Voices/bullying

[CroMagna]

I hear voices that constantly berate me, lecture me, mock me, and humiliate me. It stems from a lifetime of being bullied, criticized for every little thing, made to feel like I'm never "good enough", people threatened by me because of my intellect of unusual ways, humiliation, and being trampled by others. For example. I hear my old boss saying I'm lazy, mocking me for thinking people were jealous or that I'm not a conformist like them, calling me dirty, fat, not nice, selfish (for not wanting children), every name in the book. i.e. "you see where all your intelligence got you."

1. How do I get these voices to disappear? Meds don't work.
2. How do I cope with the anger and resentment that these voices bring up?
3. How do I cope with the anger and resentment towards people who have bullied me?
4. How will I address future bullying? I'm not aggressive, so I can't make the person's life a living hell, like I wish I could.
5. How do I achieve a sense of vindication or triump?

[rawxstasy]

I haven't been bullied much but when I was more quiet and unsure of myself, I attracted people who would be rude to me etc. Now people don't mess with me

What I did was get quiet and let these voices come out. I would observe them as an outsider. Not say anything or argue with it. Just let it be. Eventually it quieted and stopped. ( this took about 2 -3 years ) That was doing this exercise anywhere from five minutes per day to an hour or more.

When I was at work or busy or something and these voices would start I would either ignore or say the opposite. For example - "You are so stupid" Me -"that's not true, I would have graduated from nursing school if I was stupid." But the whole observing and just letting it out helped me more.

When feelings of anger or resentment come up, just observe again let yourself feel it. Eventually it will dissapate. You can't get "rid off" anger. This is all emotions that you have held inside and the only relief is to let them come up again and they will release.

I think as you become more self confident, the energy will transmit to others and you won't get bullied. I swear since my self esteem is higher people just don't bother me anymore. I think when you have healed the sense of freedom will be a feeling of triumph that you have overcome so many obstacles and overcome the anger.

[EarthGoddessCarla]

The voices will not disappear they will change, soon as you master one of these fears another will appear UNTIL you have mastered each and every fear and guilt that lives in your sub-conscience..... Have you heard what does not kill us will make us stronger! Well it is a fact....... alot of us with abilities are dying or being institutionalized. We have to maintain that every voice and every trial is to make us stronger.

We all carry those demons, and they will throw false truths at you all the time.... your job is to develop the ability to become the human lie detector.

Originally Posted by CroMagna

I hear voices that constantly berate me, lecture me, mock me, and humiliate me. It stems from a lifetime of being bullied, criticized for every little thing, made to feel like I'm never "good enough", people threatened by me because of my intellect of unusual ways, humiliation, and being trampled by others. For example. I hear my old boss saying I'm lazy, mocking me for thinking people were jealous or that I'm not a conformist like them, calling me dirty, fat, not nice, selfish (for not wanting children), every name in the book. i.e. "you see where all your intelligence got you."

1. How do I get these voices to disappear? Meds don't work.
2. How do I cope with the anger and resentment that these voices bring up?
3. How do I cope with the anger and resentment towards people who have bullied me?
4. How will I address future bullying? I'm not aggressive, so I can't make the person's life a living hell, like I wish I could.
5. How do I achieve a sense of vindication or triump?

[Acting Like Godot]

The voices are your own thoughts.

So effectively what you are asking is - "How do I deal with my win negative and repetitive thoughts?".

There are different ways. Read Eckhart Tolle's books, or Ruiz's "The Voice of Knowledge".

Or do what I do. Recognize that you can exert power over your thoughts. The voices in my head are all cooperative, friendly and helpful. I trained them to be that way. Like good little dogs.

[elucidate]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

The voices are your own thoughts.

So effectively what you are asking is - "How do I deal with my win negative and repetitive thoughts?".

There are different ways. Read Eckhart Tolle's books, or Ruiz's "The Voice of Knowledge".

Or do what I do. Recognize that you can exert power over your thoughts. The voices in my head are all cooperative, friendly and helpful. I trained them to be that way. Like good little dogs.

This is true too.

All those thoughts are you thinking that about yourself. It may be that it stemmed from other people initially, but now it is you thinking these things.

The same goes for when you think great things about yourself...you attract people who see those awesome things about you, because that is what you are focussing your thoughts on.

You can change you inner self-talk and I suggest you start to. It takes time but you can do it.

[Carri C]

check out byron katie's "the work" - an awesome process for challenging and changing our beliefs about ourselves. all her resources are free online. just google her.

[ZephyrusX]

I can relate to the voices thing. They can be very crippling if you let them. Just two things I noticed. The voices tend to appear and reappear when stressors show up in my life. It might help to examine your environment and change things around a bit if something is making you very stressed (like your current living conditions, perhaps?). The voices get worse or fade away depending on whether or not you fuel them. I like the idea of just observing your thoughts as an insider; the opposite is choosing to actively facilitate the negative spiral of your thoughts.

Anyway, thanks for starting this thread. I got a couple of books that seem worthwhile to read out of it.

[C33]

Tell them to shut up. Over and over and over again.

Find the quieter voices that you can only hear in the background when the big, abusive voices have shut up. Listen to your soul whispering.

Can you imagine a big room, with deafeningly loud heavy metal music , see a band of very disgruntled people, shouting negative messages in a microphone. Messages about you.

In the corner of the room, notice a beautiful, angelic being, exquisite in every way, his lips are moving, but you can't understand what he says. He's been trying to talk to you for a while but you can't hear the whispers over the loud music.

You can't hear someone whispering:" I love you " in a room full of loud music, it doesn't mean no one loves you. It just means you can't hear their message of love.

It's not because someone shouts at you that what they're saying is true. It just means that person is louder.

Instead of listening to loud, listen to true.

[FelineNostalgia]

I get that, I'm aware they're apparently your own, but it rrreally feels like someone else. To ward them off I think of something highly stimulating like a comedy I just watched, or sex. I have no tips as of yet to rid them completely, but I think you really have to journey inside you mind to find out were they came from.

[RonSouther]

Man is a crowd, a crowd of many voices – relevant, irrelevant, consistent, inconsistent – each voice pulling in its own way; all the voices pulling man apart. Ordinarily man is a mess, virtually a kind of madness. You somehow manage, you somehow manage to look sane. Deep down layers and layers of insanity are boiling within you. They can erupt any moment, your control can be lost any moment, because your control is enforced from without. It is not a discipline that has come from your center of being.

For social reasons, economic reasons, political reasons, you have enforced a certain character upon yourself. But many vital forces exist against that character within you. They are continuously sabotaging your character. Hence every day you go on committing many mistakes, many errors. Even sometimes you feel that you never wanted to do it. In spite of yourself, you go on committing many mistakes – because you are not one, you are many.

I got this quote from searching "voices" at this site... Search the Osho Online Library

You're liberation from the voices is for you to find "self". When you do that then the opinions of others won't define you and the voices drop. The inferiority complex will dissolve and won't be replaced by a superiority complex. You will just enjoy being you!

[Bonadea]

Is there any truth to them?

If not, then let them go.

If they are, then either learn to respect that is part of who you are or change it if you don't like it.

There's positive affirmations. I used to take index cards, write them on them, put stickers or art work on them, pretty them up and stick them in front of the toilet on the wall. So every time I'm sitting there with nothing to do, wa-la.

I also have one in front of where I wash dishes.

[Brutha]

Change the representation of those voices. Let them talk in Micky Mouse tonality.

2. How do I cope with the anger and resentment that these voices bring up?
3. How do I cope with the anger and resentment towards people who have bullied me?

By making peace with it. By accepting your past.

[CroMagna]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

I got this quote from searching "voices" at this site... Search the Osho Online Library

You're liberation from the voices is for you to find "self". When you do that then the opinions of others won't define you and the voices drop. The inferiority complex will dissolve and won't be replaced by a superiority complex. You will just enjoy being you!

I think I have found myself: "free spirit". My true north is the word "slut". Is that who I am? I'm proud to be a free spirit or a slut. But for some reason the voices keep lecturing me, saying "men and women are different", that I haven't healed past a bad breakup, that I have low self-esteem. I think it stems from fear of what other people could say to me if they got to know me.

(On an aside, it's very offensive when people say "men and women are different", because men are able to fall in love and get married, so why are men able to fall in love if men and women are different? That means they aren't put in a box. They can do whatever they want. I want to be treated as an individual with a unique sexuality that is all my own, not as someone who's not being true to nature as woman).

So I found myself. Then why haven't the voices dropped?

The voices have been really bad these past two days. Yesterday they were tormenting me, saying I don't know what black people go through in this country. Today they were about the double standard, "men and women are different", you're a ho. One just said she'll make my life a living hell until I learn to love myself and love others. It makes me very afraid of people.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

I think I have found myself: "free spirit". My true north is the word "slut". Is that who I am? I'm proud to be a free spirit or a slut. But for some reason the voices keep lecturing me, saying "men and women are different", that I haven't healed past a bad breakup, that I have low self-esteem. I think it stems from fear of what other people could say to me if they got to know me.

(On an aside, it's very offensive when people say "men and women are different", because men are able to fall in love and get married, so why are men able to fall in love if men and women are different? That means they aren't put in a box. They can do whatever they want.) I want to be treated as an individual with a unique sexuality that is all my own, not as someone who's not a natural woman.

So I found myself. Then why haven't the voices dropped?

the voices are in your memory and if the voices still affect you then you still get some of your self image from those memorized opinions of you.

As I read your messages, I don't hear a slut, I hear a human being seeking for clarity.

I don't judge you sexuality at all, but with intelligence, you still have to make wise choices for your body considering the STD's and AIDS possibilities. And you also have to consider why the other person is with you....most likely as an escape from his own confusion and not out of love. With that greed to escape, he's willing to do harm to you so long as he gets his "high" off you.

Sex as an escape isn't fun. What's fun is when sex is used to express love for your partner....then its play! But as an escape, the relief from confusion that sex or any drugs provides takes you into a dark and greedy side of life where evil happens.

No judgment here at all, just my observation as I've lived both sides of sex...the mental sexuality where sex has to become more and more of a thrill and the deep love side where just being in the embrace of the beloved is the thrill.

Logic makes it sound like a sex career would be great. You won't know until you live it but to live it is risky to your health and safety. If you're determined to do something in the sex arena, I would encourage you not to be with clients but to use the internet so that you have the distance you need to stay safe.

And when the true being is seen, out of compassion for self, you will find that you become protective of your body, knowing that it needs to be healthy for your lifetime otherwise you will suffer. Theres a huge and lifelong inner orgams that happens with clarity that is so powerful that the mental part of sexuality, the escapism, disappears. I've lived this and have witnessed it in others that are no longer confused. :-)

So again, the voices are there in your memory and for whatever reason, you recall those voices and they bug you. You're not a slut but a human being seeking that elusive happiness. You mind logically tries to take you there but ALWAYS tells you the wrong answer because it looks out into the world when the truth is that you are innately happy whenever you are not confused. That you are looking for happiness means you are confused and out of that confused mind comes a wild goose chase that leads to more confusion. Thats why sex and drugs have to be continuously upgraded to outpace the confused mind.

Sex triggers you mind to relax and in that relaxation, you get a glimpse at your true nature when you're not confused. You mind equates sex with happiness so you go back for more. What your mind doesn't see, because the mind is not our inteligence, is that inspite of a ton of sex, you are still searching for happiness.

Sex is a trigger to relax your mind, not the solution to your problem. The real quest is to figure how to be happy totally sober. That really means to find out why we are so confused all the time. I am not confused anymore....it took me 44 years to crack this nut. When I got schooled on the mind and got distance from it so that I could see that my mind is a process and not me, I finally got my life back from confusion. I stopped feeding the confusion with social and religious standards and allowed me to be me.

I truly appreciate that you openly share your story and hope to keep in touch with you! You know my website know that it is writen as a result of clarity out of my quest to grow....the same quest I see you on. The details of your journey are uniquely you, but that you are seeking is common to all. So in your story I can see your version of me! Watching you, helps me grow and I thank you! :-)

[CroMagna]

Ron, I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. I don't see anything wrong with casual sex. I don't see it as an escape from confusion. I see it as an expression of happiness and peace. My lovers never hurt me. They're my friends. Not everyone needs romantic love. I like the label of slut because I have taken back what was supposed to be an insult and changed the defintion to a woman who has lovers, is happy, gentle, peaceful, and giving.

I called a hotline and now I feel much better. The counselor and I realized together I had internalized verbal and psychological abuse. We decided that I should continue to be myself regardless of how society feels and that I should pretend that society doesn't exist. I should just stick to my inner circle.

I'm working on pretending strangers don't exist and living as if my inner circle of friends and family are the only ones in existence; living as if we are the only people on earth. If possible I won't even be near humans so they don't get in my head and try to manipulate me.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

Ron, I respect your opinion but I disagree with you. I don't see anything wrong with casual sex. I don't see it as an escape from confusion. I see it as an expression of happiness and peace. My lovers never hurt me. They're my friends. Not everyone needs romantic love. I like the label of slut because I have taken back what was supposed to be an insult and changed the defintion to a woman who has lovers, is happy, gentle, peaceful, and giving.

As you describe it, that is "love". I sincerely didn't label casual sex as escapism and I don't see it as that.

The distinction doesn't lie in the labels but in the intent. If you're having fun sharing, then it's love that also satisfies the sex drive. If you're consuming another person to get relief from confusion where it's all about you, then it's an escape using the sex drive and the mental relaxation as a drug.

My true message was that the clients won't be there for love, but to consume you and that may not feel so good and it may be dangerous, that's all. No judgment....I don't care about labels, just clarity.

I called a hotline and now I feel much better. The counselor and I realized together I had internalized verbal and psychological abuse. We decided that I should continue to be myself regardless of how society feels and that I should pretend that society doesn't exist. I should just stick to my inner circle.

In my waking up story, this was my realization...that the standard I was trying to achieve in my life was one created by a sick society. I realized that I can't realize my innate joy unless I am me at all costs. I don't have any relationships with my dad or sister because they judged my waking up as something selfish and negative. Oh well....that's the nature of this beast.

With clarity you don't have to pretend society doesn't exist. If you can see how sick it is, then it's easy just to do your own thing and not worry about who thinks what.

Thanks for letting me share this...I totally support your determination to be yourself!

[RonSouther]

I know I post this everywhere, but let me do it again?

"Letting Go"...A Beautiful Quote and The Heart of Profound-Self-Help.com

Like this one...I see it so clearly and you can feel it in my replies (I hope because that's in me)
To let go is not to judge, but to allow another to be a human being.


When those quotes become you (the enlightened half of them), not just something that you mentally get, but that comes from the pores of your being, then know that the voices will stop in your head.

Instead, YOU will be a light unto others helping them with their voices.

If the voices are there, the confusion is still there, but you're on the path to self, you are moving and not static! The journey is about "living and learning" not "thinking and analyzing". Try all you ideas! But be careful and watch everything.

Why?

Because regardless of whether you knew what you were doing or not, you're stuck with the consequences of anything that you didn't understand. That's a fact of life. Everyone makes mistakes because no one knows it all or can know it all. We all have to step into the fear of the unknown and get experiences in order to grow. And thinking is not an experience, just a tool to try to decide which experience to try next.

[CroMagna]

Originally Posted by RonSouther

Thanks for letting me share this...I totally support your determination to be yourself!

Thanks Ron!

[CroMagna]

I tried the quote, but it didn't work. The voices persist. I'm fighting to be content and at peace but the voices won't let go.

One of my voices is Malcolm X for some reason. I think it's because I perceive him as aggressive, controlling, misogynistic, and judgemental. He tells me lots of things. He just said "you're self-centered, it's always me me me I I I." Another voice is Iyanla Vanzant, the dangerously incompetent guru who routinely forces women to submit their lives to her will. She shouts at me and just said "I am going to make you HATE me, hallelujah". I keep telling myself I'm safe, that there are no people around, but it's hard to shift focus and concentrate. I want these voices to go away now and forever so that I can enjoy being me. I love myself and I like my life but this is interfering with my sense of well being.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

I tried the quote, but it didn't work. The voices persist. I'm fighting to be content and at peace but the voices won't let go.
.

LETTING GO

To let go doesn't mean to stop caring;

It means I can't do it for someone else.

To let go is not to cut myself off...

It's the realization that I can't control another...

To let go is not to enable,

but to allow learning from natural consequences.

To let go is to admit powerlessness,

which means the outcome is not in my hands.

To let go is not to try and change or blame another,

I can only change myself.

To let go is not to care for, but to care about.

To let go is not to fix, but to be supportive.

To let go is not to judge,

but to allow another to be a human being.

To let go is not to be in the middle arranging all the outcomes,

but to allow others to affect their own outcomes.

To let go is not to be protective,

It is to permit another to face reality.

To let go is not to deny, but to accept.

To let go is not to nag, scold, or argue,

but to search out my own shortcomings and correct them.

To let go is not to adjust everything to my desires,

but to take each day as it comes and cherish the moment.

To let go is not to criticize and regulate anyone,

but to try to become what I dream I can be.

To let go is not to regret the past,

but to grow and live for the future.

To let go is to fear less and love more.

[CroMagna]

I feel like this passage is designed for other people who have tried to "fix" me, change me, control me, judge me, manipulate me. I have never done this to other people. I am in fear of other people doing that to me.

I think the voices are trying to protect me from future harassment and humiliation at the hands of others as a result of being so different and having such different opinions from other people. I have learned my lesson and avoid strangers. But my subconscious mind won't get the picture that I'm now safe.

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

I feel like this passage is designed for other people who have tried to "fix" me, change me, control me, judge me, manipulate me. I have never done this to other people. I am in fear of other people doing that to me.

I think the voices are trying to protect me from future harassment and humiliation at the hands of others as a result of being so different and having such different opinions from other people. I have learned my lesson and avoid strangers. But my subconscious mind won't get the picture that I'm now safe.

A life in the mind sees lies as truth. A life from the heart sees lies as lies.

[CroMagna]

So if I focus on my feelings, I will start to be more focused on the present moment and the voices will go away?

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by CroMagna

So if I focus on my feelings, I will start to be more focused on the present moment and the voices will go away?

Nope...when you realize that you are not "the opinions of others" and that your feelings come and go, but beyond you is a cool steadfastness that watches the whole circus.

Feelings are like clouds in the sky....they come and go. Watch them float by but you have a choice not to float with them. When anger comes, you can stay in the "middle". You don't have to explode.

Same with the opinions of others, with perspective you immediately see the ego in those people trying to assert itself against you. Real love doesn't judge so when judgment is there, it's an ego trip. And why let an ego trip define you?

You know deep down who you are...loving, giving, creative, and so on. You experience you, no one else does, not even your closest friends or lovers. No one knows you so how can they define you?

The people that you quoted that ring in your ears never met you. And if they did, so what? They don't live your existence and that they would judge speaks so poorly of their awareness of life.

This kind of realization makes it easy to drop the whole thing. You only hear the voices because you identify with your thoughts and those are your thoughts about self so you still get a negative self image from thoughts. Thoughts!!! They are just thoughts and look how they confuse the heck out of you and steal your joy!

You know that your issue is "mental" and I don't mean that in a bad way, just observing. You know that the mind creates these barriers or obsessions and stuff. So you know where to put your efforts...not in focusing the mind but in realizing that the mind is a process to help you deal with the unknown in life, but it's not your life. The mind guesses at what may be true but because it is thinking about it, it doesn't know the truth about what it's thinking.

When you can see that your thoughts are guesses about whatever you're trying to figure out, you've come a long way to escaping the prison of your mind. It's a great servant but a lousy master.

[straysweeper]

Oh who so much good stuff in this thread that I'm sorry on I only just found it.

I can relate a lot to your mind being your prison CroMagna, the only help I can provide is to make these voices conciousous. Write them down and review them, to see what they are trying to do and then you can rebutt them or redirect them. (Oh and my father does this to an even worse degree and he is 64!)

A book called Self Esteem has a lot on this topic, most book stores carry it.

But what has helped me the most is Zen and detaching from the negative. As well as observing but not judging the emotions or the source. Sometime the best thing you can do is give yourself time and space to be alone or to put yourself first, like exercise. I think exercise and nutrition is the number one thing that has helped me the last few months. Having a purpose or finding meaning in what your doing will help too. Another book here would be Victor Frankl's Man's Search for Meaning.

Do something, even if you don't feel it, but you know it. Cause sometimes our emotions can lie to us in order to keep us 'safe' in the known.

[Snorkledorf]

I found Jay Earley's book "Self-Therapy" very helpful in getting to know/defuse/befriend my own hostile inner voices. It basically teaches you a self-guided meditation (you have a sequence of questions to follow) where you meet with each voice/part-of-you as it comes up, and get to know what it's trying to do for you. The overall stance is that each voice however poisonous started out trying to (ineptly) protect some other part of you, probably back when you were a child and saw the world in pretty simplistic terms.

If for example you had a teacher that shamed you when you made an error, a part might have taken on the responsibility of preemptively copying that teacher's belittling voice, in order to "help" you not have to face that shame in real life anymore. Twenty years later it's still using that not-so-bright strategy, and you don't even know why you're so hard on yourself when you don't do things perfectly.

You get to know the voice and talk with it as though it were its own independent personality. Once you do that, you can learn about and talk with the "victim" part too, then the protector part that's been dogging you for years can finally relax from its role and ultimately take on a more constructive role in your life.

Voice by voice you build internal allies out of the voices that used to torment you. The cool thing is that after a while I started looking forward to other voices coming up because now I know how to work with them.

Non-affiliate Amazon links:

The book that introduced it to me is Self-Therapy: A Step-By-Step Guide to Creating Wholeness and Healing Your Inner Child Using IFS, A New, Cutting-Edge Psychotherapy by Jay Earley.

Then Internal Family Systems Therapy by Richard C. Schwartz (which was actually written first) covers the same process from a different angle, focusing more on how two voices can be "polarized" against each other and refuse to change until the other one changes first. It's a factor that comes up pretty commonly but Self-Therapy doesn't cover much. I read both books back-to-back.

I've found them very helpful. You might check out the sample chapter on Amazon to see if it resonates with you.

[straysweeper]

LOL I just thought of another book for you. Its nearly 30 years old but has rave reviews on amazon. Its called What To Say When You Talk To Yourself.

[Merrick1]

True and beautiful things you have said here in this thread, Ron and a great advice. But I must say that although the Truth is simple, the realization of it usually is not.

These Forums are closing down. "I" have helped (not alone) people who used to hear voices. If you'd like to keep in touch and discuss it further CroMagna, you're welcome to e-mail me. I would recommend what Ron has recommended but there may also be some other things for which there is not enough time left to be explained here.

Merrick

[RonSouther]

Originally Posted by Merrick1

True and beautiful things you have said here in this thread, Ron and a great advice. But I must say that although the Truth is simple, the realization of it usually is not.

These Forums are closing down. "I" have helped (not alone) people who used to hear voices. If you'd like to keep in touch and discuss it further CroMagna, you're welcome to e-mail me. I would recommend what Ron has recommended but there may also be some other things for which there is not enough time left to be explained here.

Merrick

Indeed!! "It's so simple to be happy, but so difficult to be simple" gururaj Ananda yogi

[CroMagna]

The voices have gone down as a result of mindfulness meditation. I use mantras and focus on the breath to receive happiness and inner peace.