My thoughts on employees....

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by SquarePeg

Of course, there are times when no amount of understanding and goodwill can make up for an ill fit! But a real boss is never at the mercy of his or her employees.

I wouldn't entirely agree with you.

I've seen situations where the employee is so good that the boss becomes afraid to lose the employee.

That's when the employee has quite a lot of power.

[Monty]

Originally Posted by Margarita888

Oh no, no, no, no, noooooo way. The power doesn't lie with employers alone. You always have the power to change your situation. I'm not oblivious to the fact that if you hate your job, that you can't just ditch it if you've got family to support or have other obligations. I totally get that. But what I do not agree with is falling prey to your situation. If you don't like your job, what are you going to do about it? There is no point in complaining unless you just want to hear yourself talk. If you are at a dead-end job with no other options, complaining isn't going to turn your life around. Keep in mind that a lot of times, dissatisfaction can by your soul's way of nudging you to go a different direction.

I do agree that self-employment is not for everyone. Neither is staying at a job that does not fulfill you. My point is that you just have to keep moving forward or be grateful for what you've got.

Most people think the recession has hurt economies around the world. I think it has actually forced people and businesses to prove their worth. Gone are the days when all you had to do was show up at work, now you actually have to work and show why you're better than somebody with 5 degrees and a phd.

You raise an interesting point there, should one just be 'grateful' for having a job? a school of thought could be that we are just TOO demanding, maybe we have become a little complacent, greedy almost, with our lifestyles, wants and desires. Food for thought.

It's always preferential to remain positive and forward looking, I will agree with that also.

In my previous post, I was referring to the power shift between employee and employer, regarding the points raised in your initial post. Of course the freedom to think / act / do whatever you want in life has always been present.

I'm just concerned with two things here:

a) Is there an equivilent job you can go to if you leave your current one?
b) maybe you enjoy or like your job, but if you are forced to take a pay-cut to keep it, there is a difficult choice to make.

WHAT WOULD YOU DO?

on a global level, In terms of economies you just have to take a look at Portugal, Greece, Ireland etc. to understand the recession has been catostrophic for many people running Businesses. Even in the UK, banks have been hesitant in lending to small Businesses. The recession has definately had a negative impact GENERALLY speaking.

On the plus side, the recession has streamlined Businesses (the ones that are left) forcing Business owners to become more efficient and innovative, and the cream will always rise to the top.
As an entrepeneur / owner manager, with a bit of lateral thinking, you can always find new opportunities in a recession. Debt collection anyone??

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by Monty

on a global level, In terms of economies you just have to take a look at Portugal, Greece, Ireland etc. to understand the recession has been catostrophic for many people running Businesses.

On a TRULY global level, if you go by population size, the five largest countries in the world are China, India, the US, Indonesia and Brazil.

Out of these five countries, four of them achieved GDP growth exceeding 6% in 2010 (the USA being the odd one out).

So it is not so accurate to say that the economic crisis has been that catastrophic, on a global level.

It has been catastrophic for the US, and for Western Europe excluding Germany. But the large majority of the people on this planet do not live in the US nor in Western Europe.

[Monty]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

On a TRULY global level, if you go by population size, the five largest countries in the world are China, India, the US, Indonesia and Brazil.

Out of these five countries, four of them achieved GDP growth exceeding 6% in 2010 (the USA being the odd one out).

So it is not so accurate to say that the economic crisis has been that catastrophic, on a global level.

It has been catastrophic for the US, and for Western Europe excluding Germany. But the large majority of the people on this planet do not live in the US nor in Western Europe.

At least two of the countries mentioned, China and India, are experiencing inflation spikes and slower than predicted growth, certainly slower than than before the global recession.

No country has escaped the recession completely unscathed and some have gone bankrupt. Thats pretty serious in my book.

[SquarePeg]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

I wouldn't entirely agree with you.

I've seen situations where the employee is so good that the boss becomes afraid to lose the employee.

That's when the employee has quite a lot of power.

As someone who enjoys chess, I understand that even a simple Pawn can be quite powerful under the right circumstances.

But that's neither here nor there WRT the standard distribution of power in the overwhelming vast majority of employer-employee relationships.

I'm not saying those relationships have to always turn out acrimonious. I'm only saying that there's an inherent power imbalance and many if not most people are highly sensitive to it.

Not recognizing that they are sensitive to it, however, any number of other factors may be misappropriated to explain mysterious workplace conditions.

What's really interesting, though, is why there is a great amount of resistance to acknowledging this simple fact...or do you not believe karma exists in the workplace, too?

[SquarePeg]

Originally Posted by Monty

You raise an interesting point there, should one just be 'grateful' for having a job? a school of thought could be that we are just TOO demanding, maybe we have become a little complacent, greedy almost, with our lifestyles, wants and desires. Food for thought.

Obviously, some folks should be grateful to have a job.

Obviously, some folks should be grateful to have employees.

Read that second statement again.

Was that really obvious?

How often do you hear about it?

Labor is dispensable. Indeed, there's always someone else to take your place. Even CEOs are not always exempt!

But we're always getting the "be thankful you have a job" platitude.

I'm thankful I have a rather nice job powering a modest lifestyle (like I said, Thanksgiving and Independence Day are the only holidays I believe in as an atheist). But that doesn't blind me to the fact of how things are in society!

Originally Posted by Monty

It's always preferential to remain positive and forward looking, I will agree with that also.

Oh, I don't know. Hasn't the country been "positive and forward looking" since Reagan's "Morning in America" scam? What's all the positive thinking got the vast majority of Americans -- who are obviously positive thinkers, voting in politicians who work against their interests, outsourcing their jobs, and even letting illegal immigrants (don't laugh; I was one myself) come in and create additional pressures for the working classes....

Originally Posted by Monty

In my previous post, I was referring to the power shift between employee and employer, regarding the points raised in your initial post. Of course the freedom to think / act / do whatever you want in life has always been present.

Easy to say, but unless you're someone like Viktor Frankl, a psychiatrist who underwent two years of Nazi death camps and then penned "Man's Search for Meaning," such homilies are just hearsay.

The only freedom you have is the inner one.

Which, under certain circumstances, can affect the outer world.

Or do you not think democracy is necessary? Who needs democracy if folks were just positive thinkers, able to "think / act / do whatever you want in life"....

Originally Posted by Monty

I'm just concerned with two things here:

a) Is there an equivilent job you can go to if you leave your current one?
b) maybe you enjoy or like your job, but if you are forced to take a pay-cut to keep it, there is a difficult choice to make.

WHAT WOULD YOU DO?

a) Speaking for myself, no, I run a good part of the show here. I think other people, however -- those who complain about their jobs, who are what got this thread started -- would also say "no," yet without the same blessings I have, and so they complain. What I'm arguing for here is some understanding and empathy. Assuming that they're not all simple ingrates, there must be a reason why otherwise intelligent human beings of generally goodwill are so miserable so often.

b) Actually, just got a pay-cut of a hundred a week a month ago due to declining business! Still, as many folks know, it's not just about the money: it boils down to a sense of control...power! Make me feel like a tool, treat me like a cog, and I'll show you who's the fool! I think most employees have this attitude, because you know what? Employees are just people too!

Originally Posted by Monty

on a global level, In terms of economies you just have to take a look at Portugal, Greece, Ireland etc. to understand the recession has been catostrophic for many people running Businesses. Even in the UK, banks have been hesitant in lending to small Businesses. The recession has definately had a negative impact GENERALLY speaking.

Yes, for the small fry, which is the overwhelming vast majority of us, employer or employee. Or as chess players like to note, all the pieces go to the same place at the end of the game!

Originally Posted by Monty

On the plus side, the recession has streamlined Businesses (the ones that are left) forcing Business owners to become more efficient and innovative, and the cream will always rise to the top.
As an entrepeneur / owner manager, with a bit of lateral thinking, you can always find new opportunities in a recession. Debt collection anyone??

Human ingenuity is amazing.

Human morals...still evolving.

[SquarePeg]

Originally Posted by Acting Like Godot

On a TRULY global level, if you go by population size, the five largest countries in the world are China, India, the US, Indonesia and Brazil.

Out of these five countries, four of them achieved GDP growth exceeding 6% in 2010 (the USA being the odd one out).

So it is not so accurate to say that the economic crisis has been that catastrophic, on a global level.

It has been catastrophic for the US, and for Western Europe excluding Germany. But the large majority of the people on this planet do not live in the US nor in Western Europe.

They still depend mainly on American and European markets.

American and European companies, however, will just keep finding new sources of cheap labor.

That's the problem.

An employer can move. An employee cannot.

Power is having choices, and dictating the circumstances.

Employers have the politicos in their pockets.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by SquarePeg

They still depend mainly on American and European markets.

Well, the world is interconnected.

Still, the statistics speak for themselves. 2010: India's GDP is 7 point something, China's GDP is 10.3%.

An employer can move. An employee cannot.

Actually, employers are much less mobile than employees.

To get out of a job, you merely need to find another job. Two pieces of paper are required - one resignation letter, and one new contract.

For an employer to exit, it's much more difficult. Your capital is tied up ... in factories, office leases, fixed assets, hundreds of contracts with customers.

[Acting Like Godot]

Originally Posted by SquarePeg

What's really interesting, though, is why there is a great amount of resistance to acknowledging this simple fact...or do you not believe karma exists in the workplace, too?

Most of my life, I have only worked in giant corporations (like 80,000+ employees in 70+ countries, and the like).

The way I see it, just about every boss also has a boss. It's bosses all the way, until the Chairman of the Board.

Who has to answer to tens of thousands of shareholders around the globe. Many of whom like to screw his arse too.