Wealth = Success???

[Andrew Brunelle]

I don't know if you agree with the following title, but it seems like we all measure success with respect to how much money someone made. It's not that they have a good heart or are living their passion, it's all about the money. "How much money have they made pursuing their passion?" If it's not much, even less than they were making before, outside observers will comment by saying that this person is not successfu, when indeed, they may be very successful in finding their passion, doing their passion, and living their passion. Money si obsolete when compared to someone living their passion. As long as they have enough money to live and keep living their passion, there really isn't a need for more money. If you have excess money that you're not using, what's the point of having it? Maybe you could give it to charity. But if you really want to become a millionaire just to do it, how much money will you make before you stop being greedy, always wanting more?

This is a conflict I'm having. Sure, it would be nice to make millions of dollars for an easy life, but if I do it not following my passion, then it will be pointless. But even if I do make millions following my passion, it will feel like I really don't need a lot of the money, so I'll most likely end up giving it away to the point where I survive and I guess it is a good thing to give money away. But even if I don't make all that money and I do follow my passion, I'll still be successful in my mind and I will not let materialism warp my sense of success. If I make a good living doing it, enough to support myself and eventually my family, then I've done what I need to do. Just some thoughts I thought I'd get out there.

[Erki]

Spot on, Andrew. I think before one wants a certain sum of money, s/he has to know what does s/he want it for. I mean, what we really want is what we can do with that money, what we can use it for, not the money itself.

money = medium
what you do with that money = message

That's how I see it.

[Baltar]

Originally Posted by Andrew Brunelle

This is a conflict I'm having. Sure, it would be nice to make millions of dollars for an easy life, but if I do it not following my passion, then it will be pointless. But even if I do make millions following my passion, it will feel like I really don't need a lot of the money, so I'll most likely end up giving it away

If you follow your passion, I think you have a chance of making as much money as you need to achieve what you want to achieve. If your long term goals don't require a lot of money (which is perfectly fine), you won't feel motivated to be making a lot of money. As you climb the consciousness levels, you one by one lose the most common desires people have for making money: security, materialism, clinging to your physical possessions which are ultimately dust anyway. Your values change, and so do your priorities. Sounds like you're at a level already where you're questioning materialism, and that's good.

However, money is not bad in itself. You just have to be clear why you want it. If you really do need the money to accomplish something worthwhile, it'll come to you eventually. You'll take the appropriate actions consciously or subconsciously for it to happen. But if you think that you'd only use money for selfish needs, then you'll never make millions. Doing that would require lowering your level of consciousness.

[thadroe]

I think a primary reason most people equate money with success, is that they usually start out wanting money simply as a means to be able to do the things that make them happy and fulfilled. But eventually, they get so wrapped up in the pursuit of money itself that somewhere along the line a disconnection devlops. They eventually forget why they wanted the money to begin with. That ultimately leads to the money itself being equated with success.

Thad

[fontduroy]

"Money doesn't solve all of your problems, but it does solve the problem of not having enough money." - Me

If someone is following their passions, is considered "poor" by someone else's standards, but feels like they are rich, then they are successful.

If someone is following their passions, but complains about not having enough money, then they are not successful.

If someone has plenty but doesn't realize it, then they are also not successful.

Just some simple guidelines that I live by.

[ImOpen]

I think it's a valid point you're making. The happiest and most fullfilled people I know of, namely the zen buddhistic munks, don't even strive for money. Three meals a day, peace of mind and love is all we need.

To be honest, I think it's quite weird that the positive psychology movement put so much weight on making money, which is absolutely irrelevant to your personal development.

[songwriter]

No way money=success. Or money=happiness. That may be the biggest lie ever. Just get to know some rich ones...

[jwinn]

I think this is one of those things that we are constantly told, that money doesn't equal happiness, but we don't listen until we do get the money and then we realize. It's like running your hardest in a circle and you're right back where you started.

[thadroe]

Most of my clients at my day job are very wealthy....yet I'd say 95% of them are just downright miserable.

Thad

[TheBull]

shamelessplug...
This was a good enough topic that I had to blog about it.

[trekr5]

Sometimes I really do wonder why there is such antipathy and conflict about wealth or money? And yet the majority of this planet could not function without it. Economies would grind to a halt and the world would go back to the Stone Age.

There is absolutely nothing wrong or evil in having money. If you pursue your purpose and add value to people's lives then inevitably you will be rewarded. What is wrong with that? I fail to comprehend this sackcloth attitude of people towards money. I find it very strange.

Money is not evil. A lot of good can be done with it. Peoples lives have been changed because of it. It's only a tool. You have more choices and freedom when you have wealth and that is not a bad thing. If you are conflicted about wealth, then perhaps you should opt out of the Western society and go and join Hare Krishna or become a Buddhist monk and live in a monastary somewhere because the world ain't gonna change anytime soon.

[Baltar]

Originally Posted by trekr5

Sometimes I really do wonder why there is such antipathy and conflict about wealth or money?

I think the real issue people have with money is not the belief that it's evil in itself, but the belief that to be wealthy they have to either do something unethical, or do something they don't enjoy doing. Society is great at conditioning both of these into us. Steve has a blog entry about such limiting beliefs, in Overcoming Limiting Financial Beliefs.

[thadroe]

Originally Posted by Baltar

I think the real issue people have with money is not the belief that it's evil in itself, but the belief that to be wealthy they have to either do something unethical, or do something they don't enjoy doing. Society is great at conditioning both of these into us. Steve has a blog entry about such limiting beliefs, in Overcoming Limiting Financial Beliefs.

Thanks Baltar....that's an awesome blog post by Steve...just when I think I've read this site "cover to cover", someone points out a new one I haven't seen before.

Thad

[Eggzachery]

The problem lays not in wealth, but what one associates with being wealthy. To the title question "Wealth = Success???" I answer with a resounding YES!

But I do not limit my view of wealth to riches and money. Wealth is an abundance of that which one seeks. So when one knows what one seeks, and has that in great abundance, they are, in my book, successful.

You can't know what to seek unless you know your purpose.

[Greg]

Money and wealth is just one part of life. If you focus on that part too much, then you become unbalanced. I agree with Erki - "money = medium
what you do with that money = message".

Another way to look at success might be:

Success = number of people you help * amount/value/difference you make in their lives.

[G. Gekko]

Originally Posted by Eggzachery

The problem lays not in wealth, but what one associates with being wealthy. To the title question "Wealth = Success???" I answer with a resounding YES!

But I do not limit my view of wealth to riches and money. Wealth is an abundance of that which one seeks. So when one knows what one seeks, and has that in great abundance, they are, in my book, successful.

You can't know what to seek unless you know your purpose.

I agree, it's all subjective. According to Steve our entire reality is Subjective anyway.

For example, I have the goal of becoming the world's first trillionaire. Not that I need that much money, I just think that creating income sources, investments, & businesses are fun. So it's probably my purpose to do so. So to me, the amount of wealth I create is like a "score card." The more wealth I amass, the better the score, the better the score, the more successful I feel!

[KarlN]

I love making money. I love doing things with that money too, like travelling to new countries, treating myself to an extraordinary dinner or having a brand new coat I feel comfortable in.

I don't see why someone should mean I am on the "lower end" of the consciousness ladder, just because I value feelings like security and materialism. Money sets you free from a lot of negative feelings, and gives you a lot of new opportunities (like starting a new business).

Money is happiness if you cherish it.

[G. Gekko]

Originally Posted by KarlN

I love making money. I love doing things with that money too, like travelling to new countries, treating myself to an extraordinary dinner or having a brand new coat I feel comfortable in.

I don't see why someone should mean I am on the "lower end" of the consciousness ladder, just because I value feelings like security and materialism. Money sets you free from a lot of negative feelings, and gives you a lot of new opportunities (like starting a new business).

Money is happiness if you cherish it.

Couldn't have said it better! There are people out there that'll disagree. But I don't think that being broke is very "spiritual." I do think that being happy is. And if money adds to that happiness, then why not!

Don't put to much stock on people thinking you are on the "lower end" of the conciousness ladder. If you're happy (isn't that the main objective anyway), then their opinoin really doesn't matter much.

[Milo Riano]

Who was the guy that said : Money is not the root of all evil but having no money is the root of all evil.

I want to increase my wealth to secure me and my family of anything that could happen in the future.

[Vanessa]

It sounds like you are having one hell of a conflict with the idea of completely pursuing your passion and other people judging you for how much money you'll make.

You mentioned the idea of making money and everything over enough money is excessive and you would have to give it away. It seems giving money away is not something you would enjoy doing when you have your million dollars.That's not a bad thing it just does not motivate you or make you feel good about having that amount of money. If you don't want to give the extra money away, you could find a purpose for using that money to do something that is in harmony with your passion and your wants -- you mentioned that making a good living to support yourself and your eventual family.

Pursuing your passion to the point of making more than you need to have a suffecient living could be used towards building a secure future for yourself and your loved ones. Like a nest egg where you can be sure to live off the interest of your money and take care of the financial needs of your future. That's only possible when you are making more than what you need to survive on. But you have to want that deep down, that's really all you'll put your money to use for otherwise you'll just get rid of it accidentally or not. And that's not any better place to be than not having money in the first place.

Another concept you mentioned that you weren't too happy with is the idea of being sucessful and having money and materialism distract you from your passion and goals. I have no problem having nicer things when I've earned the right to buy them by doing things that are in line with my passions.

I do have a goal to make over a million dollars but its not just a number figure or a means to an easy life. It's my journey to pursuing my passion, discovering what my limits are and pushing them to being a better person, growing beyond what I am comforatable with right now. Inertia is the surest roadblock to reaching my goals. That million dollars isn't just money its a representation of the value I bring to others and relfection of value I hold inside of myself with my character, my heart, my love and my actions. I would say that if I had to put a number on what good I have inside myself a million dollars is not nearly high enough. But it's a start because the money I am making now is not reflecting that inner value I place on myself.

I also believe that money is a by product of value I create by living on purpose, I intend to create more and have seen the amount of money I make increase too.

I strongly believe that other people's beliefs about me and money are none of my business. It's theirs. My only concern is am I being true to myself, my passions and my goals. That's my measure of success and no one else's take on what is success distracts me. Other people will always have good, bad and indifferent things to judge you by. It's just noise to what really matters.

Pursue your passion whole heartedly and success as you determine it will follow.

[Bonkers]

My take on the situation is I don't need a lot of money, what im aiming for is passive income of enough for me to live on so I can pursue whatever I want without wasting time idling at work or wasting my days to make someone else rich.

[KarlN]

For me that income can be active as long as I am doing something I like. But of course, I see the power of passive income.

Does anyone here have any income that is really truly passive, meaning they don't do anything to preserve it? How long do you estimate that stream of income will continue?

[Cassie]

I made a list a few years ago, in an old tattered journal, of the goals I wanted to try to achieve in my lifetime. Some have been accomplished (traveling through most of Europe), and some have yet to be accomplished (swimming with dolphins, climbing parts of Mount Sinai, and becoming a millionaire). I didn't know at that point why I wanted to become a millionaire. I think I enjoyed the challenge of the thought. I also knew that if I ever accomplished that goal, I would probably turn around and give almost all my wealth away.

Now fast forward from a few years and my goal is starting to gain more clarity. I am very passionate about the environment and humanitarian issues. I try to do small things to make a difference, but I also realize that if I'm able to gather money through wise financial choices, I also have the freedom to make a much stronger impact overall.

I'm also not too attached to material things. It's the spiritual aspects of my life that really count for me. So in a sense, I feel deeply blessed and thus very wealthy all ready.

[The Probabilist]

Hold it right there. It seems like most of you are missing a crucial point when it comes to wealth. Wealth is definitely one way to measure success. However, there are different ways to measure wealth as well. And since nobody addressed another perspective than defining it by sheer amount of money itself, I wrote an article about it in my blog.

Measuring Wealth

[songwriter]

Well, that thing of Wealth=Sucess is very stick in the American Culture. It's not seen that way so much out of there. You sometimes qualifily people as "losers" or "winners"... we hardly do that. We have other concept of what's winning and what's losing.

Obviously I'm generalizing but it is an obvious USA thing.

[Fusebox]

To be brutally honest, having wealth and good cashflow, opens more options and choices that are we are capable of making.

[cybersphere]

Success is the progressive realisation of a worthwhile personal ideal. Money should just be a means towards that end. It is not an end by itself.

[Shuchetana]

Wealth is a part of success.

Many people related wealth to evil for the wrong reasons: maybe they've met wealthy people they didn't like, or they link wealth with greed and selfishness.

But money, as a medium, is powerful. You can use it to buy security, to make yourself happy, to donate to a worthy cause, to start a useful business, and many other things.

Shameless plug ...

I wrote a post about this a while back, which you guys might enjoy, called "How to 'buy' Happiness"

And here's an opposite and complementary one: "18 non-monetary things you can do to be happy"

[RandomGuy101]

"Money is not success, success is having what you want. If you want nothing then you are successful."
-Swami Kriyananda

[Still Growing]

[QUOTE=This is a conflict I'm having. Sure, it would be nice to make millions of dollars for an easy life, but if I do it not following my passion, then it will be pointless. But even if I do make millions following my passion, it will feel like I really don't need a lot of the money, so I'll most likely end up giving it away to the point where I survive and I guess it is a good thing to give money away. But even if I don't make all that money and I do follow my passion, I'll still be successful in my mind and I will not let materialism warp my sense of success. If I make a good living doing it, enough to support myself and eventually my family, then I've done what I need to do. Just some thoughts I thought I'd get out there.[/QUOTE]

Andrew,
As you said there are various forms of wealth such as health, family and freedom to do what you love which would be time. You asked "But if you really want to become a millionaire just to do it, how much money will you make before you stop being greedy, always wanting more?

I agree that people should not judge your success by your wealth but you should not condem greed so quickly.

Financial wealth is really a storing of time. You could grow your own food if you had the time but you exchange your money (stored time) for this food for example.

I commend you following your passion but if you are happy about not creating wealth you probably wouldn't feel the need to post about it. I suspect you secretly would like to have both. And you can if you first educate yourself on how to build wealth.

Most people think that financial wealth is something that happens to you. People think of "Finding" the right product instead of "Creating" it. They think of the lottery, etc. But when they speak of family then understand that you have to work on your relationships. When we speak of health you can't possibly be in the best health without learning what to eat and what exercises to do and then put your energy towards it.

But why is it about "making millions". To become financially wealthy you do not usually jump to millions, you start with thousands and build up. You also mentioned that you are concerned about materialism if you built financial wealth but materialism is not equal to financial independence. This mentality that you must be greedy to be wealthy is false. You also do not need to be materialistic to be wealthy.

What is financial indepence????????? My measurement is how long you can live with your current lifestyle without having to work. Think about it. If you were able to live reasonably and secure your basics then you would be able to dedicate your life to whatever you choose.

Lets not forget that most flashy people are not very wealthy. Many of them are but even more are not.

Many of my friends are very financially wealthy but you would never know it by the cars they drove.

Being financially wealthy does not mean that you would become a better or worse person. It really does not have anything to do with you as an individual and your character.

Aside from people who inherit, win the lotter or come up with something like Google, there are a lot of people out there who are just fianancially savvy. They live below their means, they read a lot about self improvement and they generally try to just be the best at what they do. They therefore, store time (money) for some future use or leverage.

If you do what you love you may not make much money but if you are the best at what you do you will most likely make money. But even if you make good money it does not mean you will be financially wealthy.

Most financially wealthy people, I have found, tend to study gaining wealth as a hobby. They read about investments, talk to friends about ideas, go into businesses with new products or people and are continuously growing their financial muscles. This isn't for everyone.

If you had the knowledge of a financial genious and acted upon that knowledge you would become wealthy. The same with emotional knowledge. or health knowledge. If you know a lot about fitness, talk to others about fitness and act upon it you will most likely become pretty fit.

I would say 90% of people reading this are not financially fit. The majority of people are not interested in how financial wealth works they are more interested in the things it can buy. This would be like wanting a great body so you could attract more dates but not really having any interest in learning about training. Makes no since right?

I would suggest that you learn to be content with less money and do not care how others judge you. Or you make a decision that you will learn to build wealth while doing what you love. You may not explode with millions in one to five years but you'll set yourself on a path of financial independence when you retire. If you chose the prior don't let those judging you get you down. Money is not the judge of a good or happy person and most people who will look down on you are just faking. Most are in debt up to their eyeballs and are just keeping up a front to make themselves look wealthier than they are.