Do you think Hallucinogenic plants can help raise your consciousness?

[loveliketheflowers]

What do you think about hallucinogenic plants? Do you think hallucinogenic plants can help raise consciousness or unlock doors in the mind or help with unawareness or questions you would like to be answered? Or do you think this can harm you and set a person back a lot?

would like to hear thoughts about this.

[runningbird]

I'm of the "set and setting" point of view.

Taken in the right frame of mind in a comfortable setting they could be helpful for healing and learning about yourself, but taken when upset, depressed, or in a bad environment could be overwhelming.

[jeff3]

yes

[RRR]

How do you define raise consciousness?

On DMT I directly experienced oneness with the universe, communication with divine entities made of love, spiritual rebirth, live reviews, communication with 4th dimension entities, explanations for the true meaning of life, advice on how to be a better person, gave birth to space babies, released emotional blocks, practiced creating love, and explored the creative potential of my own mind.

Most of these feelings I have never experienced in my life (aside from brief glimpses of oneness) Do these experiences mean my consciousness is raised? I'm not sure. But it was a significant spiritual and creative experience most people never experience that I consider very worthwhile. To live without this kind of experience would be like dying a virgin, you never really got what life was all about.

[Halcyon]

Originally Posted by runningbird

I'm of the "set and setting" point of view.

Taken in the right frame of mind in a comfortable setting they could be helpful for healing and learning about yourself, but taken when upset, depressed, or in a bad environment could be overwhelming.

...is correct.

[Xanafax]

Wrong!

Hallucinogenic plants - whilst often bad for the health, can lead to - some preliminary research suggests - developing psycho-health problems in the future like schizophrenia.

Furthermore the "messages" you get are rarely inspired, they just seem that way 'cos your high.

[magi13]

No, they destroy your short term memory.

[Sabrielle11]

Originally Posted by Xanafax

Wrong!

Hallucinogenic plants - whilst often bad for the health, can lead to - some preliminary research suggests - developing psycho-health problems in the future like schizophrenia.

What scientific data do you have to back this up??? I'd be interested in reading it. Alot of what you're saying sounds like things they used spout during 60s scare films. As humans we have natural constituents of hallucinogens in our brains LSD and DMT, that are linked to the pineal gland and spiritual experiences. MAPS does a lot of research with psychotropic drugs to help individuals with brain disorders (PSTD, OCD etc) because during a heightened awareness state along with a therepist people can work through their issues much more effectively. Unfortuantely because of gov't influences these studies are halted. Check it out Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies.

I think anything in excess can be harmful. My experiences with hallucinogens have been enlightening, spiritual and positive as far as expanding my consciousness. I see it as a vehicle/temporary tool and once those states are reached you've wired your brain for it and can achieve it naturally without chemicals. One should never confuse the finger pointing at the moon, for the moon or it becomes another stumbling block if thought necessary, instead of a stepping stone.

[Halcyon]

lol Magi, Xanafax.... Your just regurgitating the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ propaganda of ignorance. End of story.

[Xanafax]

Halcyon:

Medical trials, research papers, scientific evidence.

That's not propaganda.

Furthermore you have to ask yourself: why would the government lie about this anyway?

[Halcyon]

lol Are you serious?

1.

Medical trials, research papers, scientific evidence

a. Can be biased on intent.
b. There are Medical trials, research papers, scientific evidence... to the contrary of what you choose to believe. Yes, I have books and references.

2. You need a serious history lesson. I will definitely not waste my time here trying to teach you. Thats not my job. I will say to read up on world history for one thing. I recommend a thorough study into politics, human nature, and history if you are still so naive as to even make a comment like that. In essence... go to school and get some experience before regurgitating hearsay.

[runningbird]

if there are medical trials and scientific evidence that purports psychedelics cause psychological problems, Johns Hopkins University seems to emphatically disagree: http://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/Press...Psilocybin.pdf

They find that "Psilocybin can occassion mystical type experiences that have substantial and sustained personal meaning and spiritual significance".

[Blueskied]

Anyone still believe in the hippie idea of raising consciousness by taking drugs?

Hunter S. Thompson
YouTube - fear and loathing in las vegas end speach

the text:

We are all wired into a survival trip now. No more of the speed that fueled that 60's. That was the fatal flaw in Tim Leary's trip. He crashed around America selling "consciousness expansion" without ever giving a thought to the grim meat-hook realities that were lying in wait for all the people who took him seriously... All those pathetically eager acid freaks who thought they could buy Peace and Understanding for three bucks a hit. But their loss and failure is ours too. What Leary took down with him was the central illusion of a whole life-style that he helped create... a generation of permanent cripples, failed seekers, who never understood the essential old-mystic fallacy of the Acid Culture: the desperate assumption that somebody... or at least some force - is tending the light at the end of the tunnel.

[Halcyon]

I am a fan of Hunter S. Thompson. However he was an author and user. Not a scientist.

Secondly Timothy Leary may have written books and sold the new youth of America at that time on certain concepts. HOWEVER there are indigenous peoples in North and South America, India, and China that have been using psychedelics for spiritual growth for centuries.

[magi13]

Hallucinogens | Drug Abuse and Effects Summary

^^,

the things people go to in order to justify their addiction. ^^,

it's your body, not mine. well good luck to you.

i support any government against mind altering drugs.

[Xanafax]

Exactly Magi.

[carenkh]

Originally Posted by magi13

Hallucinogens | Drug Abuse and Effects Summary

That article reads like it was written by a high-schooler; it's just the basic tip-of-the-iceberg article about hallucinogens. I don't know why you believe it's relevant to this discussion.

[magi13]

You are the only one responsible for yourself. ^^ have no regrets. Even though I may not agree with you because I have proof that such things are bad for your health, i will not stop you.

It is your choice.

@carenkh it is relevant because it shows proof.

that's all I mean to say, there is evidence stating that such things are bad for your health, but there are those that say it's good for your health. It's your choice to use or not to use it.

The thread starter asked for our opinion and we gave it.

[Jthorn]

First of all let me say that I 've never done drugs. In fact, I don't even drink alcohol or coffee. So I really don't know the sensation.
I have a question though for those defending them. If you assume for a moment that they are indeed harming your brain, even destroying your cells, have you not wondered how that would feel? I for one have no doubt that it would feel wonderful. Especially since you 'd lose the capacity to worry about anything, I really believe that you get to experience an amazing feeling of peace and such and even enter a dreamlike state, what with neurons firing randomly inside your brain.
Now, I 'm not saying that this is necessary the case, however, if there were true mental benefits, I pose the same question as to the sun gazing concept and anything else similar in nature; why don't we see the top chess players for example employing such methods? And trust me, psychic powers and the ability to connect to the opponent are very much valued in the game of chess, psychology plays a big role as does the ability to be present in the moment. Mikhail Tal was in fact called a hypnotist by his opponents. So these people meditate, adjust their diets, but they don't do drugs or sungaze as far as I know. If they do, it usually has a negative impact on their performance. Tells a lot, doesn't it?

[runningbird]

"If you assume for a moment that they are indeed harming your brain, even destroying your cells, have you not wondered how that would feel? I for one have no doubt that it would feel wonderful"

Stop right there. You know what demographic is notorious for having brain damage? Boxers. Ask them if getting pounded in the head feels wonderful.

Anyway, psychedelics are not necessarily more pleasurable than painful.

[The David]

Originally Posted by Blueskied

Anyone still believe in the hippie idea of raising consciousness by taking drugs?

Hunter S. Thompson
YouTube - fear and loathing in las vegas end speach

the text:

Is he seriously comparing speed to LSD? I've done both. Speed is much worse, despite the fact that I had a prescription for it.

Most of the hype about LSD frying your brain, or whatever, is being continually undermined by science. Here is a government site that talks about the effects of LSD. It says:

LSD users may develop long-lasting psychoses, such as schizophrenia or severe depression.

It may. It didn't even give a citation for it. There was none of the 'seven times and you're legally insane' or 'it will make you believe you're about to turn into orange juice'. Even the government is less inclined to freak out about it.

Incidentally, note the frequent use of the ambiguous term 'abuse'.

As far as mystical experiences and consciousness-raising, I'll just give my personal opinion. I think any drug can be used for those purposes. I'm not saying that the things you see on acid are real, I'm just saying that having a new experience, a new thought, or a new perspective can always be an opportunity to learn and grow. It's like reading a novel or watching a movie.

It's up to the individual to weigh the risks and benefits.

[Tobes]

There is plenty of research to suggest that low dosage hallucinogens help with depression, anxiety, and expansion of consciousness. Just do a google on psilocybin, low dose THC, salvia, etc for depression, OCD etc. I don't have the means or courage to fool with the illegal stuff, but I do ethnobotanicals like kanna, calea, and even albizia and obtain good mental benefit from them (when pharma ssri's etc failed miserably).

Before the modern agrarian age (a sliver in evolutionary time), primitive man was always foraging and consuming many plant and fungal substances that had beneficial biochemical/mental benefits. Ancient and modern shamans knew these things well, but we have mostly lost sight of this knowledge (and practice). It's not all or nothing!

[carnelian heart]

Personally, some drugs have expanded my sense of self. The neurons fire beautifully together, and it seems as if the mysteries of the world are tangible. I am not advocating this for everyone. It takes a certain kind of willingness to explore new states.

If you choose to do any drugs, please take a bit of reason:

1. Setting and People - make sure they are safe and fun.
2. Have no responsibilities for 12 hours besides eating and sleeping and bathroom stuff. (ie. no driving, no babysitting, no cooking.)
3. Do not take a lot. Have the poison control number handy in case the worst happens.
4. Have someone who is not on drugs with everyone, making sure no one is freaking out.
5. This is important - stop taking drugs when you have reached a certain level. You don't want to burn out - you want to mellow out. Drugs will heat the brain up, and you can get a lot of damage from too many drugs.
6. Remember that you still have to go to work and your money manifestation wishes need your hard work too. Don't fall into the "genie wishes" syndrome. Stay responsible.
7. Use the Buddy rule, especially when out of the house, like if you are camping in the woods.

Good luck, and don't burn out.

*

[Halcyon]

8. Always know what your taking first and foremost!

[Eric Roosevelt]

Most people have a rather distorted view about hallucinogenic drugs. They're not half as bad as they're usually portrayed.

That said, taking drugs is never risk-free. Always make sure you're getting it from a trusted source, and like Halcyon pointed out, know what you're taking. It's not always as obvious as you would think. If you lack experience, go ahead and do some reasearch on whatever drug you're planning to take, or ask a friend. Don't just randomly get some stuff off the streets and take it. Behave like a rational, thoughful human being. If all your common sense it telling you not to do something, then you should listen to it.

If you're emotionally unstable or depressed, you should avoid drugs completely, including alcohol. Drugs have the best affect when you're happy, at ease and located in a safe environment.

If you're interested in hallucinogens, the best option is probably marijuana. LSD, psilocybin and other strong hallucinogens will give you a more intense trip, so they could either have a very negative or very positive effect on you. Whatever you choose, take it in small doses first to see how you react to it.

If you take hallucinogens regularly, make sure you take long breaks to prove to yourself that you control the drug and not the other way around. Most people think that hallucinogens aren't addictive, which is false. Hallucinogens are psychologically addictive, a bit like porn or the internet. As always, stay conscious about what your doing.

Hallucinogens can certainly be useful and exiciting when it comes to exploring your consciousness. Somehow they manage to bring out things that are - well, latent - from our subconscious. They distort our senses, our apetite and our emotions, usually in a pleasant way. As long as you don't have a problem breaking the law, you can gain a lot from it.

[runningbird]

"If you take hallucinogens regularly, make sure you take long breaks to prove to yourself that you control the drug and not the other way around. Most people think that hallucinogens aren't addictive, which is false. Hallucinogens are psychologically addictive, a bit like porn or the internet."

Most people "think" this because they have no desire to take them on a regular basis. I would say that means they are not psychologically addictive.

[Lil Chris]

Getting the most from Psychedelics - You Tube Link (this is quite enlightening, Sasha has been doing Psychedelics since the 50's, not only that he's quite a chemical genus)

[The David]

Supervision is probably important when using hallucinogenic drugs. Maybe those stories about people jumping out of windows are false. Maybe not. I've heard some similar stories (first hand accounts) from people I know. Also, having supportive friends reduces the odds of a bad trip getting out of control.

A big social gathering might not be the place for it, though. The only time I've ever (illegally) tripped, I was at a party on a mountain and I lost my ability to speak. It was very frustrating. I would have rather been in a library or something. Lucy is not a party drug.

@runningbird: What does 'psychologically addictive' mean, anyway? I've never really thought that term has any objective definition.

[runningbird]

Well the term "psychological" is inherently subjective. I take it just to mean you feel at the whim of your desires, rather than "you", yourself, taking action. A psychologically addicted person is in conflict with their desires.

[Nourishing]

First everyone needs to speak the same language


The Pharmacratic Inquisition