Is this a bad idea? (Q about confidence in a product)

[rei]

I'm working on a sales page for a product that I am excited about, and I'm confident it can do what I'm saying it can do as long as folks follow the process as I'll be explaining it.

But the results are not exactly tangible (or they could be, depends on what people use it for), and I hesitate to provide any kind of money-back guarantee because I'm concerned people might purchase the product, have it actually work, and still try to use the guarantee to get their money.

And even though I could technically use my intuitive abilities to get a feel for whether they were being honest in saying the product didn't work for them, I'd rather not even be in a situation of trying to feel whether someone is being honest. I'm not trying to trick people, and I'd rather not even expect that on my end.

Is it a bad idea to mention on the sales page that I would be offering a guarantee if there was not a tendency for some people to take advantage of such things? That I'm confident enough in the product that I would offer a guarantee if not for that tendency? Is saying something like that going to be off-putting for people? Probably so, huh...

I guess I am wondering how I can set visitors' minds at ease... because I can't really help but come across like I'm offering a "quick fix" thing - even though it actually works (speaking from personal experience, and at first I was even surprised it worked so well)!

What a bizarre situation to be in - providing something that can authentically get easy results, and trying to figure out how to show it is not just another BS offer that offers nothing real behind what is pitched.

I know there is rightful suspicion about something like that... and I'm trying to figure out how I can show people this can work as an easy, simple thing if they give it a chance. Even though so many have made similar claims, so people are entirely in the right to hesitate when it sounds easy.

So what options do I have, aside from a money-back guarantee? I know Satvik mentioned offering a guarantee in another thread, and I certainly understand how that can help - does that mean people are not generally going to try and get their money back if the product worked for them? And what recourse would I have if it seemed someone was saying it did not work for them when it did? How would I handle a situation like that? Return the money even if they are being deceitful and let the karma system handle it ? Could I at least expect this to be an exception and not a rule?

Hmm... so much to think about... I suppose if I know I'm acting from a place of honesty and integrity, there is a greater chance that will be my experience of patrons as well. I would certainly rather give my patrons the benefit of the doubt!

Thanks for any clarity you can provide

[Chris_1977]

Even if you offer a money-back guarantee, you can be quite sure there will be more people for whom it does not work (or not work that well) who don't demand money back than people for whom it works who will demand money back. Most people are honest and quite a lot of people are lazy.

[SatvikBeri]

Hi Rei,

In my experience, people rarely make use of a money-back guarantee, even if the product *didn't* work for them.

I've worked in businesses where we offered a 100% money-back guarantee, no questions asked (we sold PDFs). And I experienced first-hand talking to customers who weren't 100% satisfied, but still didn't want the refund. Out of thousands of customers, only a handful asked for their money back, and they always had very good reasons (like the file they received was corrupted). Honestly, I can't think of one case where the return seemed suspicious at all-if someone is dishonest, it is definitely the exception, and not the rule.

As an example-someone ordered a report that was mislabelled by the author. So they got the wrong report and were unable to find the one they were looking for. But they still didn't want a refund, because they felt like we (the company) hadn't done anything wrong. Even though our money-back guarantee was 100% unconditional.

And honestly, I'd recommend that you try and figure out why you are worried about someone being dishonest and asking for a refund. Are you afraid of losing money? From a purely practical PoV that's almost impossible with a money-back guarantee-most people see a huge increase in sales when they post a guarantee. Are you afraid of people taking advantage of you? Remember, selling your product doesn't cost you anything-if someone buys, and asks for a refund, that does you no harm.

Remember that a money-back guarantee is not a guarantee your advice will work for the customer-it's just an agreement that you'll give a refund if they want.

If posting a guarantee still bothers you, if you can say a bit more about why it bothers you, I can offer some alternatives.

[rei]

Originally Posted by Chris_1977

Even if you offer a money-back guarantee, you can be quite sure there will be more people for whom it does not work (or not work that well) who don't demand money back than people for whom it works who will demand money back. Most people are honest and quite a lot of people are lazy.

Heh, very true. I have something I would like to return and just haven't felt like doing it

Originally Posted by SatvikBeri

Hi Rei,

In my experience, people rarely make use of a money-back guarantee, even if the product *didn't* work for them.

I've worked in businesses where we offered a 100% money-back guarantee, no questions asked (we sold PDFs). And I experienced first-hand talking to customers who weren't 100% satisfied, but still didn't want the refund. Out of thousands of customers, only a handful asked for their money back, and they always had very good reasons (like the file they received was corrupted). Honestly, I can't think of one case where the return seemed suspicious at all-if someone is dishonest, it is definitely the exception, and not the rule.

As an example-someone ordered a report that was mislabelled by the author. So they got the wrong report and were unable to find the one they were looking for. But they still didn't want a refund, because they felt like we (the company) hadn't done anything wrong. Even though our money-back guarantee was 100% unconditional.

And honestly, I'd recommend that you try and figure out why you are worried about someone being dishonest and asking for a refund. Are you afraid of losing money? From a purely practical PoV that's almost impossible with a money-back guarantee-most people see a huge increase in sales when they post a guarantee. Are you afraid of people taking advantage of you? Remember, selling your product doesn't cost you anything-if someone buys, and asks for a refund, that does you no harm.

Remember that a money-back guarantee is not a guarantee your advice will work for the customer-it's just an agreement that you'll give a refund if they want.

If posting a guarantee still bothers you, if you can say a bit more about why it bothers you, I can offer some alternatives.

Satvik, I guess I'm hesitant to offer the guarantee because I am new to all this business stuff

And also, depending on how someone uses the product itself, it may take time before they end up in a situation where they see it did work. I would rather they not think it did not work, when it would really be a matter of things still showing up in a way to show them it did (again, depending on how they use the product). Not that I need to expect to have any control over how it works out for them, and I don't.

I guess it may be an integrity issue for me as well. I wouldn't be offering it if I didn't have experience of the success. And, because of how the process might play out depending on how it's used, I'd rather set it up so they would have the option to get their money back if after two months pass they don't have satisfying results (is that a bad way to do it? - I ask because I also don't want people to think they will have to wait to see the results either, as that's not a given - it depends on how they are using it and what experiences they end up having after they use it). I think that provides the best structure for the guarantee, but then that is also not a 100% satisfaction guarantee like you're talking about because the point is to offer a refund if it doesn't do what I say it can do.

But setting it up so they can get a guarantee after two months also has a down side, as what if I've already put their money back into my business?

I guess I'm just not used to all the different variables, and I'm trying to figure out the best approach for all involved.

Maybe an unconditional money-back guarantee is a better way to go. Certainly seems so from an intuitive feeling standpoint.

[MyEyeIsOpen]

You're almost certainly over thinking this. I have had exactly one person ask for a refund in a year of selling a lot of stuff online. I even offer 110% refunds and no one takes the offer. Just focus on making a good product. Deal with the issue when it becomes an issue.

[rei]

MyEye, you just said the same thing my intuition was trying to communicate

Thank you. This excessive analysis is something I used to do working out a new endeavor, but nowadays it's really not helpful and makes me feel icky. Thanks for the reality check

[iDreamCatcher]

If you are going to use Paypal to sell whatever - it takes buyer a few clicks to file claim on his purchase with Paypal. Paypal would immediately freeze amount of money equal purchase amount and start "investigating". If you did not sell and ship physical products that "investigation" is guaranteed to be in favor of customer.
And customer is then going to raise a stink on his own will all over then net about you and your product just because he can and is probably bored.

So to avoid all above it is better to:
- give customer refund if he start complaining.
- give 100% guarantee. This will likely bring you more customers to compensate for refunders.

[iDreamCatcher]

PS: if you are offering something like online course - deliver gradual access to it by recurring subscription. So if customer will refund soon - he will not get the whole thing. The ones who stay longer will likely stick with you.

[CoolBee]

Don't worry about it Rei. While doing my business coaching training, we were shown research that shows that if a business makes a 'mistake' and deals with it efficiently, this can in fact generate greater customer loyalty over the long term than a business which makes no 'mistakes'. (For 'mistake' just interpret loosely!). Hence you may often find in hotel chains some small error - eg broken light bulb, missing batteries in remote control, say - that they can fix efficiently and with a good manner, generating a very favourable impression in the customer's mind!

Can't find the actual research we were shown right now, but here's a link to something similar:

How To Create Loyal Customers and Succeed In Your Business

I have also had this experience myself over my working life - going in both directions.

[Piercetheveil]

Across all of my net domains I have less than a 7% refund rate. However, adding the guarantee increases my sales (I split test to make sure) by 47%.

[Andrew Brunelle]

Offering the guarantee is something that won't be something to truly worry about. Odds are that less than 5% of people will actually ever want a refund, so the cost is negligible. It is certainly not something to worry about as most people never take the time to refund something, even if it doesn't work for them. So, there really is no reason to worry about a guarantee.

[rei]

Thank you all for your feedback! I decided to offer a guarantee with the product in question

Gleb, I see where you're coming from. Once I have more coming in I'll be more inclined to use a shopping cart system, and I agree about the gradual providing of the info as well. That would also give the person time to see whether they want to continue receiving the service before they commit as much money

Thanks again to all of you! This is such an exciting up and down process And I haven't even explored much in the way of marketing yet, so I'm sure there's a chance I'll keep on learning a ton!

[Piercetheveil]

Keep good numbers and historical stats REI and know which numbers matter. Without those its just...

Hmm, might be a fun intuitive test for ya.

[rei]

Cute pic, PTV

I have Google Analytics. Earlier today someone gave me the valuable suggestion to launch first and revise later. Probably going to make my site public in the next 24 hours and check out the Analytics.

I don't know if Google keeps your stats in your acct or you need to save them yourself, but it would be good to look into that. Thanks

[SatvikBeri]

Originally Posted by rei

Cute pic, PTV

I have Google Analytics. Earlier today someone gave me the valuable suggestion to launch first and revise later. Probably going to make my site public in the next 24 hours and check out the Analytics.

I don't know if Google keeps your stats in your acct or you need to save them yourself, but it would be good to look into that. Thanks

Google keeps them. Analytics is ridiculously awesome.

[rei]

Originally Posted by SatvikBeri

Google keeps them. Analytics is ridiculously awesome.

Oh yeah I can tell ^_^ The option I used before would not even tell me how visitors got referred (Yes, this is most definitely up there with the most fruitful learning experiences of my life )

[WorkitSmart]

100% money back guarantee always sets people's minds at ease.. and if you're confident in your product, it shouldn't be a problem.

Also, even though you will have some returns, think of all the sales you would NOT make if you didn't offer the guarantee.

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[davidchung]

Originally Posted by iDreamCatcher

If you are going to use Paypal to sell whatever - it takes buyer a few clicks to file claim on his purchase with Paypal. Paypal would immediately freeze amount of money equal purchase amount and start "investigating". If you did not sell and ship physical products that "investigation" is guaranteed to be in favor of customer.

Actually PayPal buyer protection does not cover 'intangible goods' and if the buyer tries to 'elevate' the dispute for PayPal investigation most of the time the PayPal system will just automatically close the dispute in favor of the seller. As long as you make sure to reply in the dispute that it's an intangible good or service (just in case), you should always win the dispute as the seller.

But as a long term policy I feel it would be better to offer the refund anyway, unless you're clearly being scammed.

[iDreamCatcher]

Originally Posted by davidchung

Actually PayPal buyer protection does not cover 'intangible goods' and if the buyer tries to 'elevate' the dispute for PayPal investigation most of the time the PayPal system will just automatically close the dispute in favor of the seller. As long as you make sure to reply in the dispute that it's an intangible good or service (just in case), you should always win the dispute as the seller.

David, I make living selling intangible goods and most through paypal. What you described is the opposite of what I am observing from real life experience.

[davidchung]

Well from my own experience, I've filed for a refund by opening a dispute, tried to elevate it after no response from the seller, and had it rejected automatically by the system, with no investigation made. The reason stated was that it was an intangible good.

I don't think they'll try to stop a credit card chargeback though.

From: PayPal Buyer Protection

An item is covered by PayPal Buyer Protection if:
...The seller's listing is for a physical item – services and intangible items aren't covered.

From: Paypal Problems, Information, Issues, Class Action Lawsuits - PayPal Does Nothing

Thank you for taking the time to write to us with your concerns. I am happy to assist you further. As stated in the Buyer complaint Policy, 'The Buyer Complaint Policy only applies to payments for tangible, physical goods which can be shipped, and excludes all other payments, including but not limited to payments for intangibles, for services or for licenses and other access to digital content.' As per our Buyer complaint policy intangible goods are not covered by this policy.

On the other hand...

From: PayPal Seller Protection

To qualify, a seller must meet the following conditions:
...Item is a tangible good – Only physical goods are covered by the Seller Protection Policy. Intangible goods (services or items such as software, MP3s, or ebooks that are delivered electronically) are not covered.

So it seems that if it's an intangible good, neither sellers nor buyers are protected. And judging from iDreamCatcher's experiences + mine, there have been cases where they've ruled in favor of both buyers and sellers. So I don't know what to think.

Anyway, I think we can agree that it's a good policy to offer prompt refunds. So let's just focus on offering more great products and services and helping to make the world a better place.