Honesty

[pjhaggerty]

I would like to hear some opinions on this quote from Robert Greene:

"Honesty is actually a blunt instrument, which bloodies more than it cuts. Your honesty is likely to offend people; it is much more prudent to tailor your words, telling people what they want to hear rather than the coarse and ugly truth of what you feel or think"

Do you think it is more important to be honest with yourself, honest with others, both, or neither? and why? Especially in the context of dealing with people who might not have the emotional maturity to handle your honest opinion constructively.

[ttt]

I think it's fine not to be honest if you don't hide that you are not a person who always tells the truth. Especially with people who are not honest themselves. Just because an information is true doesn't mean it is useful or must be shared.

[rekcuF]

Definitely most important is to be honest with yourself. As for dealing with others, everyone handles this differently. Just think about how you make your points.

From my experience I agree with Robert Greene, its better to tailor your words especially if you want to get a point across. Being direct and brutally honest just gets people defensive and solves nothing. If you just want to vent then it doesn't matter I guess.

When in doubt, use humour.

[spirit4711]

Unasked honest opinions are usually not welcome so I refrain from that (biting my tongue a lot).

If people want my opinion on something I first check if they really want an honest opinion or rather flattery.

If I give my opinion I usually also say why I have that opinion. Gives the other the opportunity to correct false assumptions on my side. Being honest is very important but so is timing and tact.

[Manomanman]

Wage slaves and low-conscious people cannot hear the truth. It is a blunt cutting instrument to them, constantly gnawing and tearing at their web of self-delusion.

Conscious people crave truth.

[James81]

I'm a pretty blunt, honest person.

I'm discovering more and more that people do not want blunt honesty. A very large portion of people out there simply can't handle it.

[brendannz]

If you're honest to the world, the world will be honest to you, and then you learn real lessons, rather than just an illusion..

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by james81

i'm a pretty blunt, honest person.

I'm discovering more and more that people do not want blunt honesty. A very large portion of people out there simply can't handle it.

you can't handle the truth!!

[James81]

Originally Posted by brendannz

you can't handle the truth!!

lol

[The Cloud]

If you're false with others, it's very unlikely that you're being honest with yourself.

[rei]

definitely best to be honest with the self. as for others, i know a few people who demand total honesty and give it themselves. sometimes it seems to cause unnecessary conflict though.

i think we can tailor our words without being false. we can share our truth in a diplomatic way, and if we know how to do this and choose bluntness anyway, that smacks of a combative need to stir up drama to me. not always, but sometimes.

very interesting quote and topic.

[blossom]

I'm pretty blunt and honest, and I am aware that it doesn't endear me to too many people. I just have a sense that if something really needs to be said, then I'll say it without sugar-coating words...and however it is recieved is up to the reciever...it's not really my business. I used to worry about upsetting people...but I got past that. Usually when it upsets them it indicates that the truth has surfaced, and of course they don't like it...but I can't abide lies. I'm a bit schizo that way...hate lies...hate em! Of course, I don't like hearing the truth either but if I had the choice, I'd rather be hurt by the truth than disrespected with a lie!

Of course, in different contexts I can be diplomatic, like in the workplace where I could get sacked for speaking my mind too bluntly...so I temper it.

[Michelle]

Originally Posted by pjhaggerty

I would like to hear some opinions on this quote from Robert Greene:

"Honesty is actually a blunt instrument, which bloodies more than it cuts. Your honesty is likely to offend people; it is much more prudent to tailor your words, telling people what they want to hear rather than the coarse and ugly truth of what you feel or think"

Do you think it is more important to be honest with yourself, honest with others, both, or neither? and why? Especially in the context of dealing with people who might not have the emotional maturity to handle your honest opinion constructively.

Honesty without love is brutality.

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by Michelle

Honesty without love is brutality.

A truth told with bad intent,
beats all the lies you can invent

[SomeRandomGuy]

I prefer complete honesty is all situations. If I am in a situation where I think being honest will cause conflict I will often just not say anything. I think the world would be much better if everyone were always honest, assuming, of course, that people were willing to hear the truth.

[The Big D]

Originally Posted by pjhaggerty

I would like to hear some opinions on this quote from Robert Greene:

"Honesty is actually a blunt instrument, which bloodies more than it cuts. Your honesty is likely to offend people; it is much more prudent to tailor your words, telling people what they want to hear rather than the coarse and ugly truth of what you feel or think"

Do you think it is more important to be honest with yourself, honest with others, both, or neither? and why? Especially in the context of dealing with people who might not have the emotional maturity to handle your honest opinion constructively.

Depends I suppose. I try to be honest with myself, but I don't claim to be any better at it than anyone else.

With other people, I typically try to avoid honesty in real life if it's going to be ugly unless it's someone I know I mesh well with intellectually. The one exception is on technical matters (I'm an engineer by training) where I tend to always air everything out. That tendency has probably served me poorly, on the whole.

[ar81]

People do not like truth.
This is why you have so many journalists murdered.
For politicians, honesty is more brutal than genocide.

[Michael Chui]

1) Truth in words exists irrespective of speaker or listener.
2) Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth.
3) We interpret words in order to gain meaning from them.
4) We interpret words differently, so we each gain different meanings from them.
5) Some of these meanings are true, and some of these are false.
6) Honesty is choosing the true meanings over the false ones.

Honesty is dependent on the listener, not the speaker.

A good speaker knows his audience, and elicits honesty in listening. He explains a concept to a Christian using Christian terms, and explains the same concept to an atheist without references to God. He explains a concept to a musician by making analogies to their violins, and to an engineer by comparing it with a measuring stick.

An honest person whose words are brutal is not being brutal; he is being crude. Just because knocking down a wall lets you enter a house does not mean you shouldn't try tapping on the front door. Of course, if the doors are barred and the windows are shut, then sure. Cut them to the heart with your truth and lay it bare, if that will do what you need.

It is a good thing to speak your mind and let your heart shout. But that is good for you, not for the person you're speaking to. So the psychatrist says, "Write them an angry letter, then tear it up." Then go and speak with them reasonably.

It is not noble to speak "hard truths"; it is arrogant. If you feel a need to frame something in a way you know will hurt another person, perhaps you should look to your own emotional maturity. Why does this hard truth need to be said? Are you, perhaps, a bit too emotionally invested in the outcome yourself? It salves the ego to be able to declaim a Hard Truth, shattering the minds of the ignorant and cornering those who disagree with you. An ultimatum.

Yes, sometimes the blow must be struck. But should your first resort, when confronted with an ignorant person, really be to hit them upside the head with The Truth?

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by blossom

like in the workplace where I could get sacked for speaking my mind too bluntly...so I temper it.

Which comes back to 10 reasons you should never get a job..

[Michael Chui]

Originally Posted by brendannz

Which comes back to 10 reasons you should never get a job..

And as an entrepreneur, you have total freedom to tell every client they're an idiot, amirite?

[Brutha]

And as an entrepreneur, you have total freedom to tell every client they're an idiot, amirite?

As Tim Ferriss always says, it's important to fire those idiots.

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by Michael Chui

And as an entrepreneur, you have total freedom to tell every client they're an idiot, amirite?

Well if they're being an idiot you can freely...

[gigij]

I think honesty is overrated.
If I look at myself honestly I'm pretty sure that I lie every single day.
I don't believe that I'm the only one - look inside ... are you really 100% honest all the time?
Be honest now

[Brown Eyed Mystic]

Originally Posted by gigij

If I look at myself honestly I'm pretty sure that I lie every single day.

Now that was honestly said

Personally, I am quite direct and at times blunt (I attach a statement before being so, making the person know that I am really going to be blunt, they get the time to adjust). At other times when I think there's a diplomacy needed if I speak, I tend to remain silent. So, in a way I choose diplomacy only when its utterly required for me to do so, else I don't indulge in the talking. It appears to me that I can be easily more honest with the close ones than acquaintances.

[songindarkness]

Honesty without love is brutality.

Thanks for this quote, Michelle! Absolutely right. Love and Truth are equally important. Not caring about how we make people feel is just as bad as lying to them.

[Marko500]

I think we should make a distinction between:

1. Honesty
2. Ego

Ego will always talk to others that there are not good, while the honest people just express their opinions without condemnation.

I may be thinking that you did something wrong, but that does not mean that I will add a label that you are a "stupid" or "idiot". This marking is not honesty, it's ego.

We should be honest with ourselves and with others. This does not mean you have to go around and talk about what's wrong with people, especially if they do not want to hear your opinion.

Nobody is perfect, and we need to accept that, instead to pretend and lie to each other.
We need to focus on growth. And you can do it only if you are honest.

[Donkey1]

Lol. Some are saying people don't want to hear the truth. Well, people don't want to be lied to either.

For example, if you see a ridiculously fat person walking down the street most people try not making eye contact because they think they are doing them a favor by not COMMUNICATING with an overly obese person. Then they'll go around their back talking about how fat they were. I forget the point I was getting at, but yeah.

But yeah, I like being real. I tried the be nice to everyone for a day just to see what would happen, but I felt sick doing it. Something about it didn't feel right to me. Might be the same on the opposite end where a nice person who likes to comfort wouldn't enjoy being blunt.

[blossom]

Everyone lies every day, because we all have these social obligations imposed on us that mean that we must lie and say "Ï'm fine" when someone asks how we are (when they really don't want to know how you are, they just want you to say "fine", even if you're not fine). I wish it were o.k for people to just say..."hey, I'm pretty sad actually" or "o.k, could be better, could be worse" or just flat out "bad"! Noone lets anyone be honest...it's like it's a huge sin to say how you are really feeling!

[brendannz]

Originally Posted by blossom

Everyone lies every day, because we all have these social obligations imposed on us that mean that we must lie and say "Ï'm fine" when someone asks how we are (when they really don't want to know how you are, they just want you to say "fine", even if you're not fine). I wish it were o.k for people to just say..."hey, I'm pretty sad actually" or "o.k, could be better, could be worse" or just flat out "bad"! Noone lets anyone be honest...it's like it's a huge sin to say how you are really feeling!

Sometimes if you say "I'm really bad today" you're not being honest, you're just being a whiner, and focusing on negative things.

But yep, society expects us to be cheerful all the time, smiling in a job we hate, come Christmas time, we have to put on a happy face, wear silly hats, eat lots, sing christmas carols, and spend money on someone else, with the expectation of receiving something back in return..

[ar81]

If you tell a politician, "Hey, I saw you stealing money!!" he may not like it.
Politicians do not like inconvenient truths.
So if truth becomes offensive in a non ego based situation, then it means that there is a problem of values where freedom of speech may be undesirable.