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joey m · 05-22-2007, 10:23 PM

Congratulations Escapee!!! That is the first good post I have seen from you. All science -- and from actual legitimate sources. Not to sound too condescending, but I am proud of you! So now, maybe we can have an intelligent discussion.

I believe there are some good reasons why some studies are coming back negatively towards fruits and vegetables. Now, the vast majority still show very positive correlations between fruit and vegetable intake and lower incidence of major disease like cancer, heart disease, diabetes etc.

But, why do some show only marginal benefits? Well, the major fiber studies done years ago showing no major correlation with reduced colon cancer were very flawed studies. Instead of testing for fiber naturally found in vegetation, it used supplemental fiber which has none of the phytochemical benefits that actual vegetation has. It is not surprising that fiber on its own had limited impact -- but we could expect actual fruits to have significant impact. For instance, refer to the following studies:

Anticancer Res. 2007 Mar-Apr;27(2):937-48.

Nutr Cancer. 2006;54(1):69-78.

Clin Cancer Res. 2007 Jan 1;13(1):350-5.

J Nutr. 2007 Jan;137(1):31-6.

Here are 2 different articles analyzing the above study:

Fruit May Sway Colon Cancer Risk

Eating fruit may prevent colon cancer - Cancer - MSNBC.com

For the other studies which actually involved an increased intake of fruits and vegetables, that increase was likely too minimal to have a drastic effect. Let me explain why I say this:

Essentially, what we eat in childhood has more of an impact on disease than what we eat later in life. Accordingly, small changes in what we eat early in our lives have a far greater effect than small changes later in life. To have the same protective benefits later in life, we need to more radically change our diets. So, it does not surprise me that adding in a few more fruits and vegetables later in life does not drastically alter certain cancer risks. But a more dramatic change (which was not what was done in the studies you pointed out), should show greater differences.

Here are some other good studies done on disease and fruit and vegetable intake:

The effect of fruit and vegetable intake on risk for coronary heart disease, Joshipura KJ, Hu FB, Manson JE, et al., Ann Intern Med 2001;134:1106-1114

Fruit and vegetable intake in relation to risk of ischemic stroke, Joshipura KJ, Ascherio A, Manson JE, et al., JAMA 1999;282:1233-1239

Diet and cancer prevention, Greenwald P, Clifford CK, Milner JA., Eur J Cancer 2001;37:948-965

Food for thought.

Best,
Joey

05-22-2007, 10:23 PM	#53 (permalink)
joey m Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 113	Congratulations Escapee!!! That is the first good post I have seen from you. All science -- and from actual legitimate sources. Not to sound too condescending, but I am proud of you! So now, maybe we can have an intelligent discussion. I believe there are some good reasons why some studies are coming back negatively towards fruits and vegetables. Now, the vast majority still show very positive correlations between fruit and vegetable intake and lower incidence of major disease like cancer, heart disease, diabetes etc. But, why do some show only marginal benefits? Well, the major fiber studies done years ago showing no major correlation with reduced colon cancer were very flawed studies. Instead of testing for fiber naturally found in vegetation, it used supplemental fiber which has none of the phytochemical benefits that actual vegetation has. It is not surprising that fiber on its own had limited impact -- but we could expect actual fruits to have significant impact. For instance, refer to the following studies: Anticancer Res. 2007 Mar-Apr;27(2):937-48. Nutr Cancer. 2006;54(1):69-78. Clin Cancer Res. 2007 Jan 1;13(1):350-5. J Nutr. 2007 Jan;137(1):31-6. Here are 2 different articles analyzing the above study: Fruit May Sway Colon Cancer Risk Eating fruit may prevent colon cancer - Cancer - MSNBC.com For the other studies which actually involved an increased intake of fruits and vegetables, that increase was likely too minimal to have a drastic effect. Let me explain why I say this: Essentially, what we eat in childhood has more of an impact on disease than what we eat later in life. Accordingly, small changes in what we eat early in our lives have a far greater effect than small changes later in life. To have the same protective benefits later in life, we need to more radically change our diets. So, it does not surprise me that adding in a few more fruits and vegetables later in life does not drastically alter certain cancer risks. But a more dramatic change (which was not what was done in the studies you pointed out), should show greater differences. Here are some other good studies done on disease and fruit and vegetable intake: The effect of fruit and vegetable intake on risk for coronary heart disease, Joshipura KJ, Hu FB, Manson JE, et al., Ann Intern Med 2001;134:1106-1114 Fruit and vegetable intake in relation to risk of ischemic stroke, Joshipura KJ, Ascherio A, Manson JE, et al., JAMA 1999;282:1233-1239 Diet and cancer prevention, Greenwald P, Clifford CK, Milner JA., Eur J Cancer 2001;37:948-965 Food for thought. Best, Joey