The Guilt of Being a Vegetarian :(

[Hsiang-Lin]

I dunno if any of you guys have had this problem, but after talking with a friend on AIM, I realized I have this newfound, unfair bias towards meat eaters. I've been on a lacto-ovo vegetarian diet for only a month and I'm used to it already, but something new that has come with this change is that even people I would normally regard as good or nice people seem to become this vision of evil in my mind.

I feel guilty for thinking like this because I realize at the same time I still eat eggs and dairy and also I have leather products. My ultimate goal is to reduce all animal suffering and exploitation from my lifestyle.

Is there a way I can alter my model of reality so I can raise my compassion to people who still eat meat while at the same time aligning myself more and more with my goal? Thanks

[KittyG]

Be careful not to stay in contempt of other people. It's much better not to judge. Any time one is pointing their finger at someone else, it's one point against the person being pointed at and three against the person pointing.
Are any of you familiar with Sylvia Browne?
She actually recommends eating meat.

Thanks for the topic,

Kat

[Hsiang-Lin]

Hi Kat,

Thank you for your input. Yeah, I realize this is a problem and I'm hoping to educate myself and allow more compassion and understanding in my life. No, I haven't heard of her. Do you have an article or source link of hers? I would be interested in reading her views.

[AndyMartin]

As I see it, choosing compassion and understanding is still often a judgmental position because it can still put the belief on a pedestal. Attachment to belief is still an ego impulse, and it lowers awareness, no matter how good the belief may be. It's really about complete acceptance of all ways of life. You choose what is right for you, but that does not mean it's right for everyone else, no matter how strongly you feel about it. Recognizing the validity of all ways of life not only eliminates internal conflict, but also expands consciousness dramatically.

[Hsiang-Lin]

Hey AndyMartin,

That's interesting because I've thought about that before. Should we risk fascism or total acceptance? I guess I haven't really distinguished an in-between answer.

I live according to my beliefs yet, if they are illogical or unsound, then I need to implement new ones. But how do I judge if they are illogical or unsound in the first place? If I don't have any system of judgment, then how can I even operate?

Thanks and have a happy Thanksgiving everyone!

[TheColonel]

Focus on your own behavior.

The behavior of other people is not your responsibility.

[Erin Pavlina]

You know that saying, "There are none so righteous as the newly converted?" I had the same issues when I went vegan. I couldn't understand why other people weren't vegan.

But then I got to a point where my philosophy was this. "hey, I used to eat meat. Would I have wanted vegans judging me back then?"

Everyone gets to where they are going in their own perfect time and own perfect way.

I agree with the Colonel. Focus on yourself. Leave others to take notice of your example if they desire.

[KittyG]

Sylvia Browne is a physic medium. Here is her site . .

Sylvia Browne : The Official Site

[KittyG]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

You know that saying, "There are none so righteous as the newly converted?" I had the same issues when I went vegan. I couldn't understand why other people weren't vegan.

But then I got to a point where my philosophy was this. "hey, I used to eat meat. Would I have wanted vegans judging me back then?"

Everyone gets to where they are going in their own perfect time and own perfect way.

I agree with the Colonel. Focus on yourself. Leave others to take notice of your example if they desire.

"There are none so righteous as the newly converted . ."
I agree! Well said, ((((((Erin))))) =hugs
When I first learned to hold boundaries, I'd scoff at others who were boundariless. But being self-righteous is a boundary failure in itself . . As long as you're aware of your thoughts, the "newness" of being converted will wear off.
Enjoy yourself,

Kat

[Hsiang-Lin]

Thanks a lot everyone.

Now does this mean I should judge things for myself and adopt them as I see fit without regard to trying to encourage others to do the same? Is it ultimately a pointless endeavor to try to convert or tell other people the merits of something?

I guess it's like what Steve does with his website. I don't understand how to be congruent while at the same time sharing others what I believe in. Should I not even worry about others at all? Arrgh, I'm quite conflicted in this stance right now.

And Kat, I didn't find the source where she says meat is good, do you have a direct source? Don't worry if it's too much work, it's just something I'm interested on the side

[Trina]

Well, judging people like that hurts them. Maybe not physically, but being judged by someone as unworthy or less than is hurtful. I would say that respect for other humans is just important as the respect for animals that you now hold. You aren't going to go hurt a leopard just because keopards kill animals for food, right? You still respect it enough not to hurt it even though it eats meat and you don't. So, respect humans the same way.

[Erin Pavlina]

It's enticing to want to share something you learned that has changed you for the better. If people are open to hearing it, tell them. If they are not ready, let them be. "A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still."

Just live by example. My family saw dramatic improvement in my health when I went vegan. I prattled on about the benefits, but they could see for themselves. however, none of them decided to go vegan, though they are all more conscious of animal suffering now.

[AndyMartin]

Originally Posted by Hsiang-Lin

That's interesting because I've thought about that before. Should we risk fascism or total acceptance? I guess I haven't really distinguished an in-between answer.

For me it was realizing that every level of development in every area is valuable simply because it's necessary in order to reach the next level. And since there is only the present moment, it cannot be devalued by what it is not yet.

And that's assuming that the progression follows a single path. Maybe belief in diet (or in diety, or whatever) is integral to one path but not to another. We tend to thing what we experience as truth is truth for all because we define truth as universal. But truth is in what we live and our experience is intensely personal, so truth must be as well. At any rate, it's all we've got to go on, and we have to keep that in mind when sharing. But share nonetheless; just share for the sake of sharing, not for conversion.

Best,
Andy

[Hsiang-Lin]

Yeah, I've thought it over and what you guys said makes sense. I'm going to focus on bettering myself the best I can and allow others to follow if they wish.

Trying too hard to convince others can only pull me down.

I was in a sort of slump, but now I'm ready to tackle new challenges. Thanks for the advice everyone! It really helped give me new perspective.

[Cassie]

Ooh, this is tricky ground. Militant vegans/vegetarians have given this beautiful philosophy of life a very bad stigma. People will remember you judging them and be turned off by your seemingly self-righteous behavior.

Develop compassion for all life. Many people eat meat because they're ignorant on some factors. They prefer not to take responsibility for what they ingest. You, however, can be a shining example to guide them toward contemplation and awareness through your own actions of compassion.

We all have flaws and are imperfect. Try to avoid judging others as you follow your own journey.

[gberardi]

I recently went to Thanksgiving dinner with my girlfriend's family, and it was the first time they all learned that I had changed to a vegan diet. I was surprised that a lot of them didn't know the difference between vegan and vegetarian, and I found myself amazed at how much people didn't know.

Then I reminded myself that I didn't know what a vegan was until I asked about this new word, and that was within the last six years, being at college and exposed to the term. Even then, I had to read a book on the different forms of vegetarianism (ovo-lacto, vegan, etc) before I really understood anything.

My favorite question this past weekend: "So, do you just love animals, or really, REALLY hate vegetables?" B-)

I'm still learning the best response to why. Apparently "I'm doing it for health reasons" isn't good enough because it makes people really concerned that I have cancer or some other life-threatening disease. However, I did learn that if you get into specifics, someone in the room is inevitably going to be a farmer or otherwise get defensive. B-)