What are the odds of earning a living on the internet?

[lhflax]

We all know that some people earn millions as basketball stars. Yet, few of us can realistically hope to earn a living that way. Why? We lack the natural gifts? We lack the work ethic? Probably. Mostly, the odds are against us.

Similarly, we all know that some people are earning a good living on the internet. A few companies are making millions. However, what are my odds? I have a college degree. I know a few programming languages including C++ and HTML. What are my odds of earning a good living on the internet and how do I go about it?

I have been trying to find a way to supplement my income for 10 years. Most of what I have learned is that there are a lot of very slick con artists out there. Also, there appears to be a great deal of money to be made in selling service to people like me... would be entrepreneurs.

Have any of you had any luck earning a living on the internet? If so, how do you recommend people like me get started?

Thanks so much for your thoughts.

Linda

[Steve Pavlina]

I'd recommend reading this first -- it may challenge your thinking about odds:
What Are the Odds of Becoming a Black Belt?

[lhflax]

Hi Steve,

Thanks for putting together this great web site and forum. I really appreciate your refreshing honesty and optimism.

I read your article that you referenced and agree with you completely. Most statistics don't take into account genuine commitment and work ethic. Nevertheless, I have taken too many courses on statistics to ignore that life and opportunity are all about odds. There are things we can do to stack the odds in our favor just as there are things we can do to stack the odds against us.

Clearly, the inclusion of dabblers, those that make half hearted attempts are going to skew the odds significantly. Nevertheless, whether you include dabblers or not, it would be very interesting to know what the odds for success are. If the odds for success are one in 20 million, then we might be less inclined to invest our life savings and our time. If the odds are one in one hundred, then I have good reason to believe that my commitment and work ethic is likely to make me one of the few who succeed.

I have already purchased the SBI product. They have an exciting product and a remarkable money back guarantee. I am committed to trying my best. I am just reaching out to ask others to let me know what has worked for them. As always, I value and appreciate your advice.

Thanks for your help,
Linda

[Brutha]

Nobody knows who the web will look like in five years.

In the internet there are a lot of different ways to make money with varing risk/win ratios.
It doesn't really make them to bunch them all together into one pile. Making a bit of money on ebay or elance isn't that hard. One the other hand it is very difficult to make there a lot of money. Low risk means mostly also low returns.

[GoalSettingCollege]

Linda, I think Steve's post has answered to your question. There's no such thing as odds. It's only a choice. I truly agree and I firmly attest.

I know I may sound like a parrot echoing what Steve has probably said but I've tried many different online business models to know that what he personally said is true. Every models have their successes AND failures. But 1 bottom-line never changed. How eager and committed are you in making it a success.

If you're, success is never an odd. It's a definite.

Cheers,
Ellesse

[Frans]

Also, there appears to be a great deal of money to be made in selling service to people like me... would be entrepreneurs.

You can learn from my story.

Two years ago, I offered an SBI-like Web site package exclusively for Internet marketers.

The package (a full-fledged Web site with unlimited autoresponders, mailinglists etc) was developed to make money for its owner.
The price was $24.95/month.
The most interesting part of our package was our unique affiliate program with 4 compensation levels, so that a customer could earn his $24.95 back with only 1 referral...

Two problems killed this project:

1. Problems with my business partner (from a third-world country). He would take care of customer support, but I found out that he couldn't have access to the Internet all the time (poor local infrastructure).
While we had agreed to split the earnings in two equal parts, he suddenly wanted some money upfront. To make a long story short: my partner left the project before it even was launched, so I had to take care of all technical stuff, plus I had to take care of customer service as well.

2. It appeared that most customers were only would-be Internet marketers: despite my warnings about spamming, they spammed via email and forums, they clicked their own Adsense ads, you name it. They ruined their own business because they were totally ignorant about doing business.

I am sure that if I would have had a reliable partner with a solid knowledge of marketing to support our customers, this project would still exist now.

[Lucas]

Originally Posted by lhflax

We all know that some people earn millions as basketball stars. Yet, few of us can realistically hope to earn a living that way. Why? We lack the natural gifts? We lack the work ethic? Probably. Mostly, the odds are against us.

Similarly, we all know that some people are earning a good living on the internet. A few companies are making millions. However, what are my odds? I have a college degree. I know a few programming languages including C++ and HTML. What are my odds of earning a good living on the internet and how do I go about it?

I have been trying to find a way to supplement my income for 10 years. Most of what I have learned is that there are a lot of very slick con artists out there. Also, there appears to be a great deal of money to be made in selling service to people like me... would be entrepreneurs.

Have any of you had any luck earning a living on the internet? If so, how do you recommend people like me get started?

Thanks so much for your thoughts.

Linda

Have you decided at every moment to be int the percentage that you wish to be, or have you resigned yourself to the majority?

[rene_stpierre]

I believe odds have nothing to do with someone's success in Internet Marketing (and in anything else).

To me, the main factors for success are:

(1) Passion: To really succeed at anything, one must be passionate about what he/she does. Passion makes the endeavour fun and exciting, not "work" or a "job". Michael Jordan, Tiger Woods, Donald Trump, Steve Pavlina and others are passionate about what they do. That's one of the main reasons why they have succeeded.

(2) Dedication: One must have the firm intention to succeed when starting an endeavour and must be willing to make the necessary sacrifices. For example, instead of watching TV every night, read or learn new stuff related to the endeavour. Most successful athletes spend a lot of time practicing (very often, more time than anyone else). Practice makes perfect ... this requires dedication.

(3) Perseverance: It takes a long time to succeed at anything (I have found that Internet Maketing is no different). Without perseverance, one will abandon easily when faced with obstacles. This is tied to "mindset". If the mind is set on "trying", any little hurdle or obstacle will be difficult to overcome. There will always be reasons why it did not work. On the other hand, if the mind is set on "succeed", success will be the only acceptable outcome and one will go at it until this state has been reached.

(4) Resourcefullness: Success cannot be reached alone. One must know how to find information, tools, support required to speed-up the learning curve and succeed. In his book "The Success Principles", Jack Canfield says "Success Leaves Clues". In order to succeed, one must have the ability to find the clues that will allow him/her to succeed.

With regards to Internet Marketing ... I was introduced to this "world" in September 2006 when I saw an add about people making over $5,000/month on the web. It turned-out to be a Direct Marketing opportunity (PAS). I got in, paid my $4,000 fee and ... 2 weeks later, the SEC shut-it down. Wow! What an introduction to the IM world!

However, in those 2 weeks and those that followed, I saw that it is possible to make a lot of money on-line. I saw dozens of examples. Most of these successful people started from scrtach and are now making millions per year.

So, despite my first experience in IM, I'm still in but I am a lot more carefull. I stay away from Direct Marketing opportunities, at least, until I become an expert marketer. Once I reach that state, I will decide if I go back to direct Marketing or if I launch my own websites and products. Right now, I am learning how to profitably advertise with AdWords, keeping my limited budget in control.

My mind is set on Success. I know I will reach my goals!

Good Luck to you.
René

[teatree]

Originally Posted by lhflax

I have a college degree. I know a few programming languages including C++ and HTML. What are my odds of earning a good living on the internet and how do I go about it?

There are some online freelance marketplaces such as GetAFreelancer and Guru.

Typically what you have to do is bid for jobs saying how much you want to be paid and when you can deliver the job for. The pay tends to be very low for article writing, but is not bad for the coding work. Some people report quite a bit of success with these sites, and you do see some employers start to ask for specific people for their next jobs. You do need to realize that you are competing with freelancers from across the globe for the jobs because of the nature of online freelance work.

The thing to do is try it and see. If if works out great, but if it doesn't cross it off your list and try something else!

[Kiba]

Typical odd doesn' matter because the luckiest person position oneself to be lucky again and again.

You need only your wits and courage to succeed.


Disclaimer: I am an indie game developer who make very little money, not enough to support myself.

[rebelwithacause]

Hi Linda,

I whole heartedly agree with the campaign against the odds.
Odds really have nothing to do with intentions, and good ol' hard work...in most cases.

I'll agree that if I am 5'2 and want to play pro basketball...no matter how hard I want it, they may be
tough...but regarding business especially, I believe
and have proven that you can do anything that you
set your intention and focus on...

From my experience over the last 20 years, and more recently on the internet...you just have to do your homework in whatever niche or area of passion/interest
that you have.

While there may be some people out there who don't have your best interest at heart, there are many, many very authentic and caring people that offer great service and content.

One of the best test's to use are is are they only hiding behind a web site, or do you see their pictures, audios, videos, emails and even phone numbers to call...

That's sign number one for me..is people who put their selves out there without hiding.

I made a fantastic living on the internet, and I know the people that I trust, and the ones that I wouldn't want to work with or offer my money to.

Look for people that offer you good quality content, and information for free...whether it's about their product, or a subject...

It's all about building relationships and gaining trust...and that is done via being of service...just like Steve.


Anyway, back to how to make money on the net.

I know a lot of people talk about elance and eguru etc...to pick up freelance gigs...but that is just what t hey are...gigs, and one time payment.

the internet is set up to create passive streams of income.

You can either create your own product, do affiliate marketing and market existing products, or plug in to
a home business.

all you need to learn are some basic marketing techniques which aren't that hard really...they have a small learning curve, but pretty simple really...and you go from there.

There are plenty of reputable places to learn...one great place to learn about web 2.0 marketing for free is the thirty day challenge, and another low cost is the wealthy affiliate which is around $30 a month.

It's best to find a community or a team so you aren't left completely alone to figure everything out on your own...

But I wil tell you this, if you decide that you want to be able to make a living online...it's the best way, in my humble opinion to do it...

Because you can set things up once, and they continue to make sales for you for a long time to come.

For instance, for my home biz, I set up a hub page and a squidoo page that gives genuine, high quality content...

I set that up once, and it delivers over and over every single day...with no opt ins and sales...at $1K a pop.

That's why I tend to like home businesses more than affiliate marketing and adsense etc...the higher price points really kick in...

and the reality is that it takes the same amount of time and marketing to sell a high price ticket as it does to make $10 commissions on an ebook...

so I like to market the high price, super high quality products within reputable and honorable home businesses...

You can also monetize blogs...just look at Steve's model, he's not even selling anything...just straight forward, quality content...and because of that, he gets tremendous traffic...and once you have that kind of traffic and audience that are your fans...because of the great service you offer...you can add adsense, affiliate products, Joint Ventures etc... to the mix...


So definitely there are many great ways and mentors/teachers to team up with...make it an intention
and a study...and you will be able to make a great living in no time...it really does work!

Take care,

[1000feet]

That's actually all I'm doing right now I guess you can look at it two ways - earning a living on the internet and getting rich on the internet. In both cases the important thing is that you don't need to be close to 7 feet tall and have fast reflexes (which are things you can't control). If you help other people and they like you all you need is to scale things until you hit the right level. I believe the internet is a natural environment for making money because it connects you to more people and the tools available let you help them more.

To earn a living all you have to do is develop information-based skills to the point where they're valuable to others and then find people who will pay for your time one by one. As mentioned above there's several freelancing sites where you can do this. It takes some persistence (anyone who's selling things has to be ok with the majority of people they approach turning them down or ignoring them), but even with no work samples to show you can get a few starter projects at lower prices thanks to the escrow features of freelancing sites. Once you've proven that you know how to do things and you create a pleasant experience for the people you work with you'll get an increasing amount of work and you'll be able to charge more.

Getting rich beyond that is another matter altogether - essentially you need to serve a lot more people (usually doing less for each person, but at nearly no cost to you). The great thing is that technology naturally empowers you to do this - if you're a musician, the cost of transmitting your music to one more person who enjoys it is almost too small to measure. Any other intellectual property can spread rapidly as well. Another approach is to figure out some process that people will pay for and set it up to happen automatically - using the technology behind the internet to get paid again and again for work you don't have to do again and again.

Still another way is to use the many communication options on the internet to build popularity and trust among others - when you have enough, it can be hard not to make money. A recent post that's been circulating in the blog world is about twitter (a cross between blogs and instant messaging). The point is that if twitter gets to 100 million people using it regularly, it will be almost impossible not to turn it into a profitable business. This approach of getting users first and money second has led to a lot of big failures, but on an individual scale it's a lot easier to do because you can start talking without having to lease an office and hire people.

A lot of people chase this approach because of how easy it is to start talking but remember that it takes effort, time, a lot of thought, and possibly a bit of luck to do it well enough to succeed. You have to do something that's interesting to many others, not just yourself. It helps to do this if you choose something that really inspires you and shows your unique viewpoint - which usually means taking some risks. As an example, I've started a few sites such as blogs and basic internet marketing attempts - luckily I didn't spend much beyond registering the domains because they haven't done well and I haven't been inspired by them. I was trying to force myself into something unnatural. Now I have a new blog that really ties together a lot of things that I'm interested in and it's actually fun to write a month's worth of posts in a few days because they're an expression of my own life plan. I'm in it more for the exchange of ideas than as a way to make money, but the traffic numbers in the first few days have exceeded my expectations so it might contribute to my income eventually.

When you look at it the odds of earning a living on the internet are very good if you go about it intelligently.

[rebelwithacause]

Very Nice Post.

Just like you stated as well as what I stated above...it all comes down to service, value, and contribution.

And there was just recently a big buzz that came about from Rich Schefren talking about the attention deficit of people online now because they are being bombarded with so many ads and information.

There is a shift that has taken place, and in my opinion it is for the better, that has put the control back into the consumer's hands.

With the outbreak of web 2.0 and social networking, and social bookmarking sites, people talk...anyone out there trying to do the "old school" way of spamming, or hiding behind offers, isn't going to be successful.

With Blogs, Youtube, and sites like facebook and myspace, people talk, and they want to do business with their friends and people that they know, or at the very least, feel that they know...

That's where all this new technology comes in...it gives a real voice to people, and it puts a face out there as well...so people can come and check out your content and value without being threatened.

The world of marketing and online business has changed, and I personally like it a lot better...

If you are a person that is "real", has high integrity, knowledge and expertise to share to help people in whatever niche or niches that you choose...or what you are passionate about, you will simply attract people who like your words, your experience, your knowledge, and your energy...

It all goes back to the law of attraction, and it's the same for marketing...people want to do business with people that they relate to, and like...

spammers will attract spammers, high integrity people will attract other high integrity relationships, prosepcts, customers, and friends...

All I know is that the internet is pretty darn easy to make a living on, and making a great living is pretty easy to...just serve more people, and offer quality products, info, content, home businesses etc. ..that you yourself are using or have used and KNOW that they are good, solid, quality products...that will benefit the lives of others...basically put others first, and the money will always follow...

Learning the basics in how to get started is just a matter of deciding...and understanding what's involved...

The market/niche
The product(s)
Driving Traffic
Providing quality content and value
Creating an offer
Building a list
Converting
Sales

There are many vehicles and tools to plug into of which many have been mentioned here...

All the best,

[beel]

anyone can make money on the internet, it's just a matter of putting your mind to it, trying different things, and finding what works best for you.

i'm 28 and have never had a "real" job, nor do i ever plan to. i dropped out of university when i realized what i was learning was not helping me fulfill my goals. i have supported myself solely through making money on the internet using a variety of methods for the past 10 years. none involving slick con artist gimmicks or taking advantage of others, but generally providing some sort of value to the end user. some make me more money than others, and some are more time consuming than others, but i constantly evolve from what i learn through practice. i wouldn't consider myself a millionaire (though i've made over a million in a year), but i am able to sustain the lifestyle i want, owning a nice home, traveling as i please, and buying the luxury goods i desire. i make more money when i work more and less when i don't. i think the most important thing is that i choose areas that are of interest to me and thus i am happy to do the work.

[rebelwithacause]

I agree Beel,

I did the same thing...Just never found the idea of a job as an acceptable way to live my life...

There are so many ways to do things and make all the money you want...and like you said, some are easier, some are more challenging...and time consuming as well...

All I know is that if you want to do it, then you just decide to do it, and that intention along with action will lead you to the next step...

There are plenty of real opportunities out there, and real mentors to partner up with and learn from...

I think sometimes that people think that everything is too good to be true...when it's just a defense or a belief that isn't serving any more...because if you look around, people are making money all the time with legitamate businesses and products...

Even today I saw a basic little way to set up a review blog for a product, do your research on the product, at the end of your review, you just put in an affiliate link...and you can get sales...

that particular way is not a make a million dollars strategy...but there are so many ways...

Everything goes back to that idea of adding service and value to others...if you come from the right place, it all falls into place...

[TheIronStar]

Originally Posted by Lucas

Have you decided at every moment to be int the percentage that you wish to be, or have you resigned yourself to the majority?

Ask the many people in the world who bought into the dream of pro basketball as their ticket to socioeconomic ascent and failed. Plenty of men who work quite hard in that field...and simply still do not quite reach high enough in the competition, despite having "decided" to be in the top x% of the planet.

Originally Posted by Steve Pavlina

I'd recommend reading this first -- it may challenge your thinking about odds:
What Are the Odds of Becoming a Black Belt?

This is a poor analogy. Earning a black belt is merely obtaining a certification, no different from saying "What are the odds of passing junior high school general science class?". That's quite different from the matter of getting a well-paying contract doing some sort of well-paying form of research professionally.

Successfully arranging to be paid serious money for doing martial arts is quite a distinct matter from getting an increasingly meaningless belt. There's no shortage of never-ascended would-be UFC winners, never-ascended would-be martial arts movie superstars, and so on, many of whom had quite nontrivial work ethics.

[yougetajob]

Do you want to know how to make money on the web? Gather round, listen really close. I mean REALLY listen. Are you ready? Ok, here it is:

Tell OTHER people how to make money on the web.

This is how most people making money on the web - make money on the web. By telling other people how to make money on the web.

Do you see what is going on?

Just look at the sigs of members here. See a theme?

Just parrots parroting parrots, parroting parrots.

People eat this **** up.

Lol, "What do you do sir?"

"Why I have a succesful blog where I tell people how make money writing blogs."

"Interesting, what qualifies you to give this kind of advice?"

"Well, I have a succesful blog."

"Oh, so you have two blogs then?"

"No, no. Just the one."

"So, you're telling people how to create succesful blogs, and you know how to create succesful blogs, because you have blog...that tells people how to create succesful blogs?!!!"

Unfortunately, there's way too many people doing this, and very few people are making money.

Maybe there is another way this same strategy can be employed?

Hmmmm.


This, despite what he will say, is one of the key factors to the success of Steve Pavlina himself. Sure he gives a lot of good advice. I've learned a few things from him. But when you get down to it, Steve Pavlina's success is almost entirely derived from telling other people how to be successful.

Just look at how succesful he was before he started telling people how to be succesful. Not nearly as successful as he is now huh?

Surely this has been brought up here before, but it can't hurt to bring it up again.

[1000feet]

yougetajob - you have a great point there; I've explored the internet marketing world a bit and at times it seems to be filled with people practicing internet marketing techniques and awful 40-page sales letters.

The problem isn't that the only way to make money on the internet is to teach others; it's that people who are actually making money with real services don't have time to write new sales letters for their internet marketing course every day :P

For example, I enjoy reading Internet Business Blog - by Yaro Starak - he does teach people how to make money blogging now but he also owned a proofreading business until last year and it looks like he'll be involved in some other interesting businesses in the future.

[beel]

Originally Posted by yougetajob

Do you want to know how to make money on the web? Gather round, listen really close. I mean REALLY listen. Are you ready? Ok, here it is:

Tell OTHER people how to make money on the web.

This is how most people making money on the web - make money on the web. By telling other people how to make money on the web.

Do you see what is going on?

Just look at the sigs of members here. See a theme?

Just parrots parroting parrots, parroting parrots.

People eat this **** up.

Lol, "What do you do sir?"

"Why I have a succesful blog where I tell people how make money writing blogs."

"Interesting, what qualifies you to give this kind of advice?"

"Well, I have a succesful blog."

"Oh, so you have two blogs then?"

"No, no. Just the one."

"So, you're telling people how to create succesful blogs, and you know how to create succesful blogs, because you have blog...that tells people how to create succesful blogs?!!!"

Unfortunately, there's way too many people doing this, and very few people are making money.

Maybe there is another way this same strategy can be employed?

Hmmmm.


This, despite what he will say, is one of the key factors to the success of Steve Pavlina himself. Sure he gives a lot of good advice. I've learned a few things from him. But when you get down to it, Steve Pavlina's success is almost entirely derived from telling other people how to be successful.

Just look at how succesful he was before he started telling people how to be succesful. Not nearly as successful as he is now huh?

Surely this has been brought up here before, but it can't hurt to bring it up again.

i don't agree at all. i believe you think this because those are the people that TALK about it! most people making real money on the internet are NOT talking about it or sharing that info publicly. they aren't going to tell you their secrets or formula so they can have competition! i have never made money telling people how to make money on the internet, yet i've been making money online for over a decade. with that said, i have had dozens of people in my real life urge me to do so and teach them how to make money online. people always tell me i should start a blog, just to talk about myself and my life, what i do, but this is not something i want to do. for me, it's not something i am interested in, i have other interests. i'm sure i could offer some advice and help people out, but MOST don't listen or take the initiative so it's not fulfilling - any advice i've ever given was free and verbally face to face and in most cases, those people never did anything with the advice they so adamantly requested. everyone wants the golden ticket so there is a market for that type of information, but that does not mean there are not hundreds or thousands of other real markets that generate revenue. in fact, there are much larger markets that appeal to many more people than that of making money online. in my real life, i know a handful of people that make very real money on the internet and not a one of them make that money telling others how to make money. again, i adamantly disagree with your post and your logic.