Stuck Between Two Paths, Don't Know Where to Go

[pianoperformer]

I've posted so many threads like this, so hopefully people don't tire of it, lol.

I'm kind of depressed right now. I've been searching for at least two years to figure out what I want to do with my life, and I just don't know.

I have two major interests, and i find that if I try to cut out either one of them, I become unhappy. Those interests are music and programming. If i cut out music, I feel empty and disconnected. If I cut out programming, I feel like my mind isn't doing enough and I just need a challenge and solve some problems.

The last two years has been a pendulum. I do one, and cut out the other. I do the second thing, and cut out the first. Then I become unhappy and wonder why I ever left the thing I cut out.

It finally got to me last semester, when I got physically sick several times, and then had to take a few weeks out of classes because of it. Then it got to be overwhelming and I had to withdraw. I was panicking because I couldn't take it anymore.

So I withdrew and applied to a university closer to home. The one i was at was too expensive, anyway. It was a struggle every semester to pay down the tuition.

Now I've had a little over a month off, and have returned to the piano. I very fortunately just got a free piano that is in decent condition, so have started practicing again.

And now I feel that familiar longing again, for the piano. I will be majoring in computer science at the place I'm transferring to, which i am looking forward to kind of, but nwo I'm feeling this pulling again for piano.

I guess most people would say just to find a piano teacher, and I have done that. But unfortunately it's not that simple. My piano teacher at school said I am far tooa dvanced just to choose any teacher, or even most teachers. She was an excellent piano teacher; probably the best I have ever had before. She really pushed me further than ever, and I progressed so much in the year that I took lessons from her. She knew and I know that I have a lot more potential, and I'm just afraid of never reaching that.

When I think of it as a matter of practicability, I know that programming is the better choice, and I can do piano on the side. But still I can't get rid of that nagging feeling that I won't be able to fulfill my potential and possibly even be somewhat successful with piano. I know I have a lot further to go, but I don't know how to get there. I need someone to help me with interpretation and technique. The teacher I have now at home teaches dozens of other students, usually school-age, who really don't take it very seriously. She's a great person but just can't take me where I need to go.

I would be happy if I could somehow have the best of both worlds. But I don't know how I can, and i'm afraid of just letting one of them go to waste. I'm very advanced at the piano, and I feel decently advanced at programming as well. Both come very naturally to me, and I love both.

I don't know who to talk to about it, which is why I'm posting here. I don't want my mom to think I'm changing my mind again, and anyway she's not very good at giving advice.

Two years ago almost exactly, I was making a similar decision: whether I should go into music or computer science. The fact that I'm still dealing with this today really irks me.

If you look at my history of study, you can see the pendulum go back and forth. Computer science, music, physics, music, and now probably back into computer science. It's obvious that I can't just study one side of this and let the other go. So what do I do?

To make things worse, this university I'm transferring to really doesn't have a good music department. They say that those studying music would have to move to the main campus to complete it. I guess that might not be too bad, but the main campus is rather large, larger than the first university I attended.

Anyway, sorry that this is so long. I just need to vent, and hopefully get some advice.

[Erin Pavlina]

Maybe you could keep studying piano while also majoring in computer science. Keep pursuing a career as a musician while having computer science to fall back on. I say don't cut either. Keep them both in your life. Keep working at both. There may be times in your life when you will earn a living as a musican and other times when you will program to pay the bills.

Or find a way to program something that would benefit a musician and combine your two loves.

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

Maybe you could keep studying piano while also majoring in computer science. Keep pursuing a career as a musician while having computer science to fall back on. I say don't cut either. Keep them both in your life. Keep working at both. There may be times in your life when you will earn a living as a musican and other times when you will program to pay the bills.

Or find a way to program something that would benefit a musician and combine your two loves.

Thanks a lot, Erin.

I'm not sure the best way to do that though. Are you talking about a double major, perhaps?

I know I can't afford to go back to Duquesne, unfortunately. Before I left, my piano teacher had asked the music school if they would give me a grant, but I never knew how that came out. But either way, when I was a music major, I didn't have much time for programming.

The only thing I can think of is pursue a computer science major as well as some music classes at the university I'm transferring to, and then go to the main campus (the one I will be at is a branch), to complete the music major. I don't know though; that'd probably take me 4-5 years, to complete the requirements of both. I'm not sure how the music program at Pitt is, though it might not be that bad, and it's a state school so it can't be that expensive, either. It might not take as long if I take more credits, but I don't want to burn out, either.

So that might be a possibility, but I don't know. Is that what you had in mind, or were you speaking more generally?

That's in fact the solution that came to mind after I posted, but I guess I'm nervous about taking too long to graduate.

I kind of like it though because it'd allow me to stay very close to home for a couple of years, and then go back out to Pitt, which is about 90 miles away, when I need to, which by which time i should hopefully be ready to go away from home again. Right now i'm still kind of healing from all the stress I went through over the past six months.

[nhaasch]

To make things worse, this university I'm transferring to really doesn't have a good music department. They say that those studying music would have to move to the main campus to complete it. I guess that might not be too bad, but the main campus is rather large, larger than the first university I attended.

You've already figured this out. You clearly want to do both music and computer science. You can pursue both by moving to the main campus in which you only have a minor objection to doing.

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by nhaasch

You've already figured this out. You clearly want to do both music and computer science. You can pursue both by moving to the main campus in which you only have a minor objection to doing.

Well, it's not that easy. I'm not so sure I can transfer to the main Pitt campus next semester, and I'm not sure that I'm ready. I think I might need at least a year closer to home. The Johnstown branch of Pitt is only a few minutes away, which is very appealing.

The web site says I could take so many credits of music here, and then go up to the other campus to complete the degree. I might be happy with that solution. I just called the head of the music department, and am waiting for him to call back, so we'll see how that goes.

I honestly didn't have it figured out. I didn't think of double majoring because of the complexity and work involved in both majors, and the amount my time in college would be extended because of all of the required classes. But, it does seem the best option, if they have good piano teachers, which I'm going to try to check out.

[cylon]

I've been struggling with this myself for years, I went to study graphic design but I was a musician writing and recording my own songs.

Cut to ten years later-it was a constant tug of war. To excel at design I had to put in the time to improve my craft. And I also really enjoyed it as well, it was very creatively fulfilling. But then there was the music thing.

The way I have experienced this is I stayed in my job as a designer and recorded my songs on the side. Which isn't what I wanted to do, I wanted to spend all my time on music.

Now, I am laid off and again faced with this decision of "What to do with the rest of my life" already having experienced 10 years of what it's like to be a professional in something you truly enjoy, but not putting all your focus on what you truly LOVE.

So. Here's where I stand now. We make these dilemmas bigger than what they are. The actual process of writing and recording a song (even with all the technical stuff as I am a computer-based musician, writing electronic dance music) does not take that long. What takes long is the constant weighing of the pros and cons in my mind of what I should be focusing on.

The practical side says "You need a job, work on updating your design skills to stay competitive in the marketplace." The passion side says "You are a talented composer and if you put the energy into it, it will support you."

If I actually spent less time thinking about whatever sacrifices I may have to make, and worrying about it, I would be further along in BOTH music AND design.

Don't allow yourself to get caught up in these dilemmas that appear to be more significant than they are. Start where you are now. You probably have the potential to be equally successful with both, you just have to move in a direction where you are "doing" more than thinking and spinning your wheels. Move past the resistance and let the momentum carry you forward.

Now for me to do what I just wrote!

[pianoperformer]

Cylon,

Thanks a lot. But if you love both, how can you only focus on one? Or are you saying you should have time for both? I guess that's what I will try to do, hopefully.

[cylon]

I'm saying it's not the dilemma you're making it out to be. Right now without knowing you're assuming that you know where the path is going to lead, when you don't. Hell you may do something in programming that sets up events in your musical life. You can't predict everything.

The problem is worrying about what will happen. That worry slows people down and all of the sudden you aren't doing EITHER thing you love because of all the indecision. I'm not gonna lie I'm experiencing the same thing. Being laid off gives me a great opportunity to learn some hard core web design... or learn some hardcore music production techniques.

But the time I actually spend on both of those, compared to the time I've spend THINKING about which one to do, is much greater.

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by cylon

I'm saying it's not the dilemma you're making it out to be. Right now without knowing you're assuming that you know where the path is going to lead, when you don't. Hell you may do something in programming that sets up events in your musical life. You can't predict everything.

The problem is worrying about what will happen. That worry slows people down and all of the sudden you aren't doing EITHER thing you love because of all the indecision. I'm not gonna lie I'm experiencing the same thing. Being laid off gives me a great opportunity to learn some hard core web design... or learn some hardcore music production techniques.

But the time I actually spend on both of those, compared to the time I've spend THINKING about which one to do, is much greater.

I don't think it's so simple, though. I mean I have to choose something. If I don't do something with music, and just find an average teacher, well I fear not reaching my potential. Like I said, I'm already very advanced at the piano, but I know I have a lot further I could go.

So I have to choose something, because whatever I do it'll affect my future significantly. I could choose computer science, and then not really progress as much in music, but I'm not really happy with that. I could choose music and not be as secure financially, and might be bored because I'm not engaging my analytical side, so that'll also impact me negatively. I can't just choose something and run with it.

For someone that's average at both, it doesn't really matter as much. But I really want to get all I can out of my musical / creative side, because I know there's a lot more there.

Edit: I wanted to add, the last two years were basically me choosing something and running with it. It was me not really thinking of what's best for me. It was that pendulum going back an dforth; analytical-creative, analytical-creative. I really need to do something now that satisfies both sides, because I've already been back and forth twice now.

[Erin Pavlina]

Do you actually need a degree in music or can you just be a musician who works on his craft and gets better over time? Couldn't you work as a professional musician without a degree? I mean, aren't people just wanting to hire talented individuals?

maybe get the degree in computer science if that is what's required to get a job programming. Otherwise, maybe dump school entirely, teach yourself at your own rate, and start working in one of your fields.

My personaly feeling on college is that you only need it if the job you want requires a degree. Otherwise, if you only need the knowledge but not the piece of paper (diploma) then you can learn much faster on your own.

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

Do you actually need a degree in music or can you just be a musician who works on his craft and gets better over time? Couldn't you work as a professional musician without a degree? I mean, aren't people just wanting to hire talented individuals?

maybe get the degree in computer science if that is what's required to get a job programming. Otherwise, maybe dump school entirely, teach yourself at your own rate, and start working in one of your fields.

My personaly feeling on college is that you only need it if the job you want requires a degree. Otherwise, if you only need the knowledge but not the piece of paper (diploma) then you can learn much faster on your own.

Hi,

I'll point this out, and I really don't mean to brag but, this is the truth and my piano teacher at college has expressed the same thing to me.

As a pianist, I still need a piano teacher. However, my piano teacher at college expressed to me that I am at such an advanced level, that I can't just choose any independent piano teacher, because they wouldn't be able to help me progress nearly as much as say a piano teacher at a university, such as the one I had at Duquesne. I can see huge differences between the piano teacher I have here at home, who is an independent piano teacher, and the one I had at Duquesne. The one at college was far better than the one I have now. I progressed in leaps and bounds there.

On the other hand, most independent teachers are teaching primarily school-age students or beginning adults, and really don't have the expertise to teach a college-level or beyond student who's been playing for a long time.

So that's the first concern. If I don't major in music, it would be much harder to find a good enough piano teacher, especially without paying exorbitant fees.

Secondly, since I progressed so quickly when I was younger, I was never really taught theory. I got some of the basics myself so I could pass the audition at Duquesne, but that's about it. I really feel like if I really want to be a musician, I should have the theory as well. I think it'd really help me to be better still, and be able to analyze the pieces I learn to play them better.

So yeah, I could just go out now and try to be a professional pianist, but I know I have a lot more progress to make, and want to find the right teacher to help me make that progress, and want to be in the proper environment to do so, too.

If anything, I think the degree is needed less so in programming, because that is something I can pretty much completely teach myself, and have been doing so for several years now. However, I may as well get the degree there, too, because the types of jobs I would be interested in for programming would definitely look much more favorably on a degree.

However in piano, it takes a lot longer to try to figure out things yourself, than if you are with a very good piano teacher. You can even injure yourself trying to do it independently, because technique is very important in more difficult pieces.

[Erin Pavlina]

Okay that all makes sense.

Let me ask you this. Let's say it's 10 years in the future and you're looking back to the decision you're making today. Which will your 10 year future self wish you had done?

if you could snap your fingers and it's 10 years in the future and you already completed one of these programs and selected one primary path, which one did you choose? Which one would excite you more?

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by Erin Pavlina

Okay that all makes sense.

Let me ask you this. Let's say it's 10 years in the future and you're looking back to the decision you're making today. Which will your 10 year future self wish you had done?

if you could snap your fingers and it's 10 years in the future and you already completed one of these programs and selected one primary path, which one did you choose? Which one would excite you more?

I took a while to reply because I really had to think about this.

It's really hard to say. Here are the two things i could see myself doing:

The most exciting would be being a concert pianist, or playing with an orchestra. I love performing, so that'd be great.

The second thing is something with programming. I am getting increasingly interested in the defense industry, because the projects seem much more interesting, and they seem to actually make a difference.

The important thing to me is that whatever I do actually makes a difference. I don't want to just serve to make money for some large company. I want to look back and know I left the world a little better, somehow, whether that was by inspiring people with music, or creating something useful with programming, or both. Both are very important to me, and inspire me.

Music is my connection with everything that is beautiful and divine. It is my connection with nature, but audible instead of visual, since I can't see. I love having that flow through me and expressed through the piano.

Programming is my connection to that which is structured and scientific. I mentioned before how much I enjoy the creativity too of coming up with the best quality application I can develop. But, i've realized lately that most web sites are very boring to develop, because there is mostly just the common data manipulation (create/read/update/delete). That gets really boring.

But I am sure there are applications that are more interesting. I especially like when I can implement mathematical ideas.

So, I could see myself doing concerts, and perhaps doing some programming on the side. Or programming part-time, I don't know. My concern with a full-time development job is that they typically have long hours. But I could see myself enjoying that as well, depending on the job.

[joelr]

Are you at a level where you would you be ready to take an orchestra seat after finishing music school?

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by joelr

Are you at a level where you would you be ready to take an orchestra seat after finishing music school?

I believe I would be, yes. I don't know whether I am right now, since I was still improving a lot before I left Duquesne. I had started my first piano concerto last year, a decently difficult one, and it was going very well. But I know that I have the potential to be able to improve that much.

Something my piano teacher told me last year really impacted me and motivated me to work harder. She told me that I was better than some of her grad students. That meant a lot since this music school was very intimidating to me, and that teacher was so tough that I thought I was actually doing very badly, since she would never compliment me.

So I know that with enough work, I could do a lot better even than I am doing now. That's why I really don't want to be content with where I am.

But yes, having a seat in an orchestra would be something I'd love, and would be quite ideal.

It's kind of hard to say. I'm very critical of myself. The only recordings I have right now are those on my blog, if someone would want to get more of an objective view.

Here's a practice session where I practice a Mendelssohn prelude and my Saint-Saëns piano concerto. The prelude starts around 00:55 in, and the concerto starts around 25:30 in (since I doubt you'd want to hear all 25 minutes of me practicing the prelude, lol). I don't play all the way through the concerto, but it should give an idea.

I was better at the concerto about two months ago, but I stepped away from it for about a month, and now I'm practicing to get back up to my previous level, and surpass it.

It's just really hard to talk about my own talent objectively, so I thought a recording would work better.

[pianoperformer]

Well, now I'm strongly considering returning to Duquesne and going back into the music school. I think that if I can work through the issues that limited me last semester, as caused by the overwhelming difficulty I had last fall, and remember to keep some time for myself to relax, I can do it.

My friend really put it to me well. He said I could do what I'm really passionate about, or just bury it all because I'm too scared and do what appears to be more practical.

I do love programming too, but I don't think I love it as much. I think that as long as I can keep some time for myself to keep up with my hobbies, such as programming and blogging, I will be happy. If I learned anything, it's that I need balance in life. Too much of one thing to the exclusion of all else, leads quickly to burnout.

The thought of returning has really improved my mood, but the question that worries me is whether I can do so. Two questions arise:

• Will they let me? I technically withdrew, though the medical withdrawal has not been approved yet, last I heard.
• Can I afford it? Assuming I can go back, I still have the problem we had for the last 4 semesters, that we have a horrible time trying to afford it. However, my piano teacher was trying to get the music school to get me a grant. That, combined with my mom and me trying to save over several months, might just make it, hopefully. I should begin to save this month, just in case.

I initiated a lot of personal growth out there, that wasn't nearly complete yet when I left. I just started to come out of my shell socially. It'd also be nice to get back to continue that progress.

I'm not at all certain it is right, but it feels a lot better than being content with where I am now and not being able to progress nearly as much in music. It's a lot harder to do self-study in music than it is in programming.

I'm going to start seeing a psychologist next month to try to work through these issues that I feel are blocking me, so I hope that will help.

[pianoperformer]

I just wanted to return to say that I am going back to the music school at Duquesne.

They were a little iffy, seeing as I've changed my mind a lot, and said they'd give me one more chance. That makes me nervous, but I know I really do want to stick with it. I just wonder how I can make this different than every other time, and I really don't know. Perhaps the psychologist will help with that.

Perhaps if I stick things out instead of wanting to change just because my interests have shifted a bit. Perhaps if I am not so tough on myself, and give myself some guilt-free time to relax. Perhaps if I set aside some time occasionally to program, to keep myself grounded.

I really don't know, but I know this time has to be different. I'm tired of spinning my wheels.

[Asmoday]

Piano, I'm sure you're well aware that you can devote yourself to both.

What you need is something to snap you out of the fog you've put yourself in, bring clarity and drive.

I know it seems weird, but it works for your long-term Hamlet syndrome:

Death and Finding Your Purpose

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by Asmoday

Piano, I'm sure you're well aware that you can devote yourself to both.

What you need is something to snap you out of the fog you've put yourself in, bring clarity and drive.

I know it seems weird, but it works for your long-term Hamlet syndrome:

Death and Finding Your Purpose

I can pursue both, but I don't think I can do so with the same intensity. I need to major in one, and study the other privately.

Right now, my prevailing thought is to study music as a major, since college-level instruction in music can teach me a lot more than the same in programming, and it is nearly impossible to do self-study to the same level in music.

Hopefully I can still have time for some programming on the side. It is something I really enjoy doing.

Thanks for the link, but unfortunately it is not loading.

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by Asmoday

Piano, I'm sure you're well aware that you can devote yourself to both.

What you need is something to snap you out of the fog you've put yourself in, bring clarity and drive.

I know it seems weird, but it works for your long-term Hamlet syndrome:

Death and Finding Your Purpose

Just wanted to say I came back to try the link again today, and it worked this time.

That was a great article. I have a lot to think about. Also, your entire web site looks great. I have a few tabs open of articles I want to read.

Thanks for the link.

[joelr]

Originally Posted by pianoperformer

I believe I would be, yes. I don't know whether I am right now, since I was still improving a lot before I left Duquesne. I had started my first piano concerto last year, a decently difficult one, and it was going very well. But I know that I have the potential to be able to improve that much.

Something my piano teacher told me last year really impacted me and motivated me to work harder. She told me that I was better than some of her grad students. That meant a lot since this music school was very intimidating to me, and that teacher was so tough that I thought I was actually doing very badly, since she would never compliment me.

So I know that with enough work, I could do a lot better even than I am doing now. That's why I really don't want to be content with where I am.

But yes, having a seat in an orchestra would be something I'd love, and would be quite ideal.

It's kind of hard to say. I'm very critical of myself. The only recordings I have right now are those on my blog, if someone would want to get more of an objective view.

Here's a practice session where I practice a Mendelssohn prelude and my Saint-Saëns piano concerto. The prelude starts around 00:55 in, and the concerto starts around 25:30 in (since I doubt you'd want to hear all 25 minutes of me practicing the prelude, lol). I don't play all the way through the concerto, but it should give an idea.

I was better at the concerto about two months ago, but I stepped away from it for about a month, and now I'm practicing to get back up to my previous level, and surpass it.

It's just really hard to talk about my own talent objectively, so I thought a recording would work better.

Sounds great.
I'd say go to music school. You're ready for a orchestra gig and school will provide you with lots of connections. The people who make out best at music schools are those who are ready to take any jobs right away. If you are at the top of the class and you do lots of networking you'll be in a good spot.

[pianoperformer]

Originally Posted by joelr

Sounds great.
I'd say go to music school. You're ready for a orchestra gig and school will provide you with lots of connections. The people who make out best at music schools are those who are ready to take any jobs right away. If you are at the top of the class and you do lots of networking you'll be in a good spot.

Hey thanks! That means a lot to me that you say that so matter-of-factly.

Anyway, yeah that's why I'm really trying to win this competition. I feel like it'd be excellent for getting my name out there.

Also thinking of setting up a web site with all of my music once I have some more pieces performance-ready.

I'm also trying to figure out a better way of learning music. The method I use now works, but is a little slow, only because I can only meet someone at most a few times per week to teach me the notes. I'm confident I can figure something out though.