Personality and astrology

[Adelina]

Is there any relationship between the Meyers Briggs type indicator, and other personality inventory, and the zodiac?

There should be..

==
UPDATED:

here's what I see based on the zodiac descriptions:

aries: FIRE: CARDINAL: + E - S – T - J

taurus: EARTH: FIXED: – I – S – F - J

gemini: AIR: MUTABLE: + E – N – T - P

cancer: WATER: CARDINAL: – I – N – F - P

leo: FIRE: FIXED: + E – S – T - J

virgo: EARTH: MUTABLE: – I – S – F - J

libra: AIR: CARDINAL: + E – N – T - P

scorpio: WATER: FIXED: – I - N - F - P

saggitarius: FIRE: MUTABLE: + E – S – T - J

capricorn: EARTH: CARDINAL: – I - S – F - J

aquarius: AIR: FIXED: + E – N – T - P

pices: WATER: MUTABLE: - I- N –F - P


==

cool! mine fits!!

this makes sense.

anyone else see a relationship between their MTBI and zodiac sign?

Based on-
the fire and air signs are described as "positive" and outgoing- Extrovert
and water and earth as "negative" or more introverted- Introvert

fire and earth are generally logical and concrete- Sensing
air and water are generally intuitive- iNtuitive

fire and earth are generally- Thinking
air and water- Feeling

fire and earth- Judge
air and water- Perceive


Based on the descriptions. Though some of the MBTIs are not in this matrix. Perhaps it works on some level..

[Holistic Star]

Why should there be?


Isn't astrology a load of bunk?
although I would say that - I'm an Aquarius



<sorry the old ones are the best>


no seriously - why should there be a correlation?

[PerDev]

Originally Posted by Adelina

Is there any relationship between the Meyers Briggs type indicator, and other personality inventory, and the zodiac?

There should be..

I think Astrology is basically more about future prediction and personality is who you are

[PianoManGidley]

The Zodiac is crap. There are far more than just 12 personality types in the world.

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Adelina

Is there any relationship between the Meyers Briggs type indicator, and other personality inventory, and the zodiac?

There should be..

The MBTI is based on Carl Jung types of personality or so. And Carl Jung believed in astrology somehow, I don't how exactly. So yes, there should be.

[Fullcrum]

I have found astrology is quite accurate.

In fact, you guys have no clue what astrology really is.

Astrology is a synergy of the parts of an entire chart. For example, in the natal, one would examine such things as the temperament of the person, the ascendant sign, what house and position everything is in, whether it's day or night, aspects of planets, whether they are exulted, etc. When one can do a true and adept analysis of a chart, you'll find it eerily accurate to a personality.

I think there is probably a relationship, but no one has discovered it yet. It would likely be difficult to find a "pattern" that equates to MBTI types (I'm well versed in both MBTI and astrology), as there are so many variables. I think it quite possible, however, to predict MBTI type with amazing accuracy once a chart has been analyzed.

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by Adelina

Is there any relationship between the Meyers Briggs type indicator, and other personality inventory, and the zodiac?

There should be..

==
UPDATED:

here's what I see based on the zodiac descriptions:

aries: FIRE: CARDINAL: + E - S – T - J

taurus: EARTH: FIXED: – I – S – F - J

gemini: AIR: MUTABLE: + E – N – T - P

cancer: WATER: CARDINAL: – I – N – F - P

leo: FIRE: FIXED: + E – S – T - J

virgo: EARTH: MUTABLE: – I – S – F - J

libra: AIR: CARDINAL: + E – N – T - P

scorpio: WATER: FIXED: – I - N - F - P

saggitarius: FIRE: MUTABLE: + E – S – T - J

capricorn: EARTH: CARDINAL: – I - S – F - J

aquarius: AIR: FIXED: + E – N – T - P

pices: WATER: MUTABLE: - I- N –F - P


==

cool! mine fits!!

this makes sense.

anyone else see a relationship between their MTBI and zodiac sign?

Like the post above says, astrology it's much more that a sign, that's just a big simplification of it all. Ok, I was born in a September 22nd. That's Virgo-Libra they say, with qualities of both. In tests I'm ENFP or INFP, depending on the test (The Performer or the Composer ). But I'm no way at all a ISFJ, at least at present.

According to all this, composers should be Cancer... and that doesn't happen, it's more complicated.

[PianoManGidley]

Originally Posted by songwriter

Like the post above says, astrology it's much more that a sign, that's just a big simplification of it all. Ok, I was born in a September 22nd. That's Virgo-Libra they say, with qualities of both. In tests I'm ENFP or INFP, depending on the test (The Performer or the Composer ). But I'm no way at all a ISFJ, at least at present.

According to all this, composers should be Cancer... and that doesn't happen, it's more complicated.

Heh...I'm a composer, and I'm a Leo. BTW, you share a birthday with Frodo and Bilbo Baggins!

[Fullcrum]

HAhaha. Where's my type? Where's INTJ? Where's ENTJ? Where are the *S*P types? C'mon, you're gonna leave out a whole temperament (looking at Keirsey's distinctions)? Sorry dude, the list isn't that simple. I think its pointless to categorize so simply, even though we all WANT to and I would really love to see such a simple and complete list saying "This is how it is", but it's really not that simple and just spreading falsehoods. I mean, if you want to look at Keirsey's stuff, fire is the artisan (*S*P) temperament, air is the rational (*NT*) temperament, water is the idealist (*NF*) temperament, and earth is the guardian (*S*J) temperament. But the list won't be so easily divided into birthdays.

It's chart by chart. Any distinctions that can be drawn from there, I dunno. But suffice to say, it should fit into sixteen general categories that have somewhat interchangeable traits. That, or evidence of eight distinct physhological functions. To do this, we'd need to look at charts and try to find a way to split it into eight or sixteen ways. And I haven't found one yet.

[Holistic Star]

well based on my survey of 1

I am an Aquarius and ENFP

= no correlation.

[Fullcrum]

I'll try and do an analysis on myself sometime and show you how it works. I don't possess all the knowledge, but I think what I can offer is more accurate than a more simple method.

[Pegasus]

I am a Taurus and an INFP. According to your chart, I should be an ISFJ. I was born 6 weeks early, so should have been a Gemini.

[lifeforce]

Astrology is seen as pretty hoo-ha by most of the non-female population. Though in that perspective, religion and spirituality would be pretty out there too.

To get a taste of how advanced astrology can get -> Free Personalized SuperPower Report

It is empowering for alot of people. So let it be that way

About the myers briggs - for some reason, I tend to be just at the limit between ENFJ and ESTP. Only thing I know for certant is that I have an E.

[pianoperformer]

Yeah I think people are misunderstanding it; it's much more involved than just 12 signs. I don't know as much as Fullcrum seems to about it, but it does seem rather accurate if used correctly.

[Flugelblues]

I am a Scorpio - and an INTJ...which isn't even on your list.

[pianoperformer]

Oh, an I forgot to say what I am.

I'm Virgo, and INFJ.

[songwriter]

Originally Posted by PianoManGidley

Heh...I'm a composer, and I'm a Leo. BTW, you share a birthday with Frodo and Bilbo Baggins!

One ring to rule them all...

[Mark Lapierre]

Many studies have been done looking for a link between astrology and personality, including some very large scale studies. No significant links have been found.

And basically, if you do a lot of well designed studies involving a large number of people and you find nothing, it's not at all likely that there's anything there to find...

[Fullcrum]

Can you give some examples? I'd really like to learn from these studies.

[Mark Lapierre]

Here's a couple. There's more in the lists of references and citations in various research databases. You'll probably need a subscription to view these. I've copied the abstracts:

We investigated the relationship between date of birth and individual differences in personality and intelligence in two large samples. The first sample consisted of 4000+ middle-aged male subjects from the Vietnam Experience Study; personality was measured by the MMPI items converted to EPQ (scales) and a large battery of cognitive tests were factored to derive general intelligence, g. The second sample consisted of 11,000+ young adults from the National Longitudinal Study of Youth from 1979. g was extracted from the ten subtests of the Armed Services Vocational Aptitude Battery.

In no cases did date of birth relate to individual differences in personality or general intelligence.

A further goal was to test Eysenck’s notion of possible relationships between date of birth and the popular Sun Signs in astrology. No support could be found for such associations.

We conclude that the present large-scale study provides no evidence for the existence of relevant relationships between date of birth and individual differences in personality and general intelligence.

ScienceDirect - Personality and Individual Differences : The relationship between date of birth and individual differences in personality and general intelligence: A large-scale study

In Fuzeau-Braesch [Astrologie: La Preuve par Deux (1992a) and Personality and Individual Differences 13, 1135–1144 (1992b)] the parents of 238 pairs of twins matched brief astrological descriptions with their twins' personalities and achieved 68.5% hits, very significantly better than the 50% expected by chance. The author concluded that astrology may be a “new element in differentiating personality within a pair of twins.” But we found reasons for doubt: her result is incompatible with previous findings, the disattenuated effect size is too high, the interval between births does not increase with increasing personality difference as required by her hypothesis, the astrological descriptions frequently differ from those prescribed by her supposedly objective rules, and the hit rate does not replicate. We then attempted to find an explanation for her results: we found evidence of artifacts in her reported data due to response set and stereotypes, and we found discrepancies between the reported data and the original data. Our re-analysis of the original data showed no significant deviation from chance. We conclude that an astrological explanation of Fuzeau-Braesch's results is unwarranted. The stereotype bias uncovered by us deserves to be added to the general list of human judgement biases.

ScienceDirect - Personality and Individual Differences : Are personality differences between twins predicted by astrology?

And here's one that investigated associations between personality and season of birth, looking at possible neurophysiological mechanisms:

Season of birth has earlier been found to be associated with adult suicidal behaviour and with adult turnover of monoamine neurotransmitters. A previous study on adults has also shown an association between season of birth and the personality scales of Cloninger's temperament and character inventory (TCI) in a general population. The temperament scale of novelty seeking, particularly among women, was significantly lower for those born during the period containing winter (October–January) in comparison with those born during the rest of the year. In a different study on adolescents, an opposite season-of-birth relation for novelty seeking was found among adolescents. In the present study, we explore the relationship between season of birth and personality assessed by the TCI, in an independent and non-overlapping cohort of 1145 subjects in the age range 10–102 years. The opposite association between novelty seeking and birth during the half-year containing winter (October–March) as above, is confirmed when comparing those aged upto 25 years to those aged above 25 years. Here, we also find that the temperament scale of harm avoidance among women is significantly associated with the month of birth, with its peak around September for those aged upto 25 years, and around December for those aged above 25 years. The monoamine neurotransmitters are known to be mutually correlated and show complex interactions with each other. It is likely that there is a developmental difference between persons born during different seasons as regards the dynamics of the turnover and interaction among the monoamine neurotransmitters in parallel to the development of the personality traits across the life-span.

ScienceDirect - Personality and Individual Differences : Variations in personality traits among adolescents and adults according to their season of birth in the general population: further evidence

That may account for some of the patterns people observed which they attributed to astrological influences.

[Fullcrum]

Interesting. I like the last one.

The other ones are bunk and limited in scope.

I'm not saying personality is related to sun signs. That's a very small portion. What I'm saying is that general tendencies can be found (source of motivation, fundamental desires, etc.) by examining and syntehsizing information from an entire natal chart, and maybe looking at fixed star parameters.

I'd be interested in looking at the charts of identical twins and seeing how the personality is differentiated. A difference of birth time of even ten minutes can have a profound change on personality.

[Mark Lapierre]

Originally Posted by Fullcrum

The other ones are bunk and limited in scope.

It would help if you read the papers, not just the abstract, before you make such unfounded statement. If you don't have access to the papers, don't make any claims related to their content.

Though frankly even the abstract of the first reflects the large scope of the study. And that's even if you don't know that the MMPI contains over 500 items used to evaluate personality and is one of the most (if not the most) comprehensive and valid measures of personality we have (though the MMPI-2 is better).

If your complaint is directed at the scope where astrology is concerned, the same complaint can be directed at just about every form of popular astrology which doesn't involve full natal charts.

Nor does your complaint address the statement made by the researchers when they acknowledged that

...the present study cannot falsify astrology at large since the position of planets other than the sun might also have an effect. However, as pointed out by Eysenck and Nias (1982, p. 31 and 49) if there is some truth to astrology then some general effects of prominent astrological factors like Sun Signs should be detectable using large enough samples. The present large-scale study certainly found no independent effects of Sun Signs, Elements, or gender, and thus yields no support for the common claims of astrology.

General tendencies were not found when accounting for what is claimed to be the major factor. The study provided evidence for its argument and so is not "bunk".

[hopena]

aries: FIRE: CARDINAL: + E - S – T - J

gemini: AIR: MUTABLE: + E – N – T - P

scorpio: WATER: FIXED: – I - N - F - P

It doesn't fit me and my Sun sign (Aries) - I tend to test right on the border of ENFP/INFP. My "top three" when it comes to the rest of my chart, are Aries, Gemini and Scorpio.

I think my Dad may have tested as an ISFJ, and he's a Taurus.

[PerDev]

Originally Posted by Adelina

Is there any relationship between the Meyers Briggs type indicator, and other personality inventory, and the zodiac?

There should be..

==
UPDATED:

here's what I see based on the zodiac descriptions:

aries: FIRE: CARDINAL: + E - S – T - J

taurus: EARTH: FIXED: – I – S – F - J

gemini: AIR: MUTABLE: + E – N – T - P

cancer: WATER: CARDINAL: – I – N – F - P

leo: FIRE: FIXED: + E – S – T - J

virgo: EARTH: MUTABLE: – I – S – F - J

libra: AIR: CARDINAL: + E – N – T - P

scorpio: WATER: FIXED: – I - N - F - P

saggitarius: FIRE: MUTABLE: + E – S – T - J

capricorn: EARTH: CARDINAL: – I - S – F - J

aquarius: AIR: FIXED: + E – N – T - P

pices: WATER: MUTABLE: - I- N –F - P


==

cool! mine fits!!

this makes sense.

anyone else see a relationship between their MTBI and zodiac sign?

I am pisces, INTP and I think I am Water .. SO my fits atleast .. But Astrology has lot more to say than Personality types I believe ..

[Stormcaller]

Originally Posted by PianoManGidley

The Zodiac is crap. There are far more than just 12 personality types in the world.

Astrology is not crap, you just don't know ANYTHING about it. And you are not the only one.

For instance astrology has NEVER assumed that there are only 12 different types of personalities. If you knew MORE about astrology you would know this. If you think all there is to astrology is 12 sun signs... you couldn't be more wrong.

You are entitled to your opinion if you have done adequate research. But you are hardly an authority on astrology if you do not even know the most basic of astrological theory.

I don't go around saying Quantum mechanics is bunk just because I am not educated enough to understand all the variables of quantum theory.

Subsequently you are not well educated enough in Astrology to ascertain it's validity.

[Stormcaller]

A very interesting book is "The Fated Sky - Astrology in History" by Benson Bobrick.

Did you know that Astrology was the FIRST scientific art and that all science stemmed out of the need for calculations in order to make astrological predictions?

Did you know the most respected men in history from Plato, Aristotle to Copernicus and Shakespeare used Astrology in their own lives.

Did you know that the popular common idea (that Astrology is hooplah) was a rumor produced by people who DID use astrology - in order to keep this sacred knowledge from the masses? (the stigma against astrology was then propagated by the sheep mentality of the masses so we govern each others freedom of thought in everyday life) [this paragraph is strictly my opinion based on clear evidence I have uncovered]

Did you know that the Catholic church actually supports the study of astrology theoretically (although there are some discrepancies in the actual teaching of this down the line of the church system)?
Do you know how many astrological references The New and Old Testament have?

I'm just asking if you know that. Cause if you didn't; now it has been presented to you. Please check into what I say for yourself if you find this post intriguing.

[Lazarus]

my horoscopes are 50% right if not, well it's the next day that the other 50% kicks in. so, i can say it's not completely accurate but it can be. did you know it affects gender and age and the time and date of birth? i heard some say about location too. so, how can we know if it's accurate if the possibilities add up for more than just 12? =/ i can say one thing, this unknown is very interesting

how can one prove it's not there by trying to find it? one must look every angle, shape, form, and/or whatever in everything to prove it's not there?

me and my two friends have the same elements. we've known each other since 1st grade and haven't split then, not even now.

i can't say it's true (in case proven wrong) but what i can say is that the added coincidences leads me to believe.

[Lazarus]

one Q. what's the letters -i -n - f -p and others?

[Fullcrum]

Check this thread out:

http://www.stevepavlina.com/forums/c...astrology.html

Lazarus, that's the MBTI. Myers Briggs Type Indicator personality asessment. Check it out on Google.

[Sam988]

I'm pisces and i'm definitely not INFP...


needless to say, i think both have nothing to do with each other, actually i think that astrology has nothing to do with anything (useful)