Trying to get a job in marketing sucks

[introspective1]

I graduated in may 2007 with a B.S. in marketing and I have looked so hard to try to find a job. Here it is, feb of 08, and still i have no job in my major. I think I need to try to find another way of entering the field but people say that if I dont get a job directly in marketing then I am wasting my degree. I dont know what else to do..I need a decent job and I cant work retail forever (although, I enjoy it sometimes). I didnt go to school to struggle like this. Society puts this stupid idea in your head that if you get a degree, a job will be handed to you. Someone told me that if I get a job working with kids, like teaching, it will help me in marketing.. I dont wanna teach. I dont see how that is going to eventually land me a marketing job but thats the kind of advice I have been getting. I figured if I can start out at a company as a manager trainee or in customer service then I can transfer over to a marketing position. I dont know if this is a good strategy or not. I had no internships in school (cause I had to work a regular job) and since I graduated almost a year ago, I may not be able to do an internship now. I am so upset right now...I hope I didn't waste my college career

[AndrewPavelski]

You definitely didn't waste your college career. There are plenty of available opportunities available for "marketing." Do you have any idea as to what type of marketing you want to do? Having an idea will at least help get you going in the right direction!

Best wishes,

Andrew

[Pegasus]

Most marketing jobs I see advertised are actually sales jobs. You could try going a different route. Freelance yourself as a marketing consultant.

I graduated (second time around) late October 2007 and just now finally got a job in my field. I was surprised. Had given up on graphic design due to lack of talent and was trying to get into writing and editing instead. After two big job rejections in a row, a serendipitous event occurred, which led to a contact (a woman I hadn't seen in over 20 years!) who basically handed me a job. This week has been my first week of the new job. It's a mile from where I live. Am making double what I did as a temporary worker. Still adjusting and slightly overwhelmed.

Ya never know...


...

[Steve Pavlina]

Don't take this the wrong way, but I'd sure never hire you.

Who'd hire a marketing person who self-promotes like you just did?

If you truly know anything about marketing, why would you be looking for a job? You should be attracting employers to you. They should be knocking on your door, not vice versa.

If you claim to know something about marketing, why aren't you applying it to yourself? How could you effectively market someone else's stuff if you can't even market yourself, the product/service where you should have the most detailed insider knowledge.

Marketing people who are worth their salt never have to look for a job. The employers court them.

You were right about one thing. You're wasting your degree.

Try again.

[introspective1]

Originally Posted by AndrewPavelski

You definitely didn't waste your college career. There are plenty of available opportunities available for "marketing." Do you have any idea as to what type of marketing you want to do? Having an idea will at least help get you going in the right direction!

Best wishes,

Andrew

Thanks.. Ideally, I would like to get into sports marketing. I had a lead with a local sports team, but my contact, for some reason, couldnt get me a job, although, he told me that if I sent him a resume and cover letter, he would get me an interview. I stayed on him and he never did...I dont know of anyone else who can help me get a job, so I am still trying on my own.

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

Don't take this the wrong way, but I'd sure never hire you.

Who'd hire a marketing person who self-promotes like you just did?

If you truly know anything about marketing, why would you be looking for a job? You should be attracting employers to you. They should be knocking on your door, not vice versa.

If you claim to know something about marketing, why aren't you applying it to yourself? How could you effectively market someone else's stuff if you can't even market yourself, the product/service where you should have the most detailed insider knowledge.

Marketing people who are worth their salt never have to look for a job. The employers court them.

You were right about one thing. You're wasting your degree.

Try again.

How would you know anything about my marketing skills? this thread was written as a rant, not a promotional tool. You dont understand how hard it is to get a job with a degree and no experience, Steve. How would I get employers to come to me, since you have all the answers? Jobs dont just fall in people's laps, especially in today's economy. You shouldn't have even responded cause obviously you dont know a thing about getting into marketing. Thanks for your lack of help

[Steve Pavlina]

Originally Posted by introspective1

How would you know anything about my marketing skills? this thread was written as a rant, not a promotional tool. You dont understand how hard it is to get a job with a degree and no experience, Steve. How would I get employers to come to me, since you have all the answers? Jobs dont just fall in people's laps, especially in today's economy. You shouldn't have even responded cause obviously you dont know a thing about getting into marketing. Thanks for your lack of help

I can assess your marketing skills quite easily because every word you say or type is part of your personal branding. Marketing is an always-on activity; you can't simply turn it on or off when you feel like it. Everything you do teaches people how to brand you as a person. Consider how you've just marketed yourself in this thread. Is that the same image you want to project to a potential employer? Probably not... but now everyone who reads this thread becomes a missed opportunity for you.

Employment opportunities are everywhere. Many jobs are found in indirect ways. In today's job market, you really can't afford to promote yourself negatively in any sphere. Whenever you do that, it's a missed opportunity. Marketing is a fiercely competitive field.

Do you want constructive help and advice, or do you just want to complain? If it's the former, then put your best foot forward, show us how you're promoting yourself to potential employers, and explain why someone should hire you. Then we can help you tweak that message for greater impact and effectiveness.

But if you've already given up on yourself and your real purpose here is just to complain or to solicit a pity party, then quite honestly you should leave and not return. Complaining cannot possibly help you get what you want.

This forum can help you get better results if that's your true aim, but in order for that to happen, you have to re-focus on what you want, not on what you don't want.

I'm not trying to beat you down, just trying to be as straight with you as I can. Believe it or not, I do happen to know a little about marketing, and I frequently deal with people who already work in that field. I've been an employer too. If I can rule you out as a prospect from a single paragraph you wrote, that suggests your personal branding could use a makeover.

Did you have any courses on personal branding in college... or at least positioning? I'm not sure if that's commonly taught in college, but in the real world, it's essential.

You might find this article helpful for a different slant on why you must market yourself effectively:
http://www.stevepavlina.com/articles...conscience.htm

[introspective1]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

I can assess your marketing skills quite easily because every word you say or type is part of your personal branding. Marketing is an always-on activity; you can't simply turn it on or off when you feel like it. Everything you do teaches people how to brand you as a person. Consider how you've just marketed yourself in this thread. Is that the same image you want to project to a potential employer? Probably not... but now everyone who reads this thread becomes a missed opportunity for you.

Employment opportunities are everywhere. Many jobs are found in indirect ways. In today's job market, you really can't afford to promote yourself negatively in any sphere. Whenever you do that, it's a missed opportunity. Marketing is a fiercely competitive field.

Do you want constructive help and advice, or do you just want to complain? If it's the former, then put your best foot forward, show us how you're promoting yourself to potential employers, and explain why someone should hire you. Then we can help you tweak that message for greater impact and effectiveness.

But if you've already given up on yourself and your real purpose here is just to complain or to solicit a pity party, then quite honestly you should leave and not return. Complaining cannot possibly help you get what you want.

This forum can help you get better results if that's your true aim, but in order for that to happen, you have to re-focus on what you want, not on what you don't want.

I'm not trying to beat you down, just trying to be as straight with you as I can. Believe it or not, I do happen to know a little about marketing, and I frequently deal with people who already work in that field. I've been an employer too. If I can rule you out as a prospect from a single paragraph you wrote, that suggests your personal branding could use a makeover.

Did you have any courses on personal branding in college... or at least positioning? I'm not sure if that's commonly taught in college, but in the real world, it's essential.

You might find this article helpful for a different slant on why you must market yourself:
http://www.stevepavlina.com/articles...conscience.htm

Why should someone hire me?? well, I am a very analytical and articulate person, believe it or not. Often times, i am told I am overly analytical. I consider all sides of the situation before making a decision. I was a shift supervisor for four years at my previous job, and learned how to communicate with and manage others, as well as motivate them.

My previous coursework includes courses in B2B Marketing, Buyer Behavior, Advertising and Promotions, and Operations Management.

[Jonathan Mead]

That sounds more like it! JK

I think what Steve was trying to say is that if marketing is for you, you should be having to turn away jobs. Hence, if you're good enough at marketing, getting a job should be a cinch, because marketing really starts with self-marketing. Hope all the best for you.

[Steve Pavlina]

Being analytical is great. That's an asset for sure. But the first and most important place to apply it is to yourself. You're the product. What's your current analysis of the strengths and weaknesses of the product?

People will hire you when they can relate your strengths to their business goals.

For example, I have a friend who works in business development (essentially a marketing/sales job). He has no trouble getting good job offers. His strength is that he's really good at connecting with people. He has a lot of skills, but that's his key strength. He's very easy to talk to on the phone. He gets hired easily, partly because he brings a ton of valuable connections with him. He's a walking business asset. Consequently, he can always use his connections to land himself a new job.

If your key strength is your analytical ability, then your task is basically to analyze your way into a new job, just as my friend connects himself into new jobs.

To analyze yourself into a new job, you have to assess the situation from a potential employer's perspective. How can you connect the dots between their business goals and your capabilities?

The basic function of marketing in any business is to generate sales. While marketing can be very indirect, the bottom line is that it has to bring in the customers and the cash. If you can prove to a business owner you can make him/her more money, you've got a great shot of getting hired.

No employer wants to "give" anyone a job. They are looking to get something from you. Showing that you have a college degree is not enough to convince most people. There are too many people with degrees who can't do the work... who can't bring cash in the door.

If someone sent me a marketing job resume, I'd trash it. But if they sent me a list of 50 ideas for how to they believed they could increase my income, asking to implement some of those ideas for a performance-based commission, now that person has my attention. It's all about connecting marketing to the bottom line.

It's often unproductive to try to get a job with a standard resume/interview process. Everyone does that, so it doesn't differentiate you if you do it too.

[Amandaaa]

introspective:

Why don't you figure out what kind of company you want to work for, and then apply for a marketing job within that organization?

You can't wait around to see what jobs will come to you. You have to decide who you want to work for, find out where there's an opening, and go where the jobs are.



(Oh, wait, you said that you want to work in sports marketing. ...What kind of sports? Football? Baseball? Basketball? Who are you a fan of? Why don't you pick a sport, go through the list of professional teams, and find all of the contact info for each recruiting division. ...Or look at the Job Opportunities section of each website for each company.)

Sometimes it's better to go through the backdoor. You have to make an effort to network and talk to people and get your name out there... and then eventually, someone will know someone who knows someone who knows of an open position. ...And sometimes, you have to create your own job. That's something my dad taught me a long time ago. You have to know what you can offer a company, and then present yourself as a product that they need to buy. Tell them what you could do for the company, and how they would benefit by having you work for them. Be creative. Promote yourself. Sell yourself.

Society puts this stupid idea in your head that if you get a degree, a job will be handed to you.

^ Regardless of whether or not you have a degree, you have to be persistent and proactive. Nothing is "handed to you." You have to find it and go after it.

Keep your eyes open, keep looking, and don't give up.

[skinnyninja]

I am just 2 classes away from my Bachelor's degree in Marketing.

I have no idea about what kind of job I might eventually do, but I am excited about some of the opportunities that come with authoring my own website.

Just this week, I sold my first eBook (that I wrote), and I also got an offer to do some freelance writing for another website.

I am writing articles every day that build up my personal brand a little bit more in the online world.

I am going to reach out and help thousands of people in this world through marketing and the online world. The "how" is not so important, I am figuring that out as I go along. I am encountering a decent level of success already with my website.

Marketing is exciting to me....it is my passion. I'm already connecting with over 3,000 people each month through my first website with no paid traffic. And these people are looking to me for help. They want answers. This is awesome! This is a huge opportunity. This is marketing in action.

[introspective1]

Originally Posted by Amandaaa

introspective:

Why don't you figure out what kind of company you want to work for, and then apply for a marketing job within that organization?

You can't wait around to see what jobs will come to you. You have to decide who you want to work for, find out where there's an opening, and go where the jobs are.



(Oh, wait, you said that you want to work in sports marketing. ...What kind of sports? Football? Baseball? Basketball? Who are you a fan of? Why don't you pick a sport, go through the list of professional teams, and find all of the contact info for each recruiting division. ...Or look at the Job Opportunities section of each website for each company.)

Sometimes it's better to go through the backdoor. You have to make an effort to network and talk to people and get your name out there... and then eventually, someone will know someone who knows someone who knows of an open position. ...And sometimes, you have to create your own job. That's something my dad taught me a long time ago. You have to know what you can offer a company, and then present yourself as a product that they need to buy. Tell them what you could do for the company, and how they would benefit by having you work for them. Be creative. Promote yourself. Sell yourself.

Thanks, Amanda! I am trying to get a job, preferably, with a football team or an agency that works with football teams, since that is my favorite sport. The only problem is trying to "play up" the things I have done in past jobs, (i.e., describing items to customers to increase interest, being a self-starter, being able to multi-task), so that it looks like I can meet the "experience" requirement...every job wants someone with that 3-5 years experience, but I wont give up!!!




^ Regardless of whether or not you have a degree, you have to be persistent and proactive. Nothing is "handed to you." You have to find it and go after it.

Keep your eyes open, keep looking, and don't give up.

[Amandaaa]

Yeah, the "experience" issue kind of sucks... especially when you don't have any!

I guess you just have to rely more on your current strengths and your "potential." All you have to do is convince one person to give you a shot, and then you can start building up that experience section.


I hope you find something soon..!



(Are you willing to leave Indiana...?)

[starkey]

Originally Posted by Pegasus

I graduated (second time around) late October 2007 and just now finally got a job in my field. I was surprised. Had given up on graphic design due to lack of talent and was trying to get into writing and editing instead. After two big job rejections in a row, a serendipitous event occurred, which led to a contact (a woman I hadn't seen in over 20 years!) who basically handed me a job. This week has been my first week of the new job. It's a mile from where I live. Am making double what I did as a temporary worker. Still adjusting and slightly overwhelmed.



...

Congratulations on the great new job, Pegasus. And thank you introspective1 and everyone else, as this has been a very interesting thread for me.

[Steve Pavlina]

@skinnyninja: Awesome! You're taking great steps to differentiate yourself. Building a following proves you can market yourself. I'd be very wary of hiring a marketer who didn't grasp the basics of personal branding as you do.

You'll probably command a bigger paycheck as well.

The odd thing about personal branding is that it exists in other people's minds, so you have some control over it but not total control. Often though you can find out how other people are already branding you in their minds and turn it into an advantage.

For example, when I started StevePavlina.com, I couldn't promote myself like some kind of Dr. Steve therapist with a Ph.D in psychology or a slew of published books or academic credentials. I couldn't compete on those terms, nor would I want to. My degrees are in Computer Science and Math, and I used to be a game programmer. Instead of trying to hide that and pretend to be something I'm not, I turned those truths into assets. It means I can offer a fresh perspective.

Many self-help fans are middle-aged women. I reach a demographic that's very unusual, 65% male with 50% in their 20s and 10% under 20.

[Michelle]

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

Often though you can find out how other people are already branding you in their minds and turn it into an advantage.

Would you write some more about this? How do you go about finding how people brand you? What are the right questions to ask?

I find this all very exciting!

[Brutha]

Would you write some more about this? How do you go about finding how people brand you? What are the right questions to ask?

1. Type your name into google. Writing commands under your real name to marketing blogs and writing amazon reviews for marketing classics might help you in that department (but you should write high quality).
2. Ask a few people you know to name three adjectives that describe you.

[Jonathan Mead]

I think this is a great thread and it definitely offered me some new insights into personal branding. Marketing is a big part of your business, paired with the content or services your provide.

Steve, did you ever consider that it was "meant to be" that you were a computer programmer/game developer before you got into personal development. Sometimes it seems almost eerily strange how perfectly the analogies you are able to provide with computer gaming to real life personal growth are. A good example I think is when you spoke about how life can be related to a game where you control your avatar.

[teatree]

Originally Posted by introspective1

I think I need to try to find another way of entering the field but people say that if I dont get a job directly in marketing then I am wasting my degree. I dont know what else to do..I need a decent job and I cant work retail forever (although, I enjoy it sometimes). I didnt go to school to struggle like this.

First of all, all of life is a struggle. Even if you get the job of your dreams, there will be challenges that cause you to struggle mightily. Even if you became President or Prime Minister, you would find yourself having to struggle. So put the "easy life" myth right out of your head.

Secondly, your instinct about entering your field in a different way is correct. This is how most people break into their professions. Make a list of the marketing firms you wish to work for, and try to take any job going in these companies, even if it's just to do filing. If they ask you why you are taking a lowly job, just say that you are willing to work your way up from the bottom. Once you are in these firms, do the best job you can, make as many friends as possible, network and keep your ear to the ground for opportunities. If an opening comes up in a higher position than the one you are in, apply for it.

careers are made in a series of steps. Anyone who tells you that you can get the job you want "directly" in one step, is fibbing.

[Ali from The Office Diet]

Introspective,

I have a degree in English Literature (from Cambridge University) and my goal is to "make it" as a writer. However, a year and a half after graduating, I'm working in technical support for a small software company making the most boring software in the world ;-) (For local goverment to track their efficiency in deliverying services.)

But, I don't feel that I'm failing, or that I'm not usign my degree! I've taken a number of steps to work towards my goals:
- I get up at 6am and spend an hour writing before work
- I have negotiated with my boss to take Tuesdays off as unpaid leave, so that I can blog and write fiction
- I'm taking a short story correspondance course
- I've been actively submitting my writing to numerous markets (and I've had some nice feedback though very little published yet.)
- I entered two short story competitions every month last year, and won a 2nd prize, a 3rd prize and had two pieces short-listed.
- I launched a blog/website (The Office Diet) on 1st Jan this year, to develop my non-fiction writing skills and to take the first steps towards generating some passive income
- This directly led to a paid writing gig for Diet Blog; I'm now a staff writer there

And I think most importantly, I describe myself as a writer/blogger, not just a "tech support monkey".

Can you do what SkinnyNinja has done, and launch a website to try out your marketing knowledge in the real world?

Or can you find sites which need your marketing expertise and help them out for free -- that could lead to a heck of a lot of good-will, experience, and very useful word-of-mouth promotion. (If you've got any words of wisdom for me with The Office Diet, I've love to hear them!)

Good luck, and like Steve says, if you do a great job of marketing YOURSELF, you won't have to look for the job -- it'll come to you.

Best,

Ali