The human race and our need to save the world. Is it purely selfish?

[Eric L]

To be selfish is to be yourself. You are making this to be bad, IMO.

I am a human being and nothing else. I follow and carve my own path, such as all the other people on this planet are capable of doing.

To want to bring enlightenment to every person on this planet there is only one logical conclusion in the justification of it all:

To want the same thing for myself as well as everyone else. It is not selfish, you can't contend this to be selfish, since I am doing it for everyone and myself at the same time, therefore the end result is good for everyone and not just me. Thus I have proven that the word selfish was invented by the biggest fools on this planet as a way to play a joke on us all.

There is no need, there is want. The want to be happy and to bring everyone else with you at the same time.

[ChrisG]

Originally Posted by russianrocket

I just want people to realize and or admit that it is out of self interest, and that we are saving the planet for ourselves and not some grand illusion that we are saving it from ourselves.

I agree with russianrocket here. It's too easy to pass off saving the planet as something we're doing for all species. I mean, in the end, we wouldn't be doing it unless human capacity to live and enjoy life was not endangered. It's the way we are as a species.

I think, in the end, all species are selfish unto themselves. Yes, as humans we can choose to not be like that, to actually be somewhat selfless, but will we?

It's hard to define what's selfish and what's not, but definitely I would say we are (at least) mostly doing this for the sake of our own species. It's just easy to say that we're doing it for the planet as a whole. We humans like to seem philanthropic- it's like a collective ego-boost.

[ChrisG]

(pretty ironic signature, no?)

[rei]

my motivations with regard to the planet... have their origins in the heart, not the head. it may not fit logic, and it doesn't need to. it feels like the right course of action, for me.

it is not saving the planet for self, it is not saving the planet from self. it is honoring the planet, showing gratitude for the opportunity to exist here. demonstrating that i have seen evidence of the love that animates all of this. showing that appreciation from a place of core self, conscious of oneness, not a place of being an individual puttering along in an isolated existence.

but then, the notion that there is more than just the empirical evidence - it is more than mere theory or assumption in my case. it's experiential, not faith-based. i am not sure many who experience firsthand that we are more than meat suits on a chunk of rock would be comfortable pretending we are.

[Mounds]

Originally Posted by Eric L

To want the same thing for myself as well as everyone else. It is not selfish, you can't contend this to be selfish, since I am doing it for everyone and myself at the same time, therefore the end result is good for everyone and not just me. Thus I have proven that the word selfish was invented by the biggest fools on this planet as a way to play a joke on us all.

Read the book, "Words That Change Minds". It deals with meta-programs and I'm pretty sure I'm seeing a certain pattern here: My rules for me/My rules for you. I'm sure a more qualified NLPer can confirm that.
It's not a bad thing. In fact, most people have that pattern. The idea is that these people believe what is good for them is good for everyone else. Explore different meta-programs and you'll be able to connect with more people!

[Eric L]

I don't get you guys.

This planet is alive and healthy, there are trees there is water (the only thing that can sustain life) and we have oceans of it. The ozone adapts as the body does, it dissipates and reforms through the endless amounts of oxygen that is carried in the atmosphere of this planet.

Yet you look at the smoke and don't realize you are creating it, idiots.

Btw, I am one of these idiots, but I, have an end goal - I will actually do something about it instead of complaining such as you are and whether you beleive it or not is entirely the point of it all. The point is, my very dear friends, that it is all in your hands yet you keep looking instead of doing.

Shut up, get to work, stop complaining as the bosses you work for so obviously told you more than once.

I have balls of steel, I am a man, I work - every day towards my end goals with every breath I take and I **** you not, I will make **** happen and it already has started.

Wether or not you beleive it - is the point. Use your eyes and act on what you see instead of being baffled and being locked in the looking action that you are so into.

Even by writing this post, there is purpose in it, to make you realize the error of your ways and I am so effective in delivering it that I ACTUALLY know that what I am doing is actually helping you open your eyes.

But, the choice remains in your hands, what will you do?

I know what I will do and it manifests itself in the very work and words that are accomplished by this very solid body that is the badass of this planet.

I am a badass, btw, are you?

[Eric L]

Explore different meta-programs and you'll be able to connect with more people!

I have connected with everyone I came across in my life.

I have zero enemies because I choose to be a good person who chooses to interact with good people only.

The only thing I need to read in regard to connections with humans, is to study the limitless amount of areas of knowledge that I have studied myself. Although in your mind this would seem like a lot you will observe that the only things I studied are basically the surfaces of every subject on this planet. Only covering the generalizations of each area and by developing my skills as a reader and as a person who needs a good mind to remember and thus you would come to the conclusion that studying memory concepts and reading skills and applying such a concept as studying generalities one would concluded that he is a very potent learning machine yes?

I have done this. btw, my intellect is high and potent.

Throw your heaviest questions at me. I am a learning machine that this human body is capable of being. And I am efficient at it. And willing to help you.

[SomeRandomGuy]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

SRG, that line was an opinion about your opinion, not about Nature. All I was saying was that you have no idea what you're talking about.

Thanks, the next time I consider how I feel on a topic I'll remember that according to you I have no idea what I'm talking about.

[SomeRandomGuy]

Originally Posted by russianrocket

Humans living in cleaner air and having more enjoyment is not considered selfish?

Who are you to say that the things we are doing is not natural?

See, the thing is, I don't care if you want to save animals or interfere with nature. I'm not here to convince anyone otherwise. I just want people to realize and or admit that it is out of self interest, and that we are saving the planet for ourselves and not some grand illusion that we are saving it from ourselves.

I'm willing to concede that by your line of thinking those actions can be viewed as selfish. I'm ok with that. While I don't agree with your assessment, i understand the logic. My reason for joining the conversation was to share my reasons for doing what I do, to give another perspective on the OP. I didn't set out to change anyone's mind on the topic. You feel that my motivations are selfish, which isn't a big deal. I know my reasons and am at peace with that. Knowing that others consider those reasons selfish if of no importance.

[Mounds]

Originally Posted by Eric L

I don't get you guys.

This planet is alive and healthy, there are trees there is water (the only thing that can sustain life) and we have oceans of it. The ozone adapts as the body does, it dissipates and reforms through the endless amounts of oxygen that is carried in the atmosphere of this planet.

Yet you look at the smoke and don't realize you are creating it, idiots.

Btw, I am one of these idiots, but I, have an end goal - I will actually do something about it instead of complaining such as you are and whether you beleive it or not is entirely the point of it all. The point is, my very dear friends, that it is all in your hands yet you keep looking instead of doing.

Shut up, get to work, stop complaining as the bosses you work for so obviously told you more than once.

I have balls of steel, I am a man, I work - every day towards my end goals with every breath I take and I **** you not, I will make **** happen and it already has started.

Wether or not you beleive it - is the point. Use your eyes and act on what you see instead of being baffled and being locked in the looking action that you are so into.

Even by writing this post, there is purpose in it, to make you realize the error of your ways and I am so effective in delivering it that I ACTUALLY know that what I am doing is actually helping you open your eyes.

But, the choice remains in your hands, what will you do?

I know what I will do and it manifests itself in the very work and words that are accomplished by this very solid body that is the badass of this planet.

I am a badass, btw, are you?

I have connected with everyone I came across in my life.

I have zero enemies because I choose to be a good person who chooses to interact with good people only.

The only thing I need to read in regard to connections with humans, is to study the limitless amount of areas of knowledge that I have studied myself. Although in your mind this would seem like a lot you will observe that the only things I studied are basically the surfaces of every subject on this planet. Only covering the generalizations of each area and by developing my skills as a reader and as a person who needs a good mind to remember and thus you would come to the conclusion that studying memory concepts and reading skills and applying such a concept as studying generalities one would concluded that he is a very potent learning machine yes?

I have done this. btw, my intellect is high and potent.

Throw your heaviest questions at me. I am a learning machine that this human body is capable of being. And I am efficient at it. And willing to help you.

Ok Eric, your credibility is quickly approaching rock bottom.
I happen to have experience motivating people. The way you motivate is going to get you laughed off of the forum. I'll give you some tips:

-don't use a condenscending tone
-don't call your audience names
-talk in a way that's understandable

[Eric L]

Mound is right, there is no sense in my words.

Sorry guys...lol.

I get what you said though Mound, and I'm sorry to bring about these behaviors. How rude of me....ugh...someone slap me

[Mounds]

I'm actually trying to throw you a bone here. You might have a very helpful inspiring message but, at least for me, it's getting lost in the mine's-bigger-than-yours attitude.
If you keep running into disagreement with your posts, maybe it's time to try a new approach.

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by Mounds

I'm actually trying to throw you a bone here. You might have a very helpful inspiring message but, at least for me, it's getting lost in the mine's-bigger-than-yours attitude.
If you keep running into disagreement with your posts, maybe it's time to try a new approach.

Intellects that are high and potent tend to try new approaches.

[Mounds]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

Intellects that are high and potent tend to try new approaches.

That's great and everything but who is going to listen to a person who calls others idiots? I'm intelligent as well, difference is that I don't call down others in an attempt to prove it.
Sorry for derailing the thread. One of these days I'm going to realize that whoring out my time to pointless internet arguements is unwise.

[rei]

Originally Posted by Mounds

That's great and everything but who is going to listen to a person who calls others idiots? I'm intelligent as well, difference is that I don't call down others in an attempt to prove it.
Sorry for derailing the thread. One of these days I'm going to realize that whoring out my time to pointless internet arguements is unwise.

at least you said something... i was just sitting here on my hands, eggshell city, i saw something going on there but felt it wouldn't really help things to say what i saw so i have just been a voyeur here

i agree, though, you don't have to talk down to people and call them idiots to make a point or demonstrate that you have knowledge they may value. if anything folks tend to be less open to what you're selling when you approach it that way...

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by Mounds

That's great and everything but who is going to listen to a person who calls others idiots? I'm intelligent as well, difference is that I don't call down others in an attempt to prove it.
Sorry for derailing the thread. One of these days I'm going to realize that whoring out my time to pointless internet arguements is unwise.

Yeah, that was not one of my better quips. =/

[russianrocket]

Originally Posted by Eric L

To be selfish is to be yourself. You are making this to be bad, IMO.

I am a human being and nothing else. I follow and carve my own path, such as all the other people on this planet are capable of doing.

To want to bring enlightenment to every person on this planet there is only one logical conclusion in the justification of it all:

To want the same thing for myself as well as everyone else. It is not selfish, you can't contend this to be selfish, since I am doing it for everyone and myself at the same time, therefore the end result is good for everyone and not just me. Thus I have proven that the word selfish was invented by the biggest fools on this planet as a way to play a joke on us all.

There is no need, there is want. The want to be happy and to bring everyone else with you at the same time.

Ever read the selfish gene? The betterment of the people around you will lead to the betterment of yourself. Just because you don't agree with it, doesn't change that. The people who avoid the word selfish are just to scared to admit that it is human nature to be selfish. Is it bad to be selfish? Apparently you feel that I'm saying that it is. I really don't care if a person is selfish. It's the people who think that they are doing things for purely selfless reasons that I care about mentioning this too. People who think that they are some how different then the rest of us normal humans. Another thing that humans also share is their propensity to be arrogant creatures.


PS. I can honestly say that I've never met a more arrogant person or someone who has a bigger ego then you. I swear to jeebus that while reading your posts, I'm expecting to see some sarcastic remark or at least a "j/k". There is no way that some of the things you say are for real. Take that how you will, but that really is the way I see your posts. I'm sure everyone else on here sees it exactly the same way, and I doubt you are swaying a single person. When so many people complain about the way you come off, don't you think it's time to rethink things, with your super huge, bigger then all of us intellect? Unless you come off differently in person, I also doubt that you don't have enemies, or at least ones that have the balls to tell you so.

[Artelus]

Originally Posted by rei

i can only speak for myself.

any efforts i may do which seek to honor the environment here - i don't do them for future generations. i do them because i feel how much Gaia deserves it.

yes, you probably scoff at the anthropomorphizing of the planet. i am not speaking of the physical structure of the planet though, i'm speaking of its sentient awareness. labeling that awareness is just for convenience, basically.

what i do, i do for Gaia. it is a way to respect her when so many don't bother. it isn't about the future either, not for me anyway.

but i don't even recycle, thanks to Penn and Teller's revealing episode on the subject. plenty of hippies have given me flack for that, but oh well.

I can only speak for humanity. Any effort I give to honor the environment here - I do them not only for future generations; I do them to save humanity.

Yes, I scoff at the anthropomorphizing of the planet. I know you are not speaking of the physical structure of the planet though, You are just speaking of its sentient awareness (humanity, and maybe dolphins?)

What I do, I do for Humanity. Not because I hold humanity to high esteem, as a matter of fact it's quite the contrary. I do it to ensure that humanity will be conscious enough to prevent the suffering it is causing right now from happening in the future.

I recycle. Even though I'm not a hippie.


---

On a side note, the planet doesn't really need to be saved, unless ALL life is in danger of becoming extinct. And humanity, as many extinctions we might have caused, cannot eradicate all life on this planet no matter what.
On the other hand, what you call "saving" the planet I call keeping it hospitable for us to live on. If you have anything against keeping the human species alive, then you shouldn't be part of this species.

[rei]

Originally Posted by Artelus

I can only speak for humanity. Any effort I give to honor the environment here - I do them not only for future generations; I do them to save humanity.

Yes, I scoff at the anthropomorphizing of the planet. I know you are not speaking of the physical structure of the planet though, You are just speaking of its sentient awareness (humanity, and maybe dolphins?)

What I do, I do for Humanity. Not because I hold humanity to high esteem, as a matter of fact it's quite the contrary. I do it to ensure that humanity will be conscious enough to prevent the suffering it is causing right now from happening in the future.

I recycle. Even though I'm not a hippie.


---

On a side note, the planet doesn't really need to be saved, unless ALL life is in danger of becoming extinct. And humanity, as many extinctions we might have caused, cannot eradicate all life on this planet no matter what.
On the other hand, what you call "saving" the planet I call keeping it hospitable for us to live on. If you have anything against keeping the human species alive, then you shouldn't be part of this species.

um. should i be flattered that you imitated my post in your response?

[Artelus]

Originally Posted by rei

um. should i be flattered that you imitated my post in your response?

Yes.

[rei]

Originally Posted by Artelus

Yes.

thanks for clearing that up and consider me flattered

[curiousmind]

Are you willing to let your body heal it self when you are really sick?