Loner-types and success

[coffegirl]

I made the observation that many successful people tend to be loners.
In many areas of life...
Schoolmates,which grades are above-average,often seem to have a very solitary mindset and rarely do any group work.
A lot of people I know,who managed to reach their target,were lone fighters struggling with outsiderness before they finally accomplished more than some others.
Also many celebritites state that they were outsiders in their younger days.
People often state that you need others in order to be successful,but based on my observations,a significant number of overachievers seem to be lone fighters.
Is it that other people stay away,for whatever reason,or do loners consciously decide to take care of their own business and run the extra mile by themselves?
I always thought that as an loner your opportunities are genereally worse,but maybe in some respects they have more space than others because they´re not bound to the crowd.
A person who follows the common crowd,choose the middle course,but a lone fighter do not play by other people´s rules.
What do you think?
Do loners have any considerable advantages over crowd followers?

[Remiel]

Is it a loner? Or could it be a leader? Someone who steps away from the crowds and chooses not to be a follower?

I'm reminded of that demotivational poster on Elitism, It's lonely at the top. But it's comforting to look down upon everyone at the bottom.
Elitism

Could there be a bit of truth to that? How many people that are a part of the crowd ever strive to reach the top while remaining a part of that said crowd?

[YourHumbleNarrator]

If you're gonna stand out from the crowd, you're going to be a loner. I'm using that word in the metaphysical sense-you are still a loner in a crowd of people if your inner life is not like the inner lives of those around you. If you have the insight necessary to propel yourself along your chosen path, you have what few people share; you are different. You will lead others or you will work alone.

When it is not clear that you're doing either, you're manipulating circumstances without leaving your personal mark. You may need other people, but you know what you need them for and the truth is they'll need you more than you need them. What makes you successful cannot be given to you or taken from you, thus the externals are interchangeable.

That's my take on it.

[brendannz]

I think sometimes the popular kids who are jocks peak too early in their teens, and so they have less motivation to become anything with their lives.. then when they get to their 30s their lives are more boring.. sometimes anyway

[blossom]

It's certainly nice to read other people contemplating the positives of loners, instead of thinking they're all serial killers.

I'm a loner, and I can tell you now, I wouldn't have it any other way. People are so afraid of being alone, but being alone allows you the space, as someone said, to do what you really want, without having to get caught up in the dynamics of groups of friends where one person is always the dominating figure and everyone else just has to go along with what he/she wants to do. Plus, I enjoy my own company more than most people I meet, so when more extroverted people talk about us wierdo's who are so sad, with no friends...they really don't know what they are talking about! We have our Best friend...ourselves!

It's just a pity the media gives us such a bad rap! There are, of course, certain types that are extremely damaged psychologically, and are "serial killer"material, and it's unfortunate that they are the same as loners, in that they have few friends and spend all their time alone...the difference is the loners CHOOSE to spend the majority of their time alone, without friends, they entertain themselves and are usually pretty creative. Some of the worlds most acclaimed artists and actors are and were loners...and some of the most brutal and vicious serial killers in history were in fact very social types, who participated in community and had lots of friends and family and built up personas and trust with people, who they then turned on...so there is alot of misinformation out there!

[YourHumbleNarrator]

Originally Posted by blossom

I'm a loner, and I can tell you now, I wouldn't have it any other way. People are so afraid of being alone, but being alone allows you the space, as someone said, to do what you really want, without having to get caught up in the dynamics of groups of friends where one person is always the dominating figure and everyone else just has to go along with what he/she wants to do. Plus, I enjoy my own company more than most people I meet, so when more extroverted people talk about us wierdo's who are so sad, with no friends...they really don't know what they are talking about! We have our Best friend...ourselves!

People who cannot stand time alone are not psychologically whole. This is a key to success: you have to enjoy your own company. If you rely on other people to affirm that you are not a royal jackass whose mother should be ashamed her body conceived you, you do not have the courage to make something of yourself.

Loners make people uncomfortable. True confidence highlights the insecurities of others. That's something they'd rather keep buried. Their only way to cope is to put their attention on the loners and stigmatize them so they're not challenged to change their own behavior. That's what happens anytime ignorance wins out over discernment. The cost of honesty is too high; it leads to the abandonment of their illusions.

[blossom]

This is very true YourHumbleNarrator. I have experienced so much rejection from people who feel uncomfortable around me for exactly that reason, I don't give them what they want, which is my constant undivided attention...I'm too busy coming up with ideas for a painting or pondering the depths of my own emotional ocean...but in the end, they do me a favour, and I no longer have to be around them and experience their constant need for validation and approval. An analogy for it would be that introverted/loner types are like cats (which are universally despised by extroverted types, in general, because they are happy to be independent and don't need people so much, which people wrongly percieve as being "selfish") and extroverts are more like dogs...constantly needing attention and following you around wherever you go wanting to please you! This is not a "bad"thing, but personally it drives me nuts...I just think, "why can't you just leave me alone and entertain yourself for a change" It feels like a burden to me to always feel like I HAVE to be a certain way so my friends can feel secure, and often they just use me so they don't have to be seen as being alone!
It can be a curse though, as we tend to listen more than most people do, so we attract people with problems who just want to dump them on us and not reciprocate. So it's very draining, which makes us very aware of and conserving of our energy supply, which often is not as endless as extroverts...who are the majority on this planet.
People call us self-centred, but really, loners are more likely to be very sensitive to the needs of other people...their REAL needs, not the needs people THINK they have and decide for them! That's just bossiness. We tend to really think about , and put ourselves in the other persons shoes so as to empathize with them...and we get written off as "selfish" for it!

[YourHumbleNarrator]

The interesting thing is that I don't think I'm an introvert. I'm an extrovert that's accompanied to spending long periods of time in solitude. I could be mistaken, but in a crowd I exhibit classic extroverted behavior. Where I differ from most, I think, is in my insistence on depth in communication.

Regardless, I think standing alone has little to do with whether you're introverted or extroverted. Time alone is good for everybody now and again, and depth of thought can be achieved in any mind regardless of its structure. It comes down to whether you're doing what's expected of you or you're acting from your core. The latter is what sets someone apart.

[blossom]

It is interesting that as an extrovert, you appreciate being alone! If truth be told, I wasn't always Introverted, though my research into it says that it is a fixed temperment and the brain is just wired that way...but I distinctly remember questioning why mum had always told me that being alone was the worst thing in the world...and what was so scary about it, and endeavoured to find out by experimenting with it. Solitude turned out to be so wonderful, that I became a full Hermit for years...my family were and still are convinced there is something really wrong with me...but it felt so good and contentment set in easily, that I never turned back, and now I can't handle being around people for too long, as their content of conversation are usually so dissatisfying to me, that I'd rather be alone, and talking for the sake of talking is just a waste of energy. I don't really like talking that much.

Most psychologist that know what they are talking about, know that most people are both introverted and extroverted to some degree...though there are extreme exceptions of course!

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by coffegirl

Do loners have any considerable advantages over crowd followers?

There are many different ways to be successful.

Some successful people are loners; some are not; and some are somewhere in between.

A successful loner may be successful because he's eliminated distractions and drama from other people. For example, a scientist who achieves success because he's usually working hard at his research, instead of playing golf, drinking beer and socialising with friends etc.

On the other hand, a successful non-loner may be successful because he's learned to organise and tap into group resources, support and and systems. For example, a CEO who achieves success because of the contributions and teamwork of his senior managers.

[FazK]

I think that loners have a far harder time being successful. To get anywhere in life you will need the help of others. You will their support / knowledge / skills etc. Very little can be achieved completely alone trust me i know from experience. In a way it also depends who you surround yourself with are you flying with eagles or lying down with dogs. Many successful people "make no useless acquaintances" and will instead surround themselves with only useful successful people. I guess i just depends how you look at it.

Also never ever believe a celebrity when they say they were "outsiders" in their younger days. This is their ego speaking pure and simple. You cannot get very far entirely on your own especially in show biz

[Remiel]

Originally Posted by FazK

Also never ever believe a celebrity when they say they were "outsiders" in their younger days. This is their ego speaking pure and simple. You cannot get very far entirely on your own especially in show biz

So there is no way possible that these people "might" have seen the overwhelming shallowness of their friends and realized that they truely were alone, even while surrounded by tens to hundreds of people?

Have you ever noticed how some (not all mind you) beautiful women tend to be the shallowest? Perhaps in a sense they could be recognizing what that shallowness cost them?

[blossom]

I was talking about celebrities who claim to be introverts NOW not when they were younger...like Johnny Depp, who stears clear of paparazzi and interviews, like they were the plague!
I agree that if you want to be successful in the business world or in other realms, you do need other people and I'm not saying that loners don't NEED people, humans are social beings after all, I'm saying that loners don't need people AS MUCH as more extroverted types! It is harder for loners to "make it" as they don't usually like small talk, and that is required in society in most interactions with people, as is networking which is exhausting for most introverts. Maybe "success" doesn't come as quickly or as easily to us as it would to extroverts, but we live by the tenet that "slow and steady wins the race". But hey, it's a world where the majority are extroverts so this isn't the popular method or mantra! Whatever works for an individual I say, and there are different ways of being successful! I'm successful at making polenta muffins with cheese and corn, and other yummies. It all counts towards building self-esteem for yourself, not necessarily how others may percieve you as "successful"!

Also, I would think that celebrities speaking of how many friends they have or how popular they are would be more the language of the Ego. Most celebrities wouldn't admit to having few friends or not wanting to be around people, as they are so caught up in what their public image is, (regardless if it's true or not), and people would probably label them "losers" if they did!

[Annya]

I completely agree with YourHumbleNarrator. I also share some qualities with Blossom in this respect.

I would classify myself as someone who prefers to be alone rather than in the company of others and even so I would rather be in a small group of people. I choose solitude. People say I am introverted but I like YourHumbleNarrator am very extroverted when I need to be, in social settings, I like making people laugh. I do find small talk and "useless" socializing a waste of time, but not because of any anxieties or shyness I may harbor, probably more due to the people I sometimes find myself in the company of recently, many of whom are quite shallow and superficial. Anyway, I have always been artistic, be it fine arts, music and especially writing. In school I was singled out as a smart kid, I stayed away from group projects. I'm studying to be a doctor now. In some ways I do think that if I had been much more social growing up I would have strayed from my academic path, but then I can't know for sure what would have happened in that circumstance. I have much more in common with you blossom but then I would just be reiterating.

I do want to mention though that choosing to be alone, as blossom stated is stigmatized because we perceive people who prefer to be alone as being depressed or antisocial. And many are, I personally know a couple of people who exhibit depressive behaviour but then it seems so to me because I have the dsm and related literature memorized (psych major) but to them it could be perfectly normal. As far as success is concerned, its like the chicken and egg questions- is loneliness* a result/byproduct of being vastly talented and successful or is talent bred out of choosing to be alone?

*not in a negative sense

[eruso]

Originally Posted by YourHumbleNarrator

People who cannot stand time alone are not psychologically whole. This is a key to success: you have to enjoy your own company. If you rely on other people to affirm that you are not a royal jackass whose mother should be ashamed her body conceived you, you do not have the courage to make something of yourself.

Loners make people uncomfortable. True confidence highlights the insecurities of others. That's something they'd rather keep buried. Their only way to cope is to put their attention on the loners and stigmatize them so they're not challenged to change their own behavior. That's what happens anytime ignorance wins out over discernment. The cost of honesty is too high; it leads to the abandonment of their illusions.

Very well put. I totally agree. Loner = independence.

[Knk]

Like Blossom, I think that many introverted people don't like small talk, which makes up the majority of conversations we have with each other. Talking about how your new shirt seems to have shrunk in the wash, or the fact that "Johnny is flirting with married Suzy" doesn't necessarily feel stimulating enough. I am definitely the introvert type, and I find that whenever I'm in a social situation, I have this instant desire to go do something else. When people are talking I feel like it's a constant effort to focus on what they are saying, and it's a constant effort to not allow myself to drift off in to my own little world. I'd rather be reading a book, or searching on the internet and learning about something fascinating, such as the raw diet, or a recent scientific discovery, than to talk about something so trivial as the fact that my little dog bit the neighbor on the knee. I know that if I spent all my time talking and socializing with people, and very little time alone, I'd probably have a breakdown.

That being said, I think most introverts are mistaken as not desiring relationships or the company of other people. Even though I am an introvert, I value relationships and connection as the most important aspects of human life. I really could not imagine myself genuinely happy without people I care about, or people who care about me. If I imagine a future without a spouse and children, I feel a sense of dread.

I've always felt like I have a very high functioning form of autism called - asperger's syndrome. "Aspergians" are known to be some of the most introverted people on the planet.

[SMA]

Wow. This is such an interesting conversation and I'm grateful for all of you in this post. Strangely enough, I was just pondering this today and wrote a post on one of my blogs...thinking about how much I enjoy my own company and how there's nothing WRONG with that, as I had thought for a very long time.

Like many of you, perhaps, I find there are more people online with whom I have a lot in common, simply because we tend to gravitate towards the same things- personal development, conscious growth type of stuff. The internet is so much bigger than my social circle, and so much richer in certain ways. It in no way replaces authentic relationships but it certainly expands one's ability to communicate with like-minded individuals.

In fact, it seems to me and I'll agree with some previous commentors (ers?) that successful people - some, at least - follow their passions and work and live from the heart. This cannot be done by being part of a mediocre, crowd mentality, and takes a special individual who thinks for themselves...this often leads to being the type of person who simply enjoys their own company. I can so relate to wanting interactions to be meaningful and was remarking about it in my blog post (see Breathing Prosperity .com / blog) - interestingly, it was in response to reading an article of Steve's that I wrote it. He seems to have found a great combination of social skills and individuality...of relating on a deep level and being entirely free-thinking. I love it!

[ar81]

It depends on what you define as success.
I consider myself "successful" because I am happy but I also acknowledge that it may not be the same definition for other people.

[BlackBird23]

I am a loner, but I have read that a loner - due to his/her anti-social 'nature' - will find it harder to succeed (financially) in a world that is steadily become about social networking and the 'global village'. To succeed, you really do need other people and these links could be the difference between getting a job or job interview and not getting either.

Though the pros of being a loner has been addressed, I want to confess some cons. I am inward looking and 'seeking', but I find myself more often than not thinking rather than doing, which would be the case is perhaps I was more social. Its easy to drift into fantasy when alone and though I can motivate myself well enough to do anything I really want to do, I sometimes think with that social edge I would be so much better at 'doing' and making things happen.

Being a loner puts you in your own sort of 'class', but if you lack the knowledge of the 'group' this may lead to you 'falling behind' socially which could lead to lowered successes or failure. Like revising for a test - you may choose to revise alone while your peers revise as a group; you may not understand something no matter what, but having so many minds in a group one might and eventually others catch on - basically it is this form of inspiration loners may miss out on and may lead to them severely lacking in one field whilst maybe having an edge in their own spiritual/inner realm... But surely a balance is optimal?

Being a loner could damage your social skills and thus hamper things like job interviews, communication with your superiors/colleagues and even relationships. And I'll be honest; even though I have a very athletic body and may be seen as handsome (), at 23, I have only ever been in one relationship and I kind of do find it awkward to approach women... I won't say Im incredibly unconfident - I'm not - But I feel as a 'loner' I am lacking certain social skills and experiences.

[ar81]

A loner has more time available than those with a couple so he has more time to achieve.
A leader can move masses and make them achieve in bigger scale.
A person with social skills and connections can find the easier way to achieve.

[YourHumbleNarrator]

BlackBird, it's really up to the loner to make up for those shortcomings. They're not even inherent to that way of life-it's quite possible be both a loner and be relaxed in social situations. It all comes down to knowing what you want and, in accounting for your nature, figuring out how to get it.

A loner has significantly more advantages once they get their house in order. They can draw on inner resources that are unfathomable to most. The real downside is that it's a difficult path to master. Loners are much more likely to be late bloomers, or to fail altogether. And because they process things so differently they're unlikely to benefit from the same things other people do, like brainstorming sessions during group work. That's another difficulty-nearly everything has to be custom designed for them, usually by their own hand, though they can benefit from the input of others. For them, principles matter far more than methods.

More extroverted types have their difficulties as well, primarily because they can benefit from drawing upon more of their inner resources than is natural for them to do, yet unlike loners they don't have an instinctive knowledge of the inner realm. You're correct in that a balance is desirable. A well developed person of one side is indistinguishable from the other. However, balance is only achieved by embracing (and even emphasizing) one's core nature.

And I want to revise what I said earlier-I'm an introvert. I realized it while sorting through some old emotional baggage the other day. I'm an introvert who's quite sociable. I've ridden the line so well that it was difficult to tell which dominated.

[blossom]

That's the thing about introverts that even introverts misunderstand about themselves. We are sociable...it's just that we are very selective about who we want to socialize with, since most people talk about really inane stuff that we percieve to be a waste of our energy. We get written off as 'snobs'for this, or haughty and selfish for not wanting to give our energy, but extroverts just can't fathom that we don't have the same amount of energy as they do to throw away on meaningless small talk that is often just a way for other people to feel comfortable and avoid SILENCE! Being so careful to conserve what energy we have, being alone is a way in which we replenish our reserves and can be quiet and therefore more receptive to subtler information.
The same way we cannot handle being around loud people who talk too much and take our energy...extroverts cannot handle being around us as they cannot handle the quiet...it makes them uncomfortable because when you are quiet, you can THINK, which introverts like to do. Extroverts speak their thoughts out as soon as they have them, whereas we have the same thoughts, we just prefer to be quiet and not share them with the whole world, and we also like to be thoughtful and mindful about what we are talking about.
I wish extroverts would start making the effort to try and understand that about introverts instead of trying to make us more extroverted like them...as if that's the 'right'way to be...it's not, it's just different to how they are, and it's time extroverted started appreciating us a bit more...and for introverts to start appreciating themselves a bit more inspite of what messages we recieve from the world that we are "wierd" or "strange" or any other alienating damaging messages. Introversion is a bonafide temperment that any psychologist worth his/her salt is aware of. There is nothing wrong with us, we are just different to extroverts, and differences are what make diversity so interesting. Maybe if people were a bit more open-minded they would realise that instead of fearing those who are not like them!

[YourHumbleNarrator]

The thing that always threw me off, in regard to myself, is that I've always had tons of energy. I can keep up with (and often outdo) the biggest extroverts. I even like the attention, but I don't like attention in general. I like attention when I want attention (clue #1). If I'm just not feeling it, being my socially hyperactive self isn't going to happen unless I have some time alone to rejuvenate. If my energy does re-ignite I've come to realize it's because I unconsciously draw from a much greater store than my conscious mind can currently access.

[galnxtdoor007]

the point i wud lik to raise is how are loners created??
i am a loner. throughout childhood i have seen a set of ppl who always want to show others down. why i dnt knw. maybe insecurities. i was often shown down. m stil studying and even now in my coll there are these ppl who just want to prove that they are superior to others. i do manage to find friends nd m generally loved as a friend. but yes, in many situations i find my self lonely. i feel loners are created coz they are not easily accepted. how much can u try and prove to be normal? they behave lik u have been dropped down by an UFO. m still struggling to fit in...
regards..

[blossom]

You can't be much of a loner if you find yourself feeling lonely! That pretty much goes against what a loner is about. A loner is someone, who by definition, likes being alone more than with people...so why would you feel lonely?

[IamAlsoThat]

Research on group work has shown that on average small groups are more successful for average intelligence people

However, extremely high intelligence people work faster and better alone than in a group.

[Karanime]

Yeah, I'm smarter than everyone I know IRL, and online, I've maybe met one or two who seem to be beyond my level.

It's much, much faster to finish an entire project on my own, rather than delegating work.

But, to say that we're more successful? I guess that does depend on how you define success. I guess we're more motivated to take on projects, since we're not out partying all the time. And we do get them done faster and better...

But as for life satisfaction, I'd say we're a little lower than most. In most of the studies about human interaction, people with active social lives are happier.

And I think that matters a little more than achievement. Then again, sufficiently intelligent people know that, so their achievement will be happiness.

Curious.

People are important. As I've said before, smarter people can't mingle with the crowd. They don't choose not to. They're unable to.

"It's not that lonely."
"Then you're not that smart."

/<3

[Mounds]

Hmmm... is it me or is there lots of misconceptions in this thread?

I never really paid any attention to whether or not successful people are loners or very social. I don't think that makes any difference. Even intelligence doesn't mean a whole lot. It's all about flexibility.

[Eric L]

Do loners have any considerable advantages over crowd followers?

Yes, all the time in the world to become what they want to become.

[180]

Pretty logical
Think about geniuses... complete weirdos

Success means adopting habits that other people are going to view weird. In one area of my life, I'm successful at analyzing and reading people. However, people fear me because of this. Sometimes I'll tell people what's going on. I know who feels awkward and why they feel awkward. The friend I'm talking to will notice my sherlock holmes-esque analysis of the situation and be completely freaked out. That friend will distance them self from me (wow for someone who's so good at reading people I do make stupid moves)

And I become a loner. Happens too often. I'm in Korea now and I don't speak nearly enough of the language. But I can almost always guess what's going on by the context or tonality of voices. And when I almost answer the question without being it translated it freaks them out a little bit.

Another thing is successful people like to be loners because People get in the way of success. Most people are negative and like to bring other people down. Successful people don't like to hear things like "Oh that idea would never be successful" or "that idea is terrible". So they would be loners to distance themselves from negativity