Quote:
Originally Posted by Narz  Hi Dor. If John Adams said that, screw 'em! |
how can we have a rational discussion when you come to such quick judgements? let go back to your franklin quote, which i counter with this from poor richard:
How many observe Christ's birthday! How few, his precepts! O! 'tis easier to
keep holidays than commandments.
i could find a bunch of others supporting the belief that franklin believed in God and was in his own way religous - i have read two bios of him (though some time ago) and his autobio.
I would never try to prove that he was super-religoius or evangelic, or fudmental - that would be disingenuous, and it is equally disingenuous to take one quote and try to 'prove' he was anti religious.
And this is crux of the problem I have with views that you and AV are espousing - you're setting up false comparisons, false conflict between what you perceive as religion 'vs' science or reason. It seems to me (correct me if i am wrong ) you have a 'theory' or ideology that smart or rational people aren't religious and then go about shaping your world view to fit that idea.
We all use our theories and ideas to look at the world, but as st. augustine suggested
when reason conflicts or reality lead you to conflict with the belief, (such as assuming the earth was flat from reading the bible) than change that belief. This from a saint and deeply religious man - my point is it's much more complex than you think and not an either or split.
try slushing that view around for awhile, see what you come up with. I 'used' to think a lot like you guys, I don't any more, as read and thought more....
as to your question it's an interesting one, one i think about from time to time, and has certainly been discussed in theology among christians -what about the man who lived a pious life on a remote island but never heard of Christ.
To me, as i have said in other threads, religioun is a 'wisdom of the ages' cultural framework which to explore spirtuatlity as opposed to a fast food pick and chose 'roll your own' approach ' within that wisdom of the ages, might be things you don't understand yet-- and in a pick and chose' you would reject out of hand, if that makes any sense