Do you belong to any particular faith group/religion?

[Amit]

I was born as a Hindu, but I later joined an organisation called the Brahma Kumaris and then I eventually moved away to discover my own path because I found it too limiting for who I was and the questions I had regarding existence and my purpose.

I do relate to some beliefs in some faiths such as Buddhism and Hinduism but I don't follow their path or way of life but I do adopt some of the values and include them in my personal faith system.

If you do belong to a particular faith group/religion, how do you combine your PD without breaking any of the rules as defined by the faith you follow?

[annie]

I belong to a "cult"!

[ImOpen]

Maybe you should add Pavlinism.

[Antarananda]

There are religious nuts.... and then there are spiritual fruits...

[ahimel]

I started with a little-kid view of God as some big dude in the sky that grants prayers. That matured into a more-or-less Christian viewpoint. Became a pagan early high school, then migrated back to Christian/pagan blend towards the end of high school. About a year ago recieved an epiphany explaining Buddhism, so I added that to the list. Recently I've been studying Mormans.
So I'd currently describe myself as a Morman-Buddhist with pagan overtones.

Fortunately, I was raised as a Unitarian Universalist, so I've stayed in the same church through all these changes.

[Jan Krüger]

Does agnosticism count? If so, then yes.

[dorothy hanna]

I belong to no group, or religion, but have always been interested in all faiths, and religion, and the religeous phenominon. It's always been interesting to me to study the developement of such things.

[songwriter]

No, I pick beliefs from here and there.
Like Noel Gallagher says, If I had a religion it would be The Beatles.

[Andrew Brunelle]

Here's what I think about religion. I don't mean to offend anyone, but it's a way for people to make money. It's a business like any other and they use the ultimate pressures to get you to contribute--guilt and fear. So even though i find Jesus and Buddha to be very intellectual and enlightened people and I follow some of their teachings, I do not want to associate myself with the organized religion part of it. I don't want to go to church every Sunday, I don't want to have to be guilted into contribution, so I choose to practice in a place of comfort...my home. I'm a very spirtual person, just not religious. Religion is limiting, but spirituality is infinite.

[Waffle]

I don't know what to consider myself...
I was borned a Buddhist but my family always pray to statues which is what Taoists usually do...

To me, Buddhism isn't about praying for well being but granting oneself his well being through Buddhist teachings....
There was no need to pray...

I consider myself Buddhist but I am not vegetarian, so I am not sure either if I can be considered as one...

[Amit]

Annie - which one is that?

ImOpen - Do you think Steve would approve??

Antarananda - a very beautiful saying indeed!

ahimel - A very diversified person you are indeed!

Jan - I guess you could technically say it is a faith group of sorts

Dorothy - A student all of all but belonging to none?

Andrew - That's a very valid view point, obviously not all would agree but unfortunately there are religious organisations out there just to make money!

Waffle - In buddhism is it stated that you have to be a vegetarian?

[Trina]

I was raised LDS but now I am athiest.

[Adam]

< 4 years old = LDS
4 -> 7 = Any corner church my father felt like visiting
8 -> 11 = Catholic
12 -> 16 = LDS
17 = Any corner church that I felt like visiting, from Born-Agains to Baptists.
18 -> 22 = Wicca, LDS, and Tao (yes, at the same time)
23+ = Universalist

[RandomJohn]

In buddhism is it stated that you have to be a vegetarian?

I think it depends on the flavor of Buddhism. For example, the Dalai Lama eats meat. In some schools of thought, killing an animal and eating it is ingesting bad karma. In some schools of thought, you bless the animal for giving its energy to you.

To make this post vaguely on topic,

early childhood - 15: Baptist
15 - present: I'm rolling my own, with heavy emphasis on buddhism, tantra/yoga, mysticism, huna, and, of course, church of the subgenius.

[Lotus]

First and foremost, Discordian. Sometime Pastafarian and member of The Church of the SubGenius.

Generally a follower of a mishmash of Buddhisms, which overlaps in some places with Christianity, but not a lot (I don't like some of God's fans; their snootiness puts me off). There's a tinge of Hare Krishna, Tao, and Hinduism somewhere in there. I'm down with Pagans, especially Wiccans (because I have more experience with Wicca than other Paganisms).

But I don't believe in getting my spirituality out of book. I pick up values and morals that seem inheriantly "good" and "logical" while at the same time giving me a viseral sense of "rightness".

By far, most religions exist with a very similar message: you are a spiritual being, and there is meaning in this world and this life. They just build up different architects to expain how this comes about.

[Lotus]

Originally Posted by Waffle

I consider myself Buddhist but I am not vegetarian, so I am not sure either if I can be considered as one...

You can be Buddhist and eat meat. You're not being a particularly devout Buddhist, but I say... meh; if you believe you are Buddhist, then you are Buddhist. There's lots of Christians out there that lie, fornicate, and wear clothes made out of two different fabrics. (Smooches to all the Christians reading.) There's Jews out there that have had pig and lobster. (Again, smooches to the Jewish.) There's Muslims out there that have drank alcohol (um, can you smooch a Muslim randomly without offending him/her?). And there's Buddhists out there that eat meat.

A couple of points:
Through reincarnation, every animal that is alive has probably been your mother at some point. The form of love that a mother feels for her children is considered one the most selfless forms of attatchment in which a person can engage. Therefore, it's probably not too cool to kill an entity that once harbored selfless mother-love for you.

Lesser sentients (read: everything that's sentient, but not human) have a much longer road to walk before they can achieve Enlightenment. It's very hard to invoke enough positive karma to be reborn as a human or bodhisattva when you are an animal ruled by instinct (as opposed to being ruled by some moral compass). Killing animals harms their chances of being reborn in a higher state. (Higher here means in a state in which they are better able to produce positive karma for their next rebirth.)

HOWEVER, your duty is to achieve Enlightenment
(side note: unless you wanting to be a Bodhisattva -- a person who has made it his/her duty to help to help others achieve Enlightment. Anyone who achieves perfect Enlightenment has the option to live in spiritual Nirvana, freed from the cycle of suffering and rebirth in this world... OR, that Enlightened soul can choose to keep coming back here to help others achieve Enlightenment. Generally, being a Bodhisattva is considered to be an act of great sacrifice for the good of others, since this world is utterly mired in suffering.)

It is possible for meat-eaters to achieve Enlightenment, but only on the condition that they aren't emotionally attached to eating meat. It's sort of a "I could take it or leave it, but I don't have access to any sources of quality protein, so I need to eat meat in order to keep this body alive enough to achieve Enlightenment while I'm here. After I achieve Enlightenment, I'll come back and help everybody else get to where I am."

If you are feeling guilty about eating meat, you can allay some of the guilt by performing Tonglen meditation for all the animals which you caused to be killed... keeping in mind that doing Tonglen meditation to relieve guilt is sort of missing the point of doing it.

[Waffle]

Thanks for your information about Being Vegetarian.
My father always say, it doesn't really matter as long as there's a Buddha in our hearts or something...
Basically don't do anything that you can foresee that would be detrimental to others...

[annie]

Originally Posted by annie

I belong to a "cult"!

I'll fess up.

LDS/Mormon....always have been...predict I always will be.

I'm fascinated with other religions and often read books that online friends recommend and I do the same. Then we have interesting discussions. It's been a great education and a lot of fun.

LDS books my non-LDS friends have enjoyed....Believing Christ and The Peacegiver

[Ali]

Hello All

Such an interesting subject Amit. I am a practicing Muslim. Off course I was born as a Muslim but really later I started thinking is Islam all about going to mosques and prayers .. then I got more into it and started reading and asking questions and really I got interested. That was my starting point when I discovered I can relate my faith to building a good character. Self improvement and having a decent way of life. I also loved its idea of having dialogue with other faiths and beliefs and finding common grounds. The media overshadowed my mind and for a while I thought that all the horrible things you see on TV are part of my faith loool .. crazy .. but really it isn't as what many think .. as I said once I got more into it I discovered its core teaching encourage self improvement and building a good decent society. Now am studying Islamic philosophy and doing comparative study with western philosophy. ..

Peace

Ali

[fourthdan]

hey amit

am also a hindu. specifically born into a brahmin family. more specifically i'm in a family where the heridetary occupation of men is priests in temples.

when i was younger I believed what my folks told me about god, which is pretty much what every parent tells about god - you pray, you worship, visit temples, pay your dakshina (fees) to the temple to perform poojas (worship), etc etc. it's quite similar to what most people from any religion are told about it by thier parents. Then I also went through the phase where I started questioning everything - began to see religion as a farce, a way for temples to make money and bring order to society through blind faith. And I was an atheist for a while.

However a few years ago, I got a copy of the bhagvat gita and began to read. This was the first time I was exposed to more than mythology (which I am and always was very well versed with) - I began to read the philosophy of the religion. And I began to understand the principles and the wisdom in it. And I began to think about the world, why people follow religion the way they do, and some other people don't get it and leave religion as well.

In the bhagvat gita there is an explanation of the four different kind of yoga (or ways you can connect to God):
1) bhakti yoga - through worship
2) karma yoga - through your work
3) jnana yoga - through your knowledge
4) raja yoga - through meditation

apparently all methods are just different ways to reach enlightenment.

I believe that people from all faiths tend to follow bhakti yoga since not everyone has the affinity, the patience or even the time / access to read and understand religion. So the people who governed the religion throughout the ages decided that it's better to expose people to bhakti yoga (worship) only, just cos it's far simpler and easier to teach and practice.

Unfortunately through the generations people who practice only bhakti yoga cannot answer the questions of religion - all they know is how to pray and feel devout.

If you are truly on the search for the truth, then you will (like on your journey for PD) explore the knowledge in the books of the ages... cos after all - the wisdom that has been created and passed on for over 8000 years (as per known historical records) is at least worth taking a look at before dismissing ignorantly, right?

How do I inculcate it in my PD? it's a difficult task - but I sort of refer religious text as my guidelines for PD just as I would refer to Steve's blog or Anthony robbins's books - They are all very valid points to think on and form our own belief systems. They are all formulas and strategies that help you get different places. And there are many similarities between some of the material too.

For example - Hinduism promotes being vegetarian and not consuming alcohol. Many people think it's MANDATED, when if you do the research, you'll find that even sages and holy people at one point ate meat and drank. Another section of the Bhagvat explains that it's not banned - but just intake of specific types things that will create different types of results. (i'm not gonna start explaining here, else I might as well copy paste the entire hindu religious texts ) But that's why I became vegetarian and stopped drinking alcohol. And you will find that steve does (and I think he recommends) as well. Anyways, I'm still not a great fan of worship... instead i try and follow religion through work, gaining knowledge and meditation. Those work fine for me.

One thing I like is that Hinduism, is that it DOES clearly specify that evolution in the religion is allowed depending on the time and context the people are in. Obviously I don't think they meant you can bend it whatever way you want to suit your needs. But I think this post sort of answers your question

[Amit]

Ali, that's a very interesting view point and I was curios to see if and Muslims would be on this site. It's really refreshing to hear that too. There are many Muslims that I know that take everything about Islam to heart and any bad word against Islam as worthy of a Jihad. On the flip side. I belong to a couple of Multifaith organisations and there I have met many Muslims who will happily visit a temple or gurudwara, just as we did. Islam is a wonderful religion and it's a shame that it gets so much bad press. (which I believe to be the prime reason for many of the tensions between Islam and the west)

I don't take Steve's words as gospel nor any other written text. I follow what I believe to benefit me as a human being and also that which contributes to greater good.

Hey Fourthdan - I take it you're into martial arts?

Some very interesting points there and especially about the evolution of Hinduism. It would be good to know if you know of any instances of where that has been the case.

I too am a vegetarian and I do not consume alcohol although that is more through personal choice than any particular guideline that I follow.


I guess in many ways following any faith system can be seen as personal development but the way I see it is that PD is not Mandate driven but through ones own power of choice.

[Nneka]

The way I see it, religions set up a framework for you to understand the Universe spiritually. Long ago, the worship place was the center of the community. All the knowledge, the money, the practice of life was centered around "church".

Over time, as we evolve, science has explained some of the laws, and more people have time, means, and opportunity to contemplate how things work. Different disciplines have evolved to explain different phenomena: psychology for the mind, medicine for the body, architecture for buildings and infrastructure, and so on.

Religion, then, is still the means for understanding things of Spirit. It's a framework.

Ultimately, you will have to find what works for you in your own life. There's no need to feel guilty over breaking some religious "law" when that law does not serve you. Those laws were there for a time and place. As we move forward in civilization, things become more about the Spirit of the law than the letter of the law.

That said, I go to Unity. That's been my primary "religion" for my life. I went to Catholic and Anglican (Episcopal) schools. I also about learned Hinduism and Islam in school. It was part of the coursework as my country is half East Indian. Growing up I was surrounded by different spiritual ideas and I love exploring them. I find God/Universe/Spirit/Consciousness fascinating.

[fourthdan]

@ amit - yes i'm into taekwondo, but i'm not fourthdan yet, it's a goal i wanted to remind myself so much of that I've taken it as my new nick
but i don't understand your question - instances of what specifically? (sorry, maybe i should re-read the last couple of posts to search for context)

@nenka - spot on.
Religion is a framework, it's a belief system, it's the findings and research of the millions of people before us. Whether you take into account the existance of God or not - religion's original intent was to make us become better people, and make a better society.

Look at hinduism - lots of the concepts evolved through possibly logical reasoning

vegetarianism was promoted also because we should be kinder to animals, and in india where for tens of thousands of years an agriculture based economy used lifestock as major currency for farmers.

avoiding alcohol is more obvious - there is a quote in the bhagvat that explains that it "makes the wisest of men behave like animals"... basically makes them violent, lazy, and lustful... promoting affairs, gambling and other things that are potentially destructive to a harmonious and economically better society

abstinance is promoted simply because (and again from a quote) illigetimate children have to go through hard lives, and thier mothers too (in those days contraceptives was not invented) without a father to provide them food and a roof over thier head - and would cause them to enter a life of crime

idol worship was created simply to create a focal point to manifest devotional feelings

the rythmic prayers (in shlokas and in any other mantras) were created so that people who couldn't read and write - could memorize by the tune of the prayer and pass it on from generation to generation

i can go on and on....


EDIT: One thought just struck me about PD and religion. It is said repeatedly throughout different texts that the more you strive towards the divine, the more divine qualities that begin to show in you. I have found this to be very true...

(ok, i have to put in a disclaimer here... i don't claim to be an expert on hinduism, but someone who has read a bit and thought about it himself instead of passing on second hand knowledge - and if I have made a mistake please feel free to correct )

[Jim Westergren]

Well ... I am a kind of a ex-scientologist.

I was working in their highest organizations for 5 years. I left 2 years ago. I could probably write a book about it ...

Scientology has given me a lot of insights about life, philosophy, metaphysics and a whole lot more. I have a lot of my business success to thank scientology for.

On the other hand, there are a large amount of things I don't agree on and which I consider wrong in many areas.

It has taken me 2 years of mental hard work to sort out my own standpoint and my own opinions. When I left I had to question everything and then pick up the pieces - not an easy process and it is still ongoing.

My father is a scientologist and my mother a ex-scientologist. Half of my friends are scientologists and half non-scientologists.

Anyways, I have found and worked out my own life purpose and my own path in life so there is little that can affect me today.

[Wanderer]

I was born, baptised, holy communioned and confirmed a christian but am still not sure if I believe in everything. I think religion is a journey not a destination. I will continue to make progress hopefully to improve myself until I am the best I can bewith or without religion.

[scottyp]

Raised catholic, haven't really been religious since 14. Find it an interesting topic to study and discuss and learn from but I am not particularly devoted to any religion.

[Amit]

Jim - your experience after leaving that organisation sounds very similar to my experience after leaving the Brahma Kumaris.

[dECLAN]

Originally Posted by Trina

I was raised LDS but now I am athiest.

Hmmm I find it interesting that you use a quote from Thoreau, frequent a forum such as this and consider yourself an atheist. In saying that I don't mean to question your 'beliefs' which is what atheism is really.

Have you read Thoreau's Letters to a Spiritual Seeker? Thoreau was very much against organized religion but he had some incredible spiritual experiences which is evidenced in his work. I just find it curious that some people (not necessarily you by the way) who have never experienced the spiritual realm can turn around and say that God does not exist!

[Ali]

Amit

You said "There are many Muslims that I know that take everything about Islam to heart and any bad word against Islam as worthy of a Jihad. On the flip side." ….. for some reason with all do respect to those people they always make me laugh lool .. the real teachings of Islam really doesn't teach you to behave this way. What they don't seem to understand is the difference between insults and a debate. Everyone is allowed to ask questions and DISAGREE so really no need to take it personally rather one must strive to find the right answer if they he/she doesn’t have one.

Jihad is a misused word as well, it actually means struggle against any type of difficulty and hardship you are facing.


Fourthdan

"One thought just struck me about PD and religion. It is said repeatedly throughout different texts that the more you strive towards the divine, the more divine qualities that begin to show in you. I have found this to be very true" …. I found this to be very true as well. Simply because it teaches people to strive to have good characters and establish a well ethical society where people can grow as individuals and make each other grow in the process.


thanks

Ali

[fourthdan]

ali - I think you've just got the essence of the relation between PD and religion into one statement. But I guess as much as the best intentions of religion goes, as long as there is a people factor, things do tend to go wrong sometimes. After all, religious text isn't absolute most of the time and is subject to several iterations of interpretations. This is what I see as the biggest problem religion has had in the past. However the biggest problem I see that religion faces now - is that young people are disillusioned by what they think is religion, by what they see of thier parent's generation. Both of these are really, really tragic. Because people tend to forget that most religions actually do encourage your own spiritual journey - and that organised religion is just one way of becoming more consistent (it reminds me of people having the choice to go to the gym with a work out partner. As you can guess, I always prefer working out on my own )