Alive & dead

[marinik]

For those who don't know me I am a very happy, cheerful, positive person full of energy. A women with a very successful life in all aspects.

I am a 2 time cancer survivor, 2 different types found in early stages, and since then I am fine with death. I decided that if it had metastasized I would live my life to the fullest until the day I couldn't stand the pain when I would exit the life scene with a deep bow. Not getting into details, I wasn't ready to live my life as a patient just to be "alive" and that would have been my life on meds. That wouldn't have been life for me and would have been far more devastating for the people around me than my death. I have seen what my type of cancers have done to my friends and their families.

5 years have passed since, I am fine but now what ever is wrong with me or my life, in my moments of solitude I just say to myself:"Don't worry M you will just sign out." Meaning I would end my life when or if the pain was unbearable.

This idea of an early exit has been so often in the past few months that it has been worrying me a bit. I feel like a split personality living this happy life with this idea of death as a comforting thought if all does not go too well.

I am not prone to depressions, I only had a mild one in early 2000 after the bombing of my country in 1999 but my friend a psychiatrist diagnosed it as Post Traumatic Syndrome. And I guess it was because during the 3 months of bombs falling all around us I was very collected and positive trying to protect my 4 children from serious traumas.

Not to rant on, I wonder if anybody has ever had such experiences of to extremely opposite feelings at the same time - passion for life and suicide as the ultimate cure.

[wstein]

No direct comment about opposite feelings.

I don’t consider the body living on as a vegetable to be living. As such, I don’t consider allowing the body to die when your life can no longer be lived to be suicide (though most legal laws do). Acknowledging that your life is over and checking out seems reasonable to me. Ending your life early from fear is another story.

I would caution you about considering suicide as an ultimate cure. Very few actually believe that when your body dies, that’s it. If there is any reality to part of you continuing after physical death (I do) then the manner of your death might matter but certainly won’t cure all your issues.

From what you say, It seems you are trying to have as much passion for ending your life as living it. I don’t see that as necessary or helpful.

Perhaps your passion is for quality of life (not life itself)? If so, ending your physical existence after the quality is no longer possible is not inconsistent.

[Mynder]

From this post, and a few of your last ones, I get a somewhat blurry but possibly helpful picture of your current situation.

When you were diagnosed with cancer, you started seeing death as an ally. Death would come and take the pain away if it became "too much".

Now, in life circumstances that might appear scary, or painful, or simply uncertain (your mother, your husband's job etc.), it might feel similar to that. That is, you know what is happening, and you know there will be parts of it that will hurt, and in all of this I sense a lurking fear that it may be more than you can bear, and that feels soothed by knowing that there is always the option of not facing it any longer.

Somehow, you made it through your cancer treatments. Somehow you managed to handle both the pain, the stresses, the discomforts, and make it through to the other side of it all. I'll leave it to you to decide whether you choose to see it as "worth it" for the life you have managed to create for yourself now. From how you occur to me, you seem to enjoy life, your life, the life you made happen.

So honestly, I feel you have that choice again. To handle whatever comes your way, and to create something better every day.

Remember your friends. Sometimes, we need a bit of distraction from current worries and hurts. Going out with friends can serve that purpose.

I want you to feel supported, and loved, and secure.

[marinik]

Originally Posted by wstein

Perhaps your passion is for quality of life (not life itself)? If so, ending your physical existence after the quality is no longer possible is not inconsistent.

Yes you got it, it is the quality that is important! Thank you! You hit the nail on the head!

[marinik]

Thanks, you made me think through all of it again. The main point is my fear of very old age when your personality changes or to be exact goes in reverse - you become a selfish unbearable child. What I am living through with my parents is something I would not want for my children to get from me! I don't want anybody to suffer because of me.

Just like I didn't want anybody to go through the final stages of cancers with me, I don't want to torment anybody with the humiliation old age does to a person.

I know it is all chemical, chemical changes in the brain but it is not a valid excuse to torment anybody that loves you.

I know it sounds harsh but anybody who has had this experience with their elderly parents knows what I am talking about.

Originally Posted by Mynder

From this post, and a few of your last ones, I get a somewhat blurry but possibly helpful picture of your current situation.

When you were diagnosed with cancer, you started seeing death as an ally. Death would come and take the pain away if it became "too much".

Now, in life circumstances that might appear scary, or painful, or simply uncertain (your mother, your husband's job etc.), it might feel similar to that. That is, you know what is happening, and you know there will be parts of it that will hurt, and in all of this I sense a lurking fear that it may be more than you can bear, and that feels soothed by knowing that there is always the option of not facing it any longer.

Somehow, you made it through your cancer treatments. Somehow you managed to handle both the pain, the stresses, the discomforts, and make it through to the other side of it all. I'll leave it to you to decide whether you choose to see it as "worth it" for the life you have managed to create for yourself now. From how you occur to me, you seem to enjoy life, your life, the life you made happen.

So honestly, I feel you have that choice again. To handle whatever comes your way, and to create something better every day.

Remember your friends. Sometimes, we need a bit of distraction from current worries and hurts. Going out with friends can serve that purpose.

I want you to feel supported, and loved, and secure.

[Mynder]

I can't say about my parents, since they're not "elderly" yet, but my grandmother died, after prolonged sickness, and wonderfully kind to the last day.

Everybody is unique. If your mother becomes increasingly cranky and unbearable, that doesn't mean you'll be the same.

[elucidate]

I've never been faced with this reality, but I have thought about it before a fair bit, and I know if I could not have the same quality of life, or was merely being kept alive, I would not want to continue, and I have even instructed my parents to pull the plug on me without hesitation if I am ever in that situation and they have to make a decision like this.

I think it's only natural for someone who loves life so much to not want to settle for something like this.

[marinik]

Originally Posted by elucidate

I've never been faced with this reality, but I have thought about it before a fair bit, and I know if I could not have the same quality of life, or was merely being kept alive, I would not want to continue, and I have even instructed my parents to pull the plug on me without hesitation if I am ever in that situation and they have to make a decision like this.

I think it's only natural for someone who loves life so much to not want to settle for something like this.

Thanks elucidatre.

[Federer]

Hiya Lovely woman marinik,

I perfectly understand what you mean by signing out from your life? I think we all want to live with passion. Now you have lived many years and i think you struggling to find motivation. Cancer and other illness has affected on majority.

For you, But deep down i feel don't you think it will be wrong to accept death as you are unable to bear pain? You are right from your side and i am also wrong from your point of view.

Honestly, i also feel that i should give up studying at college. I mean, i don't want to stop following my inspiration to live life and personal development. just i feel tired to follow my country's study system. Don't know.

Lots of love to you my wonderful and inspirational friend.

[marinik]

Thanks Federer. Don't ever stop investing in yourself! Formal education matters in the end. Why do you think even Bill Gates received an honorable PhD. Never stop learning. I haven't! You will be just fine. There is no such thing as a good educational system in any country!
Love m

Originally Posted by Federer

Hiya Lovely woman marinik,

I perfectly understand what you mean by signing out from your life? I think we all want to live with passion. Now you have lived many years and i think you struggling to find motivation. Cancer and other illness has affected on majority.

For you, But deep down i feel don't you think it will be wrong to accept death as you are unable to bear pain? You are right from your side and i am also wrong from your point of view.

Honestly, i also feel that i should give up studying at college. I mean, i don't want to stop following my inspiration to live life and personal development. just i feel tired to follow my country's study system. Don't know.

Lots of love to you my wonderful and inspirational friend.

[Federer]

Originally Posted by marinik

Thanks Federer. Don't ever stop investing in yourself! Formal education matters in the end. Why do you think even Bill Gates received an honorable PhD. Never stop learning. I haven't! You will be just fine. There is no such thing as a good educational system in any country!
Love m

I see... Bolded line is fact.

Wow....You made my day. I love to see whenever we talk inspirational conversation will spark.

[nube]

I have the same thing with death, despite not having been sick, I feel I should live life to the fullest every day because I never know when I will die, and whenever I am "trapped" in a situation that I don't like, I often don't see the point in living. But at the same time I am too curious about life to commit suicide.
Sometimes I wake up and think I have two options, to live or to die. If I choose to live I have chosen that, and if I choose to die, then I might as well live, just to see what happens. Like I have nothing to loose in that second case and in a way it is liberating.
I dont know if it is a healthy mindset but it makes me less scared about living the life I want to live. I like to really ponder whether I want to live or not and why I am alive often to keep myself sharp in a way. To choose life rather than just have it happening to you.

[shasah]

Originally Posted by marinik

For those who don't know me I am a very happy, cheerful, positive person full of energy. A women with a very successful life in all aspects.

I am a 2 time cancer survivor, 2 different types found in early stages, and since then I am fine with death. I decided that if it had metastasized I would live my life to the fullest until the day I couldn't stand the pain when I would exit the life scene with a deep bow. Not getting into details, I wasn't ready to live my life as a patient just to be "alive" and that would have been my life on meds. That wouldn't have been life for me and would have been far more devastating for the people around me than my death. I have seen what my type of cancers have done to my friends and their families.

5 years have passed since, I am fine but now what ever is wrong with me or my life, in my moments of solitude I just say to myself:"Don't worry M you will just sign out." Meaning I would end my life when or if the pain was unbearable.

This idea of an early exit has been so often in the past few months that it has been worrying me a bit. I feel like a split personality living this happy life with this idea of death as a comforting thought if all does not go too well.

I am not prone to depressions, I only had a mild one in early 2000 after the bombing of my country in 1999 but my friend a psychiatrist diagnosed it as Post Traumatic Syndrome. And I guess it was because during the 3 months of bombs falling all around us I was very collected and positive trying to protect my 4 children from serious traumas.

Not to rant on, I wonder if anybody has ever had such experiences of to extremely opposite feelings at the same time - passion for life and suicide as the ultimate cure.

Marinik, as you know, I am also a cancer survivor. I also went through the thoughts of suicide at that time. I was trying to figure out how to best do it without hurting the ones I love and with the least trauma to my family. I was young to have cancer and thought that it would protect them more to die and let them have the insurance. But the more I thought about it, the more I realized that I couldn't do it. I am a fighter. I will not go down without a fight.

I am now a 10 year survivor and have been lucky enough not to have any recurrences. I am still thankful every day for the fact that I did not take my life.

so, my friend, I say to you, life has it's ups and downs but we will not know what the next up is if we aren't here. I have never experienced the opposite feelings that you are talking about. The only time in my life that I have ever thought of suicide was during that month between diagnosis and operation.

I believe that what you are experiencing is a combination of PTSS and chemical changes within your body. Both are controllable with medical help. Each of us has to make our own decisions on subjects like this but you have to remember that other people are affected by our decisions. You are an absolutely awesome person and a very intelligent lady. You would not write about this if you did not already have some of the answers yourself. so look deep within and think about it. Think about all the people that want to live with all their heart and know that you can't take something so precious that others want so deeply. Use what you have been blessed with to help others.

I will live and even if I become disabled in some form or fashion, I will do what I can to help others. The only exception to that, in my book, is if it takes a machine to keep me alive. In that case, unplug it and let me go in peace.

I don't know if any of this helped, but just giving my perspective. Life is worth fighting for, even if it is fighting your own mind. Love ya Marinik!!!

[marinik]

Thanks Shasah. Your perspective means so much to me. Just to be clear on things I am not thinking about suicide. It is more like and emergency exit that you know exists in case of some dire scenario.

[cacheborn]

When I was 15 or 16, my mother took me to a fortune teller and he told me that I would not live beyond a certain age. He told many other things also and most of them came out to be uncannily true except for the death one. I have passed that age. Ever since that happened, I have had this weird fantasies of imagining myself dead and imagine in great detail how people were reacting to it. I do it very less now a days but I have not fully understood the phenomena. Do I secretly want the fortune teller to be right? I don't know.

You are a brave and courageous woman, Marinik. As others have pointed out, maybe the lowering of quality of life is inconsistent with your high standards.
I want you to feel better and I wish you the very best.
Lots of love and hugs.

[marinik]

Cash I had the same thing happen to me. It was an old Gypsy lady that told me I wouldn't live to be 40. LOL that was a long time ago!

Originally Posted by cacheborn

When I was 15 or 16, my mother took me to a fortune teller and he told me that I would not live beyond a certain age. He told many other things also and most of them came out to be uncannily true except for the death one. I have passed that age. Ever since that happened, I have had this weird fantasies of imagining myself dead and imagine in great detail how people were reacting to it. I do it very less now a days but I have not fully understood the phenomena. Do I secretly want the fortune teller to be right? I don't know.

You are a brave and courageous woman, Marinik. As others have pointed out, maybe the lowering of quality of life is inconsistent with your high standards.
I want you to feel better and I wish you the very best.
Lots of love and hugs.

[cacheborn]

Originally Posted by marinik

Cash I had the same thing happen to me. It was an old Gypsy lady that told me I wouldn't live to be 40. LOL that was a long time ago!

You too, huh?
What's amazing that almost all other things that he described in detail happened just the way he said it. Except this one.
Maybe destiny's idea of a joke?

[marinik]

Sometimes I feel like I am living on borrowed time. I hope I don't have to pay it back with some loan shark interest rates!

[Mynder]

Maybe it is not a joke. Maybe, despite it not having come true, it was something you needed to hear, to help you focus on life, and to treasure it.

To face death, and to come through to life.

That said, in a parallel Earth, you might have died as predicted, and people might have reacted as you imagined they would.

Sometimes, I feel that instead of changing this reality, we shift ourselves towards a certain "parallel reality" in which things go according to the way we change.

At any rate, I have had depressed moments in my life when allowing myself to "feel dead", to hunker down, pull back inside as though I didn't even exist, and then to let all of this anguish flow out through my tears and then get a good night's sleep, has helped me tremendously in dealing with emotions I had previously barreled up inside.

[metamorph]

I think we tend to ignore the fact that we are all going to die. I am not sure if that is good. Wayne Dyer used to recommend living with the awareness of death ("tonight at 8 p.m. I will check out"). I have done that for a while. First, it had the positive effect of living more consciously, but I got a bit scared, LOA kind of way...

[marinik]

Thanks guys for your input. Unfortunately I am too aware of the fact that we all are going to die. I come home to a mother who is faced with death all the time. This is what I am trying to escape old age and this panic of not waking up the next day. My parents were so OK with the whole concept when they were my age and now it is a totally different cup of tea.

[Mynder]

So, basically, you are afraid of becoming afraid of death when you grow older, like you see in your mother now?

[marinik]

Originally Posted by Mynder

So, basically, you are afraid of becoming afraid of death when you grow older, like you see in your mother now?

Yes in a way. I could never understand the urge to live another day which is solely devoted to pain management or tormenting the people that love you so that they can grant every unreasonable wish you have in your brain changed by old age.

But this is not why I started this thread. I was becoming worried that when ever I had a serious challenge in front of me or I thought of a problem in the future that might arise my mind would go - "Don't worry, you can always opt out." It felt so funny to say the least to have the passion for life and problem solving and these thoughts at the same time.

One thing comes to mind, all of these books we have read around here, specially Seth and Abraham... and the old philosophers. They all say in a nutshell that this is just one of the lives we chose to learn a specific lesion or to live through a unique experience.... so basically what I am trying to say that this thought to end the game is just a doorway to another.

[Mynder]

To me, it's like waking up.

Every night, when you go to sleep, your dream self "wakes up" in a new form. Every morning that dream self "dies", and you wake up.

It's a comforting thought to hold that, if life becomes unbearable, we can just "opt out", take a step back, see what we'd prefer before jumping back into the game (if you so choose).

The thing is, if we never deal with our unconscious fears, they may well back up to the surface, especially if our mind deteriorates to a point where we are rarely ourselves anymore.

Add onto that a lot of anger and frustration about not being able to do things yourself anymore, to be completely dependent on somebody else, and you can probably see where bitterness might be born.

My parents had a daughter before they had me, but she died a few months old from "crib death" or "sudden infant death syndrome" if the translation is correct. I had always felt as if she were somehow still around, watching over me, and about ten years ago, I had a strange dream about her, and when I woke up, I got a distinct feeling of "Good-bye, you're doing well and don't need me anymore, so I'll be off doing my own stuff now. I may check in every now and then, but I'm sure you'll be able to handle things." If this seems too complex a thought to be expressed through a feeling, I won't argue. But it's how this occurred to me, and I have no reason to dismiss it.

And when my grandmother died last year, things happened in a fashion that I suspected her hand at play, nudging her loved ones closer to one another, making sure I'd end up where I am now. At home.

So, dying can appear in many different lights, and I suppose how much it hurts your loved ones is not only a matter of how much you are suffering, but of how they, themselves, see death (and beyond).

I wish you much strength, patience, and emotional resilience in dealing with your mother, and want you to know that I have found you to be a smart, creative, and very joyful person who has absorbed a lot of wisdom in her life.

Have you been able to determine what keeps your mother tied to this world? Sometimes, people feel obligated to stick around for someone they love. Sometimes, there is something they want to see. Sometimes, they've simply become afraid of death. I wish you both the ability to make your peace with one another, and let go of resentment.

[roxyruby]

we can work towards overcoming any problem, including any and all illnesses or body part illness that leads to death, bringing the dead back to life, and depression and post trautmatic stress disorder,

it can all be overcome if we believe it can and can have Vision

there is so much more infinite technology and knowledge to know!

I LOVE YOU SO MUCH MARINIK and I am here to protect you and take care of you

imagine. millions or billions of people being brought back to life using amazing new technology. To them it was just like going to sleep and waking up.

space habitation on other earth like planets so there is no overpopulation.

people being in control of the body they inhabit using amazing new technology, living on and on, for hundreds of years, & forever people will gain more knowledge.....

people being in control of the body they inhabit and using amazing new knowledge and technology, eliminating all illnesses and body part illnesses that in the past lead to this ancient event called "death"

feel the joy people are feeling!

knowledge and technology. knowledge and technology. Strive for the highest quality knowledge and technology.

[marinik]

Originally Posted by roxyruby

we can work towards overcoming any problem, including any and all illnesses or body part illness that leads to death, bringing the dead back to life, and depression and post trautmatic stress disorder,

it can all be overcome if we believe it can and can have Vision

there is so much more infinite technology and knowledge to know!

I LOVE YOU SO MUCH MARINIK and I am here to protect you and take care of you

Thank you RR. It feels good to know!

[roxyruby]

Originally Posted by marinik

Thank you RR. It feels good to know!

always here for you beautiful human being! *GIANT HUG CUDDLE*

[AngelPsychic444]

Originally Posted by marinik

Thanks guys for your input. Unfortunately I am too aware of the fact that we all are going to die. I come home to a mother who is faced with death all the time. This is what I am trying to escape old age and this panic of not waking up the next day. My parents were so OK with the whole concept when they were my age and now it is a totally different cup of tea.

I understand what you're saying and feel for you. The pressure of life does bear down on us at times and for the life of me, I have few answers. If I found myself in your situation, I would start to deal more with the angelic realms, I know this does not sound like a logical idea, but when life gets you down and things just get too tough, the angels can help pull you out.

Panic attacks can be done away with with their help, I do hope and pray you find some resolution for all this.

A suggestion for a good book to read would be "The healing miracles of Archangel Raphael" by Doreen Virtue. This book doesn't have all the answers but will start to bring to you some ways to deal with all your going through and also get some real help from the angels.

[marinik]

Thanks, I fortunately don't have panic attacks. I do turn to angelic forces and MBO but then I haven't asked them for such big things. To be honest I don't even know how I would ask for a MBO in this situation.

Originally Posted by AngelPsychic444

I understand what you're saying and feel for you. The pressure of life does bear down on us at times and for the life of me, I have few answers. If I found myself in your situation, I would start to deal more with the angelic realms, I know this does not sound like a logical idea, but when life gets you down and things just get too tough, the angels can help pull you out.

Panic attacks can be done away with with their help, I do hope and pray you find some resolution for all this.

[AngelPsychic444]

Originally Posted by marinik

Thanks, I fortunately don't have panic attacks. I do turn to angelic forces and MBO but then I haven't asked them for such big things. To be honest I don't even know how I would ask for a MBO in this situation.

Ask the angels for everything. When you have such opposite reactions like passion then suicide, you can say "i request the most benevolent outcome for a more balanced life emotionally, please help me feel more passion and happiness and love and joy, and may this outcome be even better than I could hope for or expect....thank you"

Everytime you feel even slightly depressed about anything... do an MBO to feel better. Ask all day long for the energies of joy and love to be with you. You could even do benevolent prayers for your children. Such as "I ask any and all beings to please protect my children (you can name them) from any traumas and please help them see the wonderfulness in life...thank you"

The benevolent prayers you can do for your children are endless.... just do them for every little thing, and start to see results.




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