the results to be accurate,so,i dont know where i'm going to find someone who already knows they are over 200 and can find out if i am by finding someone else who is over 200 to calibrate me Sounds pretty impossible for the average person to accomplish.

[carenkh]

That sounds like a "take what you want, leave the rest" kind of book - it's perfectly fine to do that! No one person has THE truth for everyone. If you google muscle testing you'll find lots of different ways to do it, and you may find people who use his particular method.

[Erin Pavlina]

You can use a pendulum. And I know there's a way to do kinesiology by yourself because I know a ton of people who do it. I never got into it so I can't say how, but I do know it's possible.

Any divination tool has the power you give it. If you believe it will work for you, it will. If you don't, it won't.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by carenkh

That sounds like a "take what you want, leave the rest" kind of book - it's perfectly fine to do that! No one person has THE truth for everyone. If you google muscle testing you'll find lots of different ways to do it, and you may find people who use his particular method.

I guess i just feel like if somebody says anything that is untrue,then why would the rest of their beliefs be true? I know it's probably not good to think this way but i can't help it,i think either someone is genuine or they aren't,not "they lied about this,but not about this!" I have a very screwed up bullcrap radar LOL So I tend to believe almost anything that I learn because i can't tell the difference. Maybe that's why i bought that book because i want to know how to figure out what things are true and what aren't. Now i'll go and research 'pendulums' and then tomorrow i'll run across someone that says you can't trust them

[NDavid]

Alot of experts have contradicting theories on things, it doesn't necissarily mean that they're lying and trying to manipulate, no-one can be right 100% of the time and no-one has all the truth. I've read some of Dr Hawkins books and I think he has alot of great insights, I don't agree with everything but I don't view him as a liar because of it, just some things don't resonate with my experiences.

With regards to astral, dreams etc being false and only 'in the mind' well consider that the Bible has many references to dreams being direct ways that God spoke to people, so how could they be false (if you believe the Bible that is)? It even has a few references to mediums communicating with spirits (although it warns people to stay away from them- I guess the mediums must've used evil spirits-but still, it marks the spirit realm as being real).

Like I said before no-one has all the answers, people only have parts of the whole truth, so take everything you hear and run it past your own experiences (do it as unbiased as you can) to determine whether it resonates with you. :-)

[supertom]

Originally Posted by Rockchick26

I just bought ACIM but i bought it before i read Dr. Hawkins brag it up. I have never once read anything bad about it. So are you saying channeled things are false? I'm looking forward to reading it and i'm taking it very seriously so i hope i don't get people saying its fake now LOL That would be all i need,i already feel like everything i trust is falling apart!



i feel like an idiot, but i'm not quite sure what "paradigm" means and i also dont get what youre saying exactly...are you saying that i should believe that when people talk to spirit guides they are talking to God? Cuz that wasnt really my question,i do want to believe in spirit guides,i just dont like it when something else i really believe in contradicts something else i beleive in. Cuz then obvoiusly one of them is false.

ok let me say it again, iid hawkins says that psychic things are fake than why was he a student of ACIM for a number of years and it calibrates at 600 something, if you can channel jesus why not spirits, if he says that psychics are fake than why does the seth books calibrate at 330 according to him.

According to hawkins "I" calibrates at 999 and arch-angels calibrates at 40 000, what im saying is that he doesnt add up, most of his work was done with his wife, and its been proven fake with a double blind.

[Coloratura]

What's the basic idea behind muscle kinesiology?

[supertom]

if your arms go weak its false, if it goes strong its true.

[Coloratura]

Wow...that sure seems subjective... Has anyone ever tested it for questions like, "Is the world flat?"

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by supertom

ok let me say it again, iid hawkins says that psychic things are fake than why was he a student of ACIM for a number of years and it calibrates at 600 something, if you can channel jesus why not spirits, if he says that psychics are fake than why does the seth books calibrate at 330 according to him.

Because there is a HUGE difference between Jesus and spirits. Jesus is a one of a kind thing. well i guess there was Buddha,but still,thats only 2,compared to billions of spirits (spirit guides specifically,which,i've heard everyone has at least one).

According to hawkins "I" calibrates at 999 and arch-angels calibrates at 40 000, what im saying is that he doesnt add up, most of his work was done with his wife, and its been proven fake with a double blind.

I didnt get that either. So according to him,arch angels are more true than God? lol

[Holistic Star]

I haven't read the book truth vs falsehood, but I have read Power vs Force by the same author.

It left me cold and huge chunks didn't make sense to me. How he can say it callibrates at such a high level of truth is a nonsense when he gets basic things wrong.

David Hawkins - Power vs Force - A Critique is a very interesting article

"Numerous people have pointed out to me that Hawkins completely abuses the mathematics and physics in his book. He consistently refers to his calibration scale as "logarithmic" when it is in fact "exponential"; he uses the term "critical point" when referring to his exponential scales, when an exponential graph by definition cannot have a critical or "flat" point; and he uses leading-edge scientific terminology such as "chaos theory" and "attractors" in contexts that only demonstrate undeniable scientific and mathematical ignorance… which is rather strange considering that he calibrates his own books as the most "truthful" ever published."


Incidently my belief is that muscle testing or kinesiology can be hugely powerful. However it is a very skilled art and isn't easy.

I have a friend who has been a kinesiologist for 30 years and she is fantastic. The things she can find out from someone's body just using 'yes' and 'no' questions are just amazing. She has taught me a little of what she knows.

What I have found is:

• It is really hard to muscle test for yourself, because your ego / desires / fears get in the way of the truth.
• It can take a long time to feel the difference between a Yes answer and a No answer
• You can't use it to predict the future (yes I did try for the lottery numbers and no it doesn't work!).
• You have to get entirely out of your own way mentally and not think about what you want the answer to be
• Sometimes your energy can switch (due to tiredness, emotion etc), so the signal that is usually yes becomes no unless you realise and do a balance to switch your energy back to running the right way.
• Additionally the body can 'play' which is what we call it when it starts hiding the answer because it can't deal with it energetically at that moment.
• As well as Yes or No, There is a state called 'alarm' where the body will give a superstrong answer which can be misinterpreted as Strong / Postive, when actually the body has gone into major panic and is completely locked. You have to know how to recognise it, and you need to know how to release the alarm state to go back to normal functioning.

So while I think muscle testing is amazing, it isn't surprising many people find it hard without a good teacher.

[Coloratura]

wow, sounds complicated and way too mathematically based for my intuitive, little brain.
Have any of you guys actually tried it, though?

[Kaspian]

Rockchick - Become your own authority for *your* truth.

[supertom]

maybe its best to ignore him on the psychic part, its true that there is a lot of fake pyschics there, so maybe he has had bad experiences or maybe he has it in for sylvia brown(who is a fake fake fake fake fake fake fake fake) than you have someone like dorren virtue who is real real real real.

[Rockchick26]

Originally Posted by Kaspian

Rockchick - Become your own authority for *your* truth.

Well,i dont want to just declare whatever i want as the truth,i want the 100% whole honest truth. I want to discover it or have someone tell me. It isn't truth if you just pick whatever you want to be true. I wish i could be happy not caring if i knew the truth. But all this interests me so much,i would hate to waste time learning about things that are bogus. I don't like believing in things that are fake.

[Erin Pavlina]

Seek out your own experiences. Use other people's experiences as guides to the next thing to study. The whole 100% honest truth is different for everyone, oxymoronic as that sounds. You're coming from a perspective no other human being on the planet has, so your truth is going to be filtered through your beliefs and experiences. I wouldn't get too hung up on finding 100% truth or you'll end up finding nothing.