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Originally Posted by john6630@hotmail.com I need to process your excellent comments a piece at a time..to much to chew and swallow all at once... |
Ego says thank you for the compliment
I'll gladly talk more about it if you form more comments after you're done chewing
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Originally Posted by john6630@hotmail.com Concerning the "out there" vs the "in here" question [...] "reality" does not manifest until an observer (aka me) collapses the wave function via my observation ("awareness"?)...and that sounds ok also...so the idea of my subjective reality is my ability to collapse the wave functions as my intention and awareness dictate...but doesnt it still rely on the pre-existence of the wave functions...aren't they the "out there" that I am attacting (or better, collapsing) |
Quantum physics, waves becoming particles when observed and all that, is a fine belief (if one is not into occam's razor

), and it does fit the words 'subjective reality' (in that here MOST of reality is subject to awareness) but not the philosophy that our Steve is talking about (or so I think, I'm not 100% sure how SteveP looks at this level of it).
All that you are talking about here build on the idea of objective reality. The objective reality foundation is very thin here, but still ruling. I have no qualms about you believing that, but if we want to get into Steve's god-conciousness subR (SPsubR) -
You are saying the waves exist independent of awareness. SPsubR says nothing exists outside The One and only Conciousness (1C). Actually, 'nothing' is a concept that only exists inside 1C too. Possibilities only exist inside 1C, too. If 1C doesn't believe in wave functions, they don't exist. If 1C never comes up with the idea of wave functions, there's not even the possibility that they exist.
When you dream (I love that analogy, it's so perfect) you are not collapsing waves, are you? It's just imagination. THIS is a dream, just one with stronger emotions and where the logical mind is never turned off. Physical reality does not exist seperate from 1C, not even quantum physical reality.
I believe these waves explanations arise out of incongruencies - the closer we look, the more we poke holes in objective reality, the more we unravel it with the wonderful thought "there must be a logical explanation"
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Originally Posted by john6630@hotmail.com but doesnt it still rely on the pre-existence of the wave functions... |
SubR only relies on 1C's imagination, creativity. And 1C is both the source and the experiencer of that creativity
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Originally Posted by john6630@hotmail.com and if you and I both intend/manifest the same things |
(according to SPsubR) There is only 1C, 1. Only one intender.
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Originally Posted by john6630@hotmail.com So it seems to me there is an "out there" that we all participate in...and which the physcists are discovering and studying. |
It seems that way because 1C 'seems it'. The concept "out there" is in 1C, and the physicists and discoveries and studies are also all in 1C and only in 1C, and there is less than nothing outside of 1C.
1C is like a zero-dimensional object in a zero dimensional world. A 0d object without length, width, depth or time, a point. A point in a universe of more dimensions would have something outside of it, but 1C does not. It is eternal, unchanging, has no dimensions and no boundaries. It
just is.
(Which is why this illusion of seperation is needed, to experience anything. Seperate places, seperate moments, seperate emotions... Nothing can be experienced without it's opposite, no hot without cold, no glory-of-god/nirvana/the-most-wonderful-feeling-of-Love-you-can-imagine without fear and suffering first, which is why 1C chose to forget its true nature)
1C is all that is.
All That Is = 1C's true identity.
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Originally Posted by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_Razor [...]This is often paraphrased as "All things being equal, the simplest solution tends to be the best one." In other words, when multiple competing theories are equal in other respects, the principle recommends selecting the theory that introduces the fewest assumptions and postulates the fewest hypothetical entities. It is in this sense that Occam's razor is usually understood. |