Selling a video game concept/idea.

[Eric L]

I have a friend who came up with a great concept for a video game.

As a gamer, I know this game would be fun and enjoyable and the re-playability would be high.

Neither of us has the finances and skills needed to get something like this done.

What I'd like to do instead is present the idea to a group of investors who would have the means to make this happen and sell the idea to them.

Anyone have experience in this kind of stuff?

What would I need to learn to protect this idea? I am guessing things like copyright law, giving good presentations, etc...

Thoughts? Opinions?

And no! I'm not giving you a description!

[Curtis2011]

Originally Posted by Eric L

What would I need to learn to protect this idea? I am guessing things like copyright law, giving good presentations, etc...

Thoughts? Opinions?

And no! I'm not giving you a description!

This is a big mistake that a lot of people make when they come up with a "great" idea... they don't tell anyone about it!

First off - How in the world are you going to find an investor who is going to give you money to make an idea happen, if you never tell him the idea at all?!

You will realistically probably have to approach dozens, if not a hundred or more potential investors before one of them will gladly front the money to fund a project by someone (you) who has no experience. And nobody is going to give you money if they don't know exactly what they are getting into.

The truth is that nobody really cares about your idea. Every one of us has our own dreams, desires, and life goals - none of which involve your specific idea.

If you want to find investors, I suggest you share your idea with as many people as possible, and if someone is interested in investing in it because it would be something that fulfills part of their own life goals, they will invest in YOU to make it happen because you are the expert in it.


---Related Story---
This reminds me of a dude I spoke to a few weeks ago. He said "me and my friend have this great idea for an online business" and I said "oh tell me about it".

He replied that he couldn't tell *anyone* about it because "it could make us a lot of money" (in his words), and that someone would steal it if he told anyone.

He then told me (after I asked) that it would require $1000's of dollars of investment to hire programmers to make it happen, and THEN he had the balls (or the lack of mental capacity) to tell me "if you know anyone with a lot of money, tell them about me."

I walked away from him thinking "why in the ****ing world would I tell a friend of mine to invest in you if you haven't even told me your idea. I don't even know what it is. I'm NOT recommending anyone to you, dumbass!"
---------------

The point is, if you are afraid of sharing your idea, get over it.

[Eric L]

I get it- seeing as it is not my idea I had good intentions in protecting it and would have only told the investors about it. If it peaked their interest I would have picked up on it and would have offered a presentation on it.

But I get where you are getting at. IRL I wouldn't have a problem with this but posting this on a forum where millions can see it is beyond ridiculous. I know what you are saying already and your post was entirely irrelevant to the question asked.

I did not ask whether or not I should tell others or not, I understand this fully and when I meet others IRL that I can relate this to-> I will. But this isn't why I made this thread.

I'm NOT recommending anyone to you, dumbass!

That is you speaking front a bad state of mind. You asked a question and became annoyed and frustrated because you anticipated a response, and, in business, everyone knows that you do not make these kind of judgments or decisions when you are in such a bad state of mind. Bad bad boy

I was asking what it is I need to do to protect this idea. To me and my friend there is great potential in it, I don't need you to beleive me, I just need the investors to. If I tell an investor that I have a video concept that has the potential to net him some money, do you think he will give me some attention? Of course! Why would I ask you about my idea? I already know it would work and you are not an investor.

Seriously, it is apparent you have no input on this for me. "Probably"'s and telling me to tell everyone about an idea that isn't legally protected yet is ridiculous.

I don't even know what it is.

He doesn't need you to know what it is nor does he need your approval of it. He just needs people who can make it happen for him, why did you get upset?? Did he make you feel used or something? When someone has this level of confidence in an idea, do you really beleive he should tell everyone about it before protecting it properly???????

The truth is that nobody really cares about your idea. Every one of us has our own dreams, desires, and life goals - none of which involve your specific idea.

Then why did you ask him about it?

Your funny. If I tell an investor I have an idea that will net him money, he will care, don't worry.

I did not ask if others cared or not either.

To be honest I have seen some of your previous posts and agreed with a majority of them, I'm inclined to say your having a bad day; or something.

[AuspiciousEight]

Eric,

1) I'm an investor.
2) I'm a software engineer.
3) I have to agree with Curtis.

[Mikahcho]

^Ouch

I have my own storyline for a game, but it's too stereotypical JRPG... So I'mma just keep it to myself haha!

But I do know of a guy on a music forum I'm on, he's currently having his own game made with, I think, Atlus (they have done quite a few games before, I knew of them already). He has contacts :3

[Eric L]

Eric,

1) I'm an investor.
2) I'm a software engineer.
3) I have to agree with Curtis.

AuspiciousEight,

1) Are you interested?
2) Good.
3) I agree with Curtis too.

[Eric L]

Ok, I beleive there is miscommunication on my part here.

I will clarify what I meant.

I agree with Curtis on this totally. But privately and IRL only. Not in the open on an online forum, this does not make sense to me. Yes, I am afraid someone might steal because people can be like that. And I don't need to do this either. Again, you two have completely deviated from the question I asked.

I saw his post as him trying to tell me to come out and open right here on now on this very forum.

Is this the case?

AuspiciousEight, please explain why sharing this kind of stuff to people who won't make this happen for me is productive. I don't need someones help to find an investor, do I? I can make connections without doing this, I am 100% sure of it. I am not ready to share an idea that is not legally protected.

Have you bought a video game concept or idea before AuspiciousEight? Please tell me what experiences justify your response, this will better make me understand as your post is beyond short and explanatory.

I find myself deviating totally from my original post. I hate doing this. The question I asked is how do I protect a concept or idea.

Mikahcho, I thank you deeply for bringing sense into this thread and telling me where to look for contacts. The most productive post in this thread yet, I'd rate you up if I could! Even it does not relate to my OP it does at least help me.

This is a big mistake that a lot of people make when they come up with a "great" idea... they don't tell anyone about it!

Going over your post again. This is why I asked the question on how to protect it. Once it is protected, legally, why wouldn't I share it?

I think we both misinterpreted each other.

[AuspiciousEight]

Eric,

I'm going to be honest with you.

When I was in high school my friends and I got together because we had a "great" idea for a video game too. We all learned how to program just so we could make the game a reality. We actually succeeded at making a prototype of the game, but we ultimately failed. Do you want to know what stopped us? Greed and fear. We were all too interested in making money, and too afraid that someone else would steal our idea. So the game never took off.

But I did learn a lot about programming from that experience, and about business in general. A lot of people have ideas that could make millions. I have a long list of ideas waiting to be implemented, and they all have the potential to make millions.

An idea, in and of itself, isn't worth very much. A good idea that is properly implemented, however, is priceless. If you want someone such as myself to take your "idea" seriously, you would need a few things:

1) Your idea would have to be utterly fantastic.

2) You would have to have good, detailed design documentation showing how the game should behave, characters, levels, how the systems would operate, plot if applicable, etc, etc. Hint: A 10 page document likely won't cut it.

3) You would have to get to know your investors. A contract is only as good as the person who signed it, and it's easy to get screwed when you're not the one investing in or developing the product.

4) If you give me an idea, and I am the one who invests hundreds of thousands of dollars into it, and I am the one who develops it, your cut of the profits are going to be very, very small. I suspect this would be the same if you took your idea to any serious investor/developer.

[AuspiciousEight]

BTW,

I don't mean to discourage you. If you are really serious about turning your idea into a reality, feel free to PM me and I'll give you my email address - and we can talk from there. If anything, I can probably point you in the right direction of what you need to do.

Cheers,

[Mikahcho]

If you give me an idea, and I am the one who invests hundreds of thousands of dollars into it, and I am the one who develops it, your cut of the profits are going to be very, very small. I suspect this would be the same if you took your idea to any serious investor/developer.

That's to be expected. Only when/if the game makes it big, would you see big oppurtunities, for yourself, appear.

As long as the ideas, concepts and the overall design belongs to you, you're in with a shot of making it big, unless you sell the idea, then it's not yours anymore. I think that's what happened to the original creator of Final Fantasy. He sold it right at the beginning, and look where it's at now.

[Eric L]

Eric,

I'm going to be honest with you.

When I was in high school my friends and I got together because we had a "great" idea for a video game too. We all learned how to program just so we could make the game a reality. We actually succeeded at making a prototype of the game, but we ultimately failed. Do you want to know what stopped us? Greed and fear. We were all too interested in making money, and too afraid that someone else would steal our idea. So the game never took off.

But I did learn a lot about programming from that experience, and about business in general. A lot of people have ideas that could make millions. I have a long list of ideas waiting to be implemented, and they all have the potential to make millions.

An idea, in and of itself, isn't worth very much. A good idea that is properly implemented, however, is priceless. If you want someone such as myself to take your "idea" seriously, you would need a few things:

1) Your idea would have to be utterly fantastic.

2) You would have to have good, detailed design documentation showing how the game should behave, characters, levels, how the systems would operate, plot if applicable, etc, etc. Hint: A 10 page document likely won't cut it.

3) You would have to get to know your investors. A contract is only as good as the person who signed it, and it's easy to get screwed when you're not the one investing in or developing the product.

4) If you give me an idea, and I am the one who invests hundreds of thousands of dollars into it, and I am the one who develops it, your cut of the profits are going to be very, very small. I suspect this would be the same if you took your idea to any serious investor/developer.

Thank you so kindly for this response.

I will be honest with you also. I don't care about the money, I don't fear to lose any of it- all I want is this idea to hit the shelf and become reality. Greed and fear are not part of my thought process EVER. This idea does not belong to me and, even if I had fear of getting it stolen, protecting it legally would rid me of this fear anyways thus the reason of my original post. I feel I need to protect it for the sake of easing the owner of this idea into helping me out. Also, do you not agree that I need to protect this idea regardless of my fear or lack of it in sharing it? Truly, you cannot expect me to just hand it out in the open, do you?

Here I go, as honestly as I can, of course:

1) I beleive it is. Once it is protected the person who owns this idea will be at ease and will be comfortable with me sharing it privately and IRL. When it is protected I will make the connections I need to get good/honest opinions on this.

2) I have explained the exact same thing to the owner of the idea. I told him: This isn't going to be done this year. If we are going to do this we are most likely going to write the equivalent of several books on this thing.

3) This is something I would not have trouble with, making connections with people and getting my point across is easy and natural to me.

4) I am prepared to push this idea into reality, the owner of the idea just wants the idea on the shelf. We simply ask for just compensation for this idea. We don't care if it's small, we're interested in making it a reality. WE WANT TO PLAY THE DAMN THING

I told the owner of this idea to not expect this to happen. To not put all his hopes in it. He told me: "I just want to play the damn thing." I feel the same as him, once he explained the concept to me I was actually seeing myself play it for hours at a time.

The first step, however, is learning to protect intellectual property, I am sure as hell not going forward without this. This is a logical step. I will not invest hours of effort into something that someone can simply take away from me because I shared it with someone who had bad intentions.

Surely, protecting intellectual property isn't that hard is it?

I am convinced it is the first step to be taken. The "general" concept and description of the game is done and has been revised by us both and we are in total agreement that it represents a generalization the game in the best possible way. I want to protect the idea or concept before going forward. It's just a hurdle and I'm going to jump over it.

Ya dig?

[Brutha]

Your funny. If I tell an investor I have an idea that will net him money, he will care, don't worry.

Grow up.
There are thousands of people who tell investors that they will make the investor rich.

You can't copyright ideas and a potential investor for a game is unlikely to sign a NDA to hear about your idea because that would be stupid for him as he might invest in a company in the future that wants to do something similar as you are proposing.

I don't care about the money, I don't fear to lose any of it- all I want is this idea to hit the shelf and become reality.

Then the notion that you have something to fear by someone stealing your idea is even more mistaken.

[Mounds]

Eric,

Two things.

1. I like your train of thought. The world needs more awesome video games. Keep working at it. Curious, what genre of game is it? I'm a big FPS/RPG fan (Bioshock, Fallout 3, ect.).

2. There is no magic forumla for business. Truthfully, there are thousands of video games that started the same as you are here and they've been tossed since. There are also hundreds that have made it to the shelf.

I don't see why were gang raping Eric over the details. From reading his posts, he doesn't sound like the kind of guy that's going to sit around and wait for things to come to him. He's going to seek out the information and pursue his project whether we agree with him or not. I admire that.
As a matter of fact, my father is a successful entrepreneur. He came to Canada from Holland and was continuously mocked for his efforts. Now he's the largest grower of one particular type of produce in North America. Same with our latest joint venture. No one thought it would go anywhere a few years ago. This year that particular venture is doing sales of $500k, with close to a 50% profit.
Eric, if I were you, I'd look into patents and such. Pursue the dream. Ask some gamer buddies what they think of your idea (you can give me a few details if you want, I'm in no hurry to do anything new). Don't get discouraged too easily and be informed.

[Brutha]

Eric, if I were you, I'd look into patents and such.

Software patents are ridiculous enough but patenting a game?

[Mounds]

Originally Posted by Brutha

Software patents are ridiculous enough but patenting a game?

Brutha, I have no prior knowledge of how this stuff works. Seems like a logical place to start. If you have a better suggestion for where to search for this information, please post it.

[Brutha]

Brutha, I have no prior knowledge of how this stuff works. Seems like a logical place to start. If you have a better suggestion for where to search for this information, please post it.

How about reading the above posts?
Eric doesn't have something that he can effectively protect legally.

[Lauxa]

My father in law and his brother developed a computer game. Father in law did the programming, his brother did the graphics. Various other family members were called in as actors, composers, etc. They got a little advance from a company called Pirana when they were partway through the implementation. Then Pirana failed to market their game and went out of business, so the game did not sell well. They were locked in legal contracts and unable to independently market the game. It did well in the black market in Russia though. It was called Morpheus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Morpheus_(1998_video_game)

Steve programmed some games and ran a successful game company for a while, but again, he did the programming himself.

I don't know how to protect an idea before you implement it, but I would think copyright would be a better bet than a patent. Not that I think either would be much protection or that it's likely you will need this protection.

[Eric L]

So, Brutha, how have you created a video game concept and made it hit the shelf?

The attitude you have towards me in this regard is so fiery that I am assuming you have great experience with this. I better listen to you.

I am listening.

[Eric L]

Thanks Mounds, the video game we are working on is kind of a hybrid first person shooter with a mix of RTS.

I am dieing to explain it to people, but don't want to screw it up.

Brutha has answers for sure.

Brutha, where are you???

[Mounds]

Kinda like F.E.A.R by chance? That was a good one too.
I mean, lets face it. The game market, from the outside looking in, is huge. Gaming is getting bigger and bigger. And some VERY bad games are making it to the shelves.
If you come along with a great idea and you pitch it to the right people, how are you different than anyone else that gets a game published?
I'm really quite confused as to why certain posters aren't being more supportive and are in fact, bordering on naysaying. Every success started somewhere.

[Trezker]

If you don't care about the money, why not make it open source?
Sure, it won't "hit the shelves" but I personally think the shelves are overrated.

What you really need to find is a skilled game designer that finds your idea interesting and can help you develop it into a full design document. This designer will know skilled programmers that can throw together a prototype.
(If you don't know any skilled programmers, you're not a skilled designer. The designer might be his own skilled programmer though.)

The important thing here if you want to keep the product in line with your vision is that you have to do the vast majority of the work in developing your idea. Otherwise the idea gets formed by that designer and your weak initial idea is worth nothing.

However, if you pay attention and put in effort, you'll learn a lot about designing yourself and even if you do loose your vision to the designer you'll be in a better position for your next great idea.

Great ideas are produced in billions around the world every day, but only thousands or even hundreds can be developed into a product. So ideas aren't worth the time it takes to hear about it. If you can't implement it you're not worth anything to anyone.

[Eric L]

I am in agreement with all of that. The learning curve this is presenting me with is steep and I kinda like that.

Video Game Development is something I am starting to consider....

Open source...hmmm...this is a interesting thought.

Thanks for sharing.

[Mikahcho]

You seem a little rude for someone asking for help with something.

If I were you, asking for advice, I'd take all the advice to heart.

[Eric L]

I will have to put something in my sig. If I am truly appearing to be rude I deeply and sincerely apologize.

I am an extremely direct person, people should not try to find hidden meanings in my words. What I say is what I say, I do not imply or use sarcasm.

I am sure you are referring to my posts to Brutha, and will tell you: They are honest and it is my true perception of him. For him to have this attitude towards me he must know something I am sure of it. I am open and listening ans taking everything at heart, in fact I am privately in contact with many in this thread regarding the subject.

Thanks for your input, Mikahcho.

If I were you, asking for advice, I'd take all the advice to heart.

I am, but when people offer nonconstructive posts like:

Software patents are ridiculous enough but patenting a game?

How should one react? He is telling me the idea of protecting my work is ridiculous.

For him to make such a statement, there must be a valid explanation, yes? This is why I asked for him to come back and help me. Isn't this what this forum is all about?

[Eric L]

Ha! I am requesting some information packages from several Video Game Developing colleges/universities.

Time to take a look at this!

[InterfaceLeader]

Eric - I worked for a (very very small) video game company. I can say that we were approached by probably 10-15 people in the year that I worked there who had 'great ideas' for video games.

What I would say is - get it written. Hard-copy. It doesn't really matter how - novelise it, write it as a script, or flow-chart it. Take it as far as you possibly can to a finished product before you start trying to sell the idea to investors. Get a demo programmed if you can. Get concept art. None of the stuff will probably make it to the final version, but it is much easier selling a 'physical' product than it to sell an idea. It's also easier to protect it, if you are that way inclined (I wouldn't bother, there are millions of game ideas and far less people with the talent to take an idea to a finished game)

[Cado]

I would like to add that no one cares about your idea. They care about their ideas. Someone else already said it but I believe it was from the perspective of an investor. Let me share my perspective as someone in the same position as you-I have a great game idea. I know how the mechanics would work. The story would be a variation of a fantasy novel I'm going to write within the next few years. As a fellow creator I wouldn't mind sitting down and having a chat with you about your ideas but in all honesty I wouldn't steal them even if it was the best damn thing I'd ever heard. I'm so invested in developing what I already have that throwing my creative resources behind your idea and claiming it as my own would be a major waste of time. Even if I tried and succeeded I'd no doubt come up with something different than what you'd do so you would still have a means to wedge yourself into the market if you were flexible.

The only time you need to fear having an idea stolen is when it's in its realized or near-realized form and someone else can come along and put their name on it. If I completed the first draft of a novel I wouldn't let anyone else have the file because all they'd have to do is edit it before going to market. That would be fairly easy for a con artist. It wouldn't be easy for him to take an idea I have or a couple chapters from my novel and complete it himself. If he was capable of that he'd be working on his own ideas.

Whatever ideas you have I guarantee at least 100 people have thought up the same thing. The one who's gonna be known for it, the only one who really owns that idea, is the one with the drive to follow it to completion.

[Savage]

I used to run a PC game publishing company, not to mentioning developing games myself for quite a while. People would pitch game ideas to me all the time. After a while I told them not to bother.

Game ideas are a dime a dozen. I can hang out with some gamer friends, and we'll come up with a fabulous new game idea in an afternoon. It's easy. Inspired ideas are abundant.

I would never pay $ for game ideas. They are too easy to come by.

The value is in the implementation, not the idea.

Implementing a good game is very challenging. The idea part is fun and easy. But getting the whole thing to work on a technical and gameplay level is where most of the value lies. A high concept for a game is nothing. In order to make a game work, hundreds of small decisions must be made along the way.

Your idea is worthless. If you can implement it though, at least to create a demo that's very fun to play, then it may be worth something. Until then, however, you're just blowing smoke.

I don't earn any money from my article ideas. But I earn a lot from the hundreds of articles I've successfully written. Coming up with new article ideas is easy, but writing them is what creates all the value.

Being an "idea person" is an excuse for being lazy. Be an implementer instead. Then you'll receive all the great ideas you could ever wish for.

Sorry to be so blunt, but the truth is that in the game publishing industry, most people would just laugh at you. They would not take you seriously because "idea people" are regarded as lazy asses that don't want to do the real work of implementing a game. People in the industry don't need better ideas. They need better implementers.

[Savage]

For more on this topic, see this article:
The Value of Ideas

[Brutha]

Brutha, where are you???

It's a crazy idea that there are people who don't read every post immediately after it' s written?

He is telling me the idea of protecting my work is ridiculous.

If one imagines how a patent for a game design would read it's fun and a good joke. Of course that requires an understanding of the nature of intellectual property.