Where did women go???

[madgeylou]

Originally Posted by seeker5

So, this begs the question, how would a skyscraper built by a woman look like?

maybe if women were in charge, we wouldn't have them, or maybe they'd be more freewheeling structures that support other smaller structures (like the forest supports the ewok village) so that a building would be more of a community rather than a monolith ...

... or maybe we'd dig a big hole into the earth and live there instead.

[Elrond]

^ So how would Manhatten look then ?

[Playlife]

Originally Posted by Elrond

^ So how would Manhatten look then ?

I personally would like Manhattan to be a big green hill. Like this:

[rjani]

I found this accidentally while surfing, an other field where women are missing:
Patent Law Blog (Patently-O): Women as Patentees

[ar81]

Originally Posted by rjani

I mean, personal development should be just as important for women as for man, right?
And it seems to me that even in the forum men dominate in number, is that correct?

Education: Machines for boys, dolls for women.
It still has a strong cultural influence and it is excluding women from the world of technology even in developed countries. I was talking to a principal these days who works in New York and he agreed with me. It seems it is not a country specific phenomena.

[Zwynd]

Originally Posted by rjani

And it seems to me that even in the forum men dominate in number, is that correct?

You assume the majority here are men.

Just because people say "tehr R no grlz on teh interntz" doesn't mean it's true; the ladies don't need to show off their boobs to prove they're around.

This reminds me of the gaming forums I frequent. I've seen people suddenly act crazy when they find out a girl is in their guild. Honestly, if I was a women there I would be hiding as well.

Why attract the attention of a dolt?^^

And really, who cares if it's Steve or 'Stacey' making these forums? The messages are here for all, right?

Edit: I should have probably read all of the other posts before I post mine to the OP. Here I'm at the bottom of the thread where the vagina mounds and pentagon topics/pictures are located. Not that I mind...

[rjani]

Originally Posted by ar81

Education: Machines for boys, dolls for women.
It still has a strong cultural influence and it is excluding women from the world of technology even in developed countries. I was talking to a principal these days who works in New York and he agreed with me. It seems it is not a country specific phenomena.

Well, I'm not sure about this. You may be right, I have no personal experience, but as I noticed, women just don't care about technology as much as men do. So if they're excluded in some other way, that's even worse, because it doesn't seem that millions of women want to work in such areas, and if men set them back, even those few have no chance to get in.

Originally Posted by Zwynd

You assume

Edit: I should have probably read all of the other posts before I post mine to the OP. Here I'm at the bottom of the thread where the vagina mounds and pentagon topics/pictures are located. Not that I mind...

Well, maybe
But np, just wanted to clarify it was only an observation, nothing else

[George Eliot]

As many people have already mentioned, the reasons for a lack of women icons (at least in the past) stem from historical and cultural influences.

You could ask the same question about minorities - where are all the African-American geniuses etc.? It seems most of the people society puts on a pedestal, at least officially, are old white males. This simply reflects the Old-World power structure that still impacts many aspects of life even today. Luckily, as more and more opportunities become available to more people in general (women, people from lower income brackets, minorities) things have much improved. It just takes time for a shift in cultural attitudes to reach into every aspect of society.

In the past, there were always a few women able to achieve success even when the odds were against them (Marie Curie is a good example). It's usually these "exceptions" in unusual times that hint at the fact that many more people with similar abilities exist - it's just that they are not discovered until the greater cultural and social structures of the world allow for them to be found, encouraged, nurtured, and educated.

For example, I'm sure there are countless children in Africa with the deep-rooted potential to become lawyers, doctors, scientists, writers, etc., but there's no way this can happen if they are starving, have poor access to education, and simply lack the basic infrastructure of decent living. A few modern-day Einsteins may have been born and died already in the world, and we would never even have known it.

It's also a question of recognition and acknowledgment. In the past, it was very common for the wife of someone in a position of power, for example, to contribute to her husband's decision-making process, come up with solutions to issues, and suggest her own ideas. Of course, this would all go on behind the scenes, so guess who gets all the credit and goes down in the history books?

Another example: Apparently it was quite common in the past for scientists to take credit for the work and discoveries of their female co-workers. I wish I could remember where I read this, but there were a couple of fairly famous male scientists who were later discovered to have taken full credit for a discovery a female scientist had made basically on her own. I wonder how many times this occurred over the years? (EDIT: Her name was Rosalind Franklin, and she would have gotten the Nobel prize for her work on the structure of DNA if not for the controversy. Instead, Crick and Watson - the two colleagues who basically stole her work - received the prestigious prize).

As Virginia Woolf so aptly put it: "For most of history, Anonymous was a woman." Women have made many great contributions over the years, not the least of which is taking care of the family and household, but it's just that no one talks about it.

Even today I feel people are quicker to think of famous men than famous women, unless we're talking about some ditsy star like Britney Spears...haha. But as I mentioned above, I don't think this happens as much as in the past, thankfully.

Once I even saw something on television about a woman who solved an extremely difficult math problem for a contest (on the back of a science magazine I think?) without the proper mathematical language or training to do so. Instead, she made up her own way of solving the problem and shocked the organizers of the contest when they received the winning solution from her. She said she had enjoyed math in high school but didn't pursue it, opting for marriage instead. Her math genius had been hiding all along and no one knew (including her) that she possessed it. This was quite recent as well. As far as tech and science careers go, I think many women still don't consider going into these areas, but I think this is starting to change as well.

And as Zwynd said, many women pretend to be men online. I do it all the time. Also, I'm into techie things but you'd probably never guess if you saw me. I kind of do it "secretly" in a manner of speaking. I don't think most people I know necessarily recognize this side of me, and I don't get involved in any official capacity, although I had the grades and talent to go into the tech industry if I wanted to.

[openyourize]

many skyscrapers are partially built by women.

[amandalynne]

I think there are plenty of women who are interested in personal development... there just aren't as many who've tried to make a career out of being a personal development leader.

[robc]

Originally Posted by rjani

Hi all,
I was just wondering why aren't or are so few women personal development speakers/writers. I mean, if I look around, Napoleon Hill, Steve Pavlina, Tony Robbins, Brian Tracy, Deepah ... , they are all men.
Why is it that way ? Is it related to the fact that women's are not so goal-oriented, or their problem-solving is different? I really don't know. I mean, personal development should be just as important for women as for man, right?
And it seems to me that even in the forum men dominate in number, is that correct?

Oh, and also if you would like a few words on why all the most Famous geniuses (Einstein, Mozart, Da Vinci,...) are all men.
Note: This post isnt intended against women at all. I respect and love them (hi mom!) very much, I'm simply just curious. And also please don't make 10000 posts like: " You're wrong, I'm woman and I'm here..."
thanks

Women don't brag as much as men do ;-)

Or maybe it's like that saying goes:
"... those who can do, those who can't... teach" ;-)

- yes I'm being a smart ass but it was worth it.

Tons of smart people out there: both men & women!

[magi13]

@Thread starter

Women even lesbians (No flames please) are not as aggressive as men in general. Women love to socialize and be one of the in crowd or conform. They do not rebel as much as men.

Women are adaptable no matter the situation, I guess they just get by without to much problems. Men on the other hand, most men love shortcuts. And lots of wise men take advantage of that and show ways or means or guides on how to. Men prefer logic and are more susceptible to PD. ^^, We learn, by taking advantage of the knowledge available.

PS. the title of this thread is deceptive. ^^, I first thought women in general were beginning to disappear.

[lifetimelearner]

Originally Posted by magi13

@Thread starter

PS. the title of this thread is deceptive. ^^, I first thought women in general were beginning to disappear.

that's funny

I thought it was going to be about how some us don't wear dresses all the time

[Cran]

I expected that too, lifetimelearner.

And I do wear dresses all the time, I like them better.

So I am a woman who:
- frequents this forum (albeit I do not post much)
- wears dresses and skirts all the time
- is polarized as a darkworker
Conclusion: This woman is obviously... strange.

I think the lack of "obvious" participation of women in self-development forums like comes about because I perceive this forum as very controversial in many areas, and a lot of, hm, how to call it, not really "bragging", but the attitude "I have to be/get better all the time in everything", and I think both factors could contribute.
Maybe most women do really approach self-development from a different angle.

[fellowtraveler]

Originally Posted by Cran

I think the lack of "obvious" participation of women in self-development forums like comes about because I perceive this forum as very controversial in many areas, and a lot of, hm, how to call it, not really "bragging", but the attitude "I have to be/get better all the time in everything", and I think both factors could contribute.
Maybe most women do really approach self-development from a different angle.

Yes indeed, we men have a much harder time taking an observer/learner standpoint. We probably also like to tinker more...we see an idea and say, "hmmm, that sounds OK, but I can make it better" without taking the time to really absorb it properly.

Then there's the destructive and non-productive need to be right all the time, lol. There are always some ridiculous examples in the "Spirituality" and Manifestation forums here. People arguing about spirituality and the nature of "reality". Really.

Must be nature and nurture. I guess you need to get some age on you before you step back and really look at what matters...either that or I'm a girlie-man...

[magi13]

Originally Posted by fellowtraveler

Yes indeed, we men have a much harder time taking an observer/learner standpoint. We probably also like to tinker more...we see an idea and say, "hmmm, that sounds OK, but I can make it better" without taking the time to really absorb it properly.

Then there's the destructive and non-productive need to be right all the time, lol. There are always some ridiculous examples in the "Spirituality" and Manifestation forums here. People arguing about spirituality and the nature of "reality". Really.

Must be nature and nurture. I guess you need to get some age on you before you step back and really look at what matters...either that or I'm a girlie-man...

It only means you have common sense. ^^, It's not common now a days.

[pyrogen]

Originally Posted by madgeylou

For instance, rock'n'roll -- male energy started it, and lots of male musicians (not all, but many) think that chicks simply don't rock the same way guys do.

And in some ways they are probably right. In broad strokes, chicks and dudes rock very differently. But that doesn't mean that chicks don't rock. We just rock differently.

Interesting stuff. It makes me think. People usually assume I am male when they meet me online. I'm a chick. In fact, I'm fiercely femme in real life.

But somehow I communicate online like a guy and think of things from a more typically "male" perspective, I'm told. I'm not even sure what makes my communication "guy like".

And I like "guy rock". Give me Disturbed, Ozzy and Korn.

[pyrogen]

Originally Posted by Cran

I expected that too, lifetimelearner.

And I do wear dresses all the time, I like them better.

So I am a woman who:
- is polarized as a darkworker

Me too, I think... nice to meet you. I'd love to talk about this stuff, but everywhere I go to talk about darkwork, it's all about the "power over others/exploiting others" angle which I think is kidstuff and comes out of scarcity model.

Wanna start a new thread about it so we can talk elsewhere w/o hijacking the forum?

[Cran]

Originally Posted by pyrogen

Wanna start a new thread about it so we can talk elsewhere w/o hijacking the forum?

I think it rather useless, because each and every thread will, imo, take the same direction. Currently, I am satisfied with darkowrking all day long and only seldomly discussing it.

Unfortunately, my eyes haven't turned red so far, seems I am not EVIL enough. Perhaps because I am a woman?

But that's really a hijack now, I'll shut up.

[geekchic9]

I think I recently read on Steve's blog that his readership was about 65% male. Any clue how he determined that?

I have a hypothesis that most people here favor the MBTI's Thinking preference. In other words, the majority of us generally prefer logic over personal values in making decisions. Statistically, 60% of men have that preference, while only 40% of women do. That may partially explain Steve's above statistic.

For the record, I am an INTJ female. We're very rare, but we exist.

[pyrogen]

Originally Posted by geekchic9

For the record, I am an INTJ female. We're very rare, but we exist.

ENTP female here. Nice to meet you!

[lifetimelearner]

Originally Posted by magi13

@Thread starter

Women even lesbians (No flames please) are not as aggressive as men in general. Women love to socialize and be one of the in crowd or conform. They do not rebel as much as men.

maybe not aggressive

and no I HATE socializing
it's kind of like going to the dentist for a root canal

AND

some of us do rebel

but maybe like me they do not know how to focus that drive into an outlet

[geekchic9]

Originally Posted by pyrogen

ENTP female here. Nice to meet you!

Awesome. It's nice to meet another NT, especially another NT female.

[footprints]

This may be a sweeping generalisation from me, but in my experience the men who are in personal development tend to go in the direction of speaking and leading, whereas the women (for example Christine Kane) are more likely to do group work or organinse retreats.

I don't think it's anything to do with "aggression" or "conforming", more to do with women's naturally more emotional, empathic way of interacting. And Magi13: your point "even lesbians" statement riled me, lesbians are just women who happen to find women attractive. Some are aggressive, some not, just like straight women.

For the record, I'm an INFP female who hates to wear dresses and loves to rebel