Advice needed on ex-relationship

[strangelove]

I am faced with a kind of dizzying mixture of emotions after my girlfriend of seven months called me to say that she was leaving, and returning to her previous boyfriend. I am sure that our relationship was probably not going to last, given how we both needed things which we were not able to give each other.

However, the situation burns me so much more because of who this ex-boyfriend is, and her relationship to him. They seem to me to both be locked in a mutually destructive sado-masochist relationship, in which she gives up her authority and lets him control her life. She can have what she wants in this relationship: she can pursue her own interests, travel, and so on, as long as she does not have her freedom. He, in turn, needs to be able to feel that he is in control of her, and derives a sadistic, empowering satisfaction from it.

During their relationship together, they hurled abuse at each other, broke out into violent physical fights. She would slash her wrists in despair of her situation, apparently ignorant of the fact that she was also feeding off it. One night when she was in my room (upstairs from his) we ended up kissing. He broke off the relationship and she seized the opportunity to leave. For seven months I stayed with her, guilty at what I had done, but delighted that she was finding her own feet, making her own decisions, and smiling and laughing a lot more. Our relationship was creative and beautiful, but also rocky, and I felt that we would probably not last. She found me disconnected and unreachable. One day some months ago, this man's relationship with another woman ended abruptly. Whilst she was still in his house from a visit, he immediately called my girlfriend, and started telling her how they were going to get back together, that he was always in love with her, and so on. Initially, and for a long time, she reacted completely unequivocally and said she had no interest in ever returning to him. Sometimes I would find her crying about the time she had wasted in his shackles, and she felt self-reproach for staying with him.

However, she kept talking to him on the phone, often in secret from me. She constantly reassured me that they were just friends, and that she had no intentions of returning to him. I dreamt a few nights ago that that I walked in on them kissing. Then, the next day she called me to tell me that he had always been there for her, and I hadn't. That I didn't understand her, and that he did. Then she would alternate to fatalistic explanations like: it's just going to happen anyway, I can't stop it. The fact that she had fallen backwards over her original story was extremely painful to me. I now realise how naive I had been to believe her when she said it was over. I let my own need for love delude me. I used to get angry and afraid when she spoke to him. Particularly since he constantly asked her to marry him, to have sex with him, and to divulge the details of her relationship with me, including sexual.

Part of this story is that I feel intensely sad and angry that a person who I believed loved me, with whom I shared myself in a deeper way that I ever have, could have their mind bought out by a blatant sadist, and pathological manipulator. He has littered her with promises to buy her things, to look after her, and has painted me as an untrustworthy and uncertain. She has adopted these ideas progressively as he has worn her down, hour after hour, on the phone, every day, while she was away from me.

When I look at it from a different point of view, I am deeply sad that she is going back to a relationship which was so destructive for her. I feel like our relationship was falsely premised on the notion that she had always wanted to get away from him, and had put him behind her. Now I realise that she was always dependent on him, and simply hid it from me. I know a great deal of my emotions are the result of perceived hurt; but I also know that these two individuals are locked into wildly powerful forces, which will bring them together again into a deep and powerful bind.

The hardest thing, now that some of the initial shock has worn off, is realising that there is nothing I can do. I tried to talk her out of it, but felt horrible and I don't want to talk to her anymore, at all. I feel insulted by her lack of integrity, but then I see her helplessness. I think about ways to stop it, but the fact that I have to face is that it will only stop when she actually wants it to. It seems to me that the pain they shared will have to reach an even higher threshold before either she becomes disconnected from herself, and empty of personality, or she breaks free out of desperation. Undoubtedly, he will go chasing after her again. I just feel like he is going to ruin her life... but as she says 'If it wasn't him, it would be someone else.'

Am I right to disconnect completely form this situation and let it alone? Whenever I think of interfering, it comes from egoism. From the fact that she has spited me, or from a desire to outsmart and overrun this man. But neither would do anything useful; perhaps they would mane things worse. I feel like I just have to sit here, Buddha-like, and let the sadness and pain wash over me. It seems like sometimes people do not chose health, and have to go deeper into their darkness before they can ever be free.

[Pequod]

This sucks. Big time.

It's the classic story of a woman who chooses her own unhappyness by dating an exciting bad boy who will hurt her instead of someone who would be really good for her. (By the way, I'm not picking on women here; there is the male equivalent of dating a famme fatale)

Normally it could be that she is swept away by the excitement of being with such a man (You know that man and women are attracted to different things? - Men respond to sexy looks, while women respond more to strong emotions). But in this case the girl knew where it would lead to, so that cannot be the reason.

The only other explanation is that deep down she doesn't feel like she deserves to be with a great person like you, and unconsciously she wants to be with the sadist who treats her bad. If she thinks that she is 'not good', then unconsciously she will think that she deserves it to be treated bad by this sadist. That explains why she says that he "understands her" and you don't.


So what can you do now?

First of all it won't be possible to get her back. She has to work through her own issues and this will only happens when she chooses consciously to work on that. But she hasn't done that. Also, you shouldn't want her back too, because then you run a very big risk that this happens again.

So the only thing to do is forget about her and get over the situation. I know that is not easy, but I'm afraid that is the only thing to do. I would advise you to take some time and really feel your grief. Then you will be emotionally freed and can you look for a women with more self-esteem that wants to enjoy being with you.

Succes!

[JSB]

She has to learn her own painful lesson here, and I don't think there is anything you can do to for her in this situation.

Wish her well, let her go, and give yourself time to heal.

[stealth87]

Hey,

My heart goes out to you. This situation is not comfortable or pleasant to deal with. We can go on and on into psycho-analysis, to figure out why she is doing what she is doing, but it won't change anything.

It all boils down to her wanting to fill a need or void within herself. She is idolizing her ex, and looks at him from that perspective instead of for who he truly is. Clearly there is a lot of baggage involved. He was able to push the right buttons in her to get what he wanted. People who allow themselves to be manipulated don't hold themselves in high regard. Their love is also conditional and bound by self interest and egoism.

Many people will give you different takes on this situation. At the end of the day what truly matters is that the decision you make is aligned with your core essence.

If you act out of egoism, then the result you will get will be cloaked in that as well. If your intentions are not 'pure', your motives don't really matter. He might be a big dick and have a destructive ego, but if you are wanting to intervene just to show you are a better man, then expect a nasty surprise.

Even if she takes you back, the trust has been broken and your 'image' of her has collapsed. You have seen her for who she is. The question is, what are you willing to take?

The wisest decision is to step out of this situation. Set the boundaries straight and live with integrity. You can still appreciate and love a person unconditionally, without letting them run over you or treat you like a side dish. But you certainly don't want to set yourself up for more suffering, and any more involvement to this case will do just that.

I felt compelled to reply because I experienced a tough breakup not so long ago. The best decisions I made were to honor the grieving process and reach out for help.

It seems to me that you are doing both. It is just essential that you allow yourself to feel whatever emotions and thoughts that arise. Just observe them, as unpleasant and gut wrenching as they may be. The moment you provide resistance, these emotions will only intensify.

I wanted to recommend that you check out the website www.thework.com. In it a very simple questioning process is offered, where you gain complete awareness as to issues that are a constant source of sadness, anxiety and unrest.

Give yourself time to heal and make the most out of this opportunity. It is a great learning experience for you to learn about your conditioning and limiting beliefs. You don't need anyone to love you to be happy. You don't need a girlfriend to be happy. You don't need validation to be happy. And above else, you don't need your ex to give you love and validation to be happy.

Un abrazo fuerte.
Diego

[funchy]

I'm really sorry to hear about your situation. *hugs*

People are drawn to unsuitable mates and destructive relationships all the time. The trouble is they don't want to hear it, so the only way they're going to learn is to figure it out for themselves.

Be thankful it's over now not later. Be thankful you are smart enough to understand her situation and why she left. You may not agree with me now, but I feel you really are better off without her.

You might want to do some introspection on this, since you knew all along she was a poor girl just coming out of an abusive relationship. It sounds like you knew her circumstances. Were there signs she wasn't over him? Do you feel she used you or did she honestly not realize she wasn't over the ex? I'd hate to see you get pulled into this situation again.

Be careful because she might reappear in a few months, when she realizes again that the ex isn't right for her. She'll be on the rebound and be looking for someplace safe & secure (as in how she felt being with you). You sound like a really nice person, and it might be easier to block her entirely than to try to remain friends and risk being sucked into her drama and possible return.

Best wishes to you.

[MagicalRealist]

Originally Posted by strangelove

I just feel like he is going to ruin her life... but as she says 'If it wasn't him, it would be someone else.'

And she's right. This isn't about him.

It's not Mr. Nasty who is going to ruin her life, horrible as he may be and as callous as it may sound to say that; she's going to do it all on her own. Consciously or not, she has decided that this kind of relationship is, if not what she desires, at least what she deserves. As bad as it is (and as bad as she may acknowledge it is), she is still getting some sort of benefit from it. Whatever negatives are present are outweighed by what she is getting from it--what needs are being met.

It's addiction, is what it is.

Look at any junkie--he or she knows full well that using heroin will eventually put them in the hospital, in jail, or in the morgue. They know this, and telling them about the dangers of heroin use is pointless because they already know. But they started using it anyway, and they continue to use because despite all the problems it creates in their lives they still derive some sort of benefit from it (even if the only benefit is avoiding the pains of withdrawal). The high is worth all the anxiety, shame, broken relationships, and financial devestation they have to go through to get it.

A book you might find very helpful right now is Stanton Peele's Love and Addiction; it addresses these very issues.

And addicts of all kinds do not begin to recover until they decide that the price they are paying for their high is too steep, that what they have to go through to get the good feelings (or to avoid the worst pain) is no longer worth it.

Am I right to disconnect completely form this situation and let it alone?

Yes. She knows how you feel. She has chosen to ignore that, or replace it with another story.

Maybe one day she will decide she wants something different, that the "high" is no longer worth it. She might look back at your relationship as evidence that she can do better, and have something different. So don't struggle against her--tell her you love her, and let her go. That's what the friends and families of addicts have to do during interventions, when the addict refuses help.

It seems like sometimes people do not chose health, and have to go deeper into their darkness before they can ever be free.

In addiction terminology, it's called "hitting rock bottom." Some people have to go down a long way before they finally hit bottom, and some never do--they live out the rest of their lives as addicts. The best you can do is acknowledge that this is the path they are on, and let go of your desired outcome for them.

[Calvan]

You've gotten some good advice here already. Much of what I would've said has been said already. I'll add just a bit. I want to reinforce your idea of letting the feelings wash over you. Do it. Experience it to its fullest.
Unfortunately you will have to pretty much break away from the whole situation I think. You can not change people. You can only help them change and you can't even do that unless they are already trying to change themselves. You can't even convince them to want to change.
Goodluck.

[strangelove]

It's been three weeks since this happened. I thought I was beginning to feel better after 10 days or so, but recently it got worse and I have the feeling of hitting the wall.

I have a lot of negative and reproachful feelings in general. I find myself contemplating fantasies of revenge. I know that this is pretty low and I wouldn't dream of doing anything. But there is a powerful urge in me to 'get back' at them, and vindicate myself.

I think the problem partly stems from having very little confidence in myself. Objectively speaking, I know that their relationship probably won't last, and that she acted out of confusion rather than anything else. It seems to me like she destroyed our friendship because of some masochistic impulse. But these are just ideas, and they don't do much to temper my feelings, which are powerful.

I am adopting a general attitude that I should just retreat for the situation (I haven't been in touch with her for 3 weeks.) It is hard though, sometimes the (irrational) feelings are over-powering. It is very weird to wake up every morning and feel this heavy weight of feeling betrayed by someone I loved.

The thing is this feeling of anger seems to relate to feeling like I let myself get walked over. I feel like forgiveness is just going back to the old way of functioning, where I don't say how I feel about things, and don't set boundaries at all. The anger gives me a sense of power; I feel very lacking in personal power, like events happen to me, and people control me. I was wondering if it's possible to channel some of this energy in a constructive way. I feel like forgiveness would be helpful, but I don't want to be a push over again.

[lifetimelearner]

I read somewhere that I number one need as a human is

ACCEPTANCE

and when someone breaks up with you it feels like a classic case of ........
'I wasn't good enough'

I felt that a lot

all I can say is that it is a greiving process
and to give it time