What does it mean to earn something?

[AlwaysLearning]

Wow, what a fascinating thread!

One of the things they point out at Anxiety Culture is that we work because we feel we "should" do it, to "earn" our right to live in the world or whatever; but no matter how much work we manage to do, noone ever comes up and says "Ok, good job, you have now worked enough".

Because of technological advances, we accomplish a lot more per hour than our ancestors. So if earning is really just a zero-sum game to get food on the table, logically we should need to do a lot less work than ever before. Instead, a lot of us are working harder than feudal serfs!

It's interesting that hundreds of years ago, casual reading was much harder to accomplish, you had to "earn" it. By those standards, anyone on the forums who isn't a monk working in Steve Pavlina's monastery, is a filthy hippy freeloader

[Plays With Life]

Originally Posted by AlwaysLearning

Wow, what a fascinating thread!

One of the things they point out at Anxiety Culture is that we work because we feel we "should" do it, to "earn" our right to live in the world or whatever; but no matter how much work we manage to do, noone ever comes up and says "Ok, good job, you have now worked enough".

Because of technological advances, we accomplish a lot more per hour than our ancestors. So if earning is really just a zero-sum game to get food on the table, logically we should need to do a lot less work than ever before. Instead, a lot of us are working harder than feudal serfs!

It's interesting that hundreds of years ago, casual reading was much harder to accomplish, you had to "earn" it. By those standards, anyone on the forums who isn't a monk working in Steve Pavlina's monastery, is a filthy hippy freeloader

LOL ! Thanks for that last comment. And also for the link - interesting site!

[Parthon]

Woo, *throws in 2c*.

For me, I see it as scarcity vs abundance mind set. "Earns" and "Deserves" are both words that live in the realm of scarcity. Before you can "have" something, you need to "earn" it, which means giving an equal value of effort or goods in exchange for what you are earning. "Deserve" is the flip side, the sense of entitlement that comes from thinking you should have something because of who you are or what you have done. All of this is purely rooted in the idea that there is not enough to go around, so you need to have stuff, particulary money. More money is better than less money. More stuff is better than less stuff. It also extends to comparing your contribution to others, and also comparing your stuff to others, just to make sure it's "fair". This just means you think that the value you've gotten from your effort equals theirs.

Strangely enough, the scarcity runs the world at the moment, and you end up with people like Dreamline who can't detach contribution from reward. No this is not an attack, Dreamline stated quite clearly that anyone who doesn't understand what "earn" is, is seen as a piece of scum. The idea of "earning" value by using effort is totally scarcity mindset.

On the flipside you have abundance. You don't put in effort, you create value. It's not about time or money, but how much you can help others and express yourself. You contribute, not because you expect compensation, but because it's the natural expression of who you are. You don't "own" things anymore, but have a collection of tools that allow you to better express your true self, and allow you to give more value to more people. You don't crave money, and it's not the focus, it's another tool, just like the stuff society says you own.

Now, taking something without providing value would quickly lead to the breakdown of society, but that's what scarcity is about. Getting more value than you put in and hoarding, because there's not enough to go around. That's how you end up with thieves and beggars. In the abundance mindset, earning doesn't make sense, because there's no entitlement, and no deserving attitude. You just give because it seems right. You ask for others to give in return, because it seems right. It becomes "Help me, help everyone." You give more than you get, and then you give some more. Then you find that you receive even more than you get, and you capacity to give expands even more.

I think that's where you are at PWL, because "earn" and "deserve" don't make sense when you feel that everything that anyone could want is just available. You also lose the sense that things need to be owned, that people need to work for others, and in the end freedom is really what matters.

I feel the pinacle of abundance is knowing deep down that ownership isn't real. These things people think they own are just stuff around them, that society agrees, through language, that they are yours. But, they aren't you, they aren't a part of you, and were never yours. You are you, and they are them. It's a priviledge, not a right, to be able to aquire entities with which to live better. These aren't my things, but my friends, that live in my area and serve me. Like myself, they are here to contribute and provide value. And that's the purest way of living.

[Plays With Life]

Thanks for your really interesting post, Parthon. I found the ownership bit especially interesting, as I thought about ownership as I participated in this thread. If you earn something, and somebody gives you what you earned, presumably they own it because they earned it from someone else. And that person presumably owned it because they earned it from someone else, and so on. So how did the very first person earn it? And who from?

[Daffy Duck]

To me:

"Earning" is an interesting concept. To me, for someone to "earn" something means they attracted it to their life in an honest way. Well, actually, that might be how I describe the "deserve" concept. The "earning" implies that the person DID something, some kind of work, to get it.

If your father gives you a million dollars because he loves you, that's fine, you deserve it.

If you work 40 hours a week and you get paid $3,000, that's fine, you earned it.

If you sneak into someone's house, kill their cat, and take all of their jewelry... you did not earn or deserve it, because it was not in an honest "highest-good-for-everyone" kind of way. I would call you a thief.

It's also just something we agree upon. If I tell Angela I will give her some money for coaching me, and she follows through with her side, then she has "earned" money from me. She deserves it. If I don't give it to her, I dishonestly broke a contract. If I keep doing this with people, they won't trust me, and I'll "get what I deserve."

It is sort of a hard concept to explain, in a way, isn't it? I think we all have our own internal feelings and ideas of how it works, but to explain it with words is a bit difficult, at least for me. Hopefully I came through somewhat clear.

Originally Posted by Plays With Life

So how did the very first person earn it? And who from?

They simply created it. They were the original creator. I guess, if you keep boiling down, the "who from" answer is: The Universe. Energy. God.

[willnesbitt]

This is a very interesting thread. I've never really considered the meaning of concept of earning something let alone challenge it.

Does the concept of "earning" something apply only to those who believe it is necessary?

Maybe it's not always necessary to "earn" what you receive. I mean, what did you do to "deserve" or "earn" the air that you breathe or to receive the warmth of the suns rays? Did you "earn" the right for your mother to give birth to you? Do we really "earn" the what the Universe gives us? Or are we only recycling what is already there (from unmanifest to manifest and back to unmanifest)? Are we even "required" to earn what we manifest? Maybe this is something we've placed on ourselves as a way to feel better or more "deserving" or appreciative of what we have and/or receive.

Just thinking my way through this.

[Parthon]

Originally Posted by Plays With Life

Thanks for your really interesting post, Parthon. I found the ownership bit especially interesting, as I thought about ownership as I participated in this thread. If you earn something, and somebody gives you what you earned, presumably they own it because they earned it from someone else. And that person presumably owned it because they earned it from someone else, and so on. So how did the very first person earn it? And who from?

Well, first a person claimed something as theirs, most commonly land and resources. Then they use effort or tools to turn it into something worthwhile, or sell it onto others to do the same with. Everything is either people turning something into something else with earth's resources.

The very first person said "This is mine, and I'll sell it to you."

And that's how the realm of scarcity started.

Originally Posted by willnesbitt

This is a very interesting thread. I've never really considered the meaning of concept of earning something let alone challenge it.

Does the concept of "earning" something apply only to those who believe it is necessary?

Maybe it's not always necessary to "earn" what you receive. I mean, what did you do to "deserve" or "earn" the air that you breathe or to receive the warmth of the suns rays? Did you "earn" the right for your mother to give birth to you? Do we really "earn" the what the Universe gives us? Or are we only recycling what is already there (from unmanifest to manifest and back to unmanifest)? Are we even "required" to earn what we manifest? Maybe this is something we've placed on ourselves as a way to feel better or more "deserving" or appreciative of what we have and/or receive.

Just thinking my way through this.

Earning something indeed does only belong to those that believe it's necessary. If you interact with them, you have to use their language, and "earning" is a part of it. Society is the best example of it.

The simple truth is that there is nothing owned, nothing earnt, nothing deserved. There's only the universe and everything in it. Energy gets changed into other forms of energy and life continues living. That's it. Everything else on top is just labels. "Earning" and "Deserving" are justifications for a person's participation in the dance of the universe. In reality, it's just energy flow, but people feel they have to justify their actions within their own belief system. We are taught our beliefs as we grow, and that results in the world we find ourselves in.

Our society and things like money, ownership, jobs and similar are just social constructs laid over the top of the fundamental system of the universe. It's not real, not like form and matter. It's ephemeral and contained in language and agreement. We agree with each other to pretend that things are a certain way, then we label what we experience and agree on the labels between each other. From there we can cooperatively control the universe a little more. It works, but it's still not real.

So when you see this you end up with a choice. Buy into the system and continue supporting it, or find new ways of using it to your advantage. The earning/deserving/owning loop can be broken, if you are willing to find alternatives. After all, it's all just energy anyways.

[Chap]

Originally Posted by Plays With Life

Serious question. I never look at a person who possesses something, and wonder whether they earned it. I never look at the things I possess, or the experiences I have, and wonder whether I earned them. I honestly don't know what people mean when they use the word "earn".

If you have a perspective, please share away.

This came up in a conversation I had (online) with a girl, one time. Somehow we got to "a person has to earn the things they have". And I told her I don't know what "earn" means, and asked if she could please explain it. Rapidly she accused me ingratiatingly (sarcasm) of having a sense of entitlement, told me outright she found me disgusting, and said she could no longer continue the conversation as it made her physically ill. I ended up a little befuddled, and still not knowing what "earn" means.

I also don't know what the related words "deserve" and "fair" mean, so if you have a perspective on 'em please share it also.

Well the concept of earning what you have can be normally easily summarised as being self-made, i.e. no freebies and perks due to nepotism. It can also mean, something you have laboured for therefore now posses.

What it does not take consideration of it the prevailing sense of relativity. Since we are by definition more privileged, do we really earn what we have or is that yet another perk Consider that a person from the upper echelons of society (born and raised) goes to university gets a good job and then buys a BMW, has he really earned that, was his salary and job really worth what they were and does he deserve anything, especially when contrasted to somebody else in the country from the lower echelons of society, and low prospects, and a 'dead-end' job. If they save up for that same car, did they earn that, especially when contrasted to poorer people in less prosperous circumstances.

The trick is to make the most of your opportunities, do good, and do not intentionally work to the detriment of others. This lady sounds as if she never considered the situation properly, although hopefully you have.

[Cheshire Cat]

It seems as though there are different degrees of earning something relative to the amount of effort put into it. I'm not sure if it's fair to say that someone earned something more than someone else because they had to work harder for it, but I know I would greatly admire and respect more the ones who give it their all regardless.

Also, do we tend to appreciate and value those things more when it's hard-earned and take it for granted more if it's freely given? Like love, for example...?

[joelyle]

boy 1: "who gave you that black-eye?"
boy 2: "no one gave it to me; I had to fight for it.

that's earning something