[{aspiring_to_clarity}]

Originally Posted by missing

It's just about impossible to live on one salary thanks to inflation, so forget about being a stay at home mom even if you wanted to.

I know a lot of women who are stay at home moms, actually. As for me, I'd prefer to spend as much time as possible with my children, but I would also like to do some kind of work. I am looking at something other than the 9-5 grind though. As I am sure many people are.

Originally Posted by missing

What if people want to "choose" the old roles?

Fantastic. My whole point is that anyone should be able to choose. Maybe choices they make will be constricted by financial need, etc. But what I am getting at is those choices not being constricted by societal expectations or "rules."

Originally Posted by missing

Depression is at an all time high!

I often wonder if depression is actually higher now than in the past or if it just wasn't acceptible to talk about it before. I am sure there is no way to know this. But to me the depression comes from striving for more and more in a materialistic society in which spiritual pursuits have been "back-burnered." And I am sure there are myriad reasons why we are in the place we are today, but that's just one theory. I think perhaps we are in such a time of great transition that it has profound effects??

Originally Posted by missing

well it's interesting that many people seem to want to go back to the old roles. But I think most people in the industrialized world have accepted that they are gone and not coming back and have thus adjusted their mindset (or tried to). Still those old biological urges are there, and even if we "get past them", I think it's sever hubris to think we can remove them from societal influence even to a small degree. They are going to have a HUGE impact weather we like it or not. Pretending they don't exist or that they are negligible is going to cause people a lot of pain, misery and confusion. And frankly we're at the point where we are so disconnected from our natural selves (in more ways than just gender) we just see it as business as usual.

I know people who have no urge whatsoever to have children or get married. I think that there are definitely biological urges to do certain things otherwise evolution wouldn't have happened at all. But I think it's stronger in some people than others. That's why I'd like to see a society that supports people doing what works best for them rather than prescribes certain roles based on factors such as gender, race, economic status, etc. I definitley agree we have moved very far from listening to ourselves for what is right for us. We have all of these mores and expectations we try to live up to...they cannot be right for everyone all the time!

Originally Posted by missing

yea but what if you wanted to be taken care of and nobody wanted to take care of you? Heck I'd love to stay at home and raise a kid while a woman earned all the money at some "career". But it's not gonna happen. Even if it did it probably wouldn't feel right. Refer to what I said about biology. Most women do not date men who earn less than they do even if they themselves earn well above average.

I know there are men who are the stay-at-home parent. I will agree that it's not as common as the reverse. This is one of those things that would be possible for more men to choose if we got rid of the gender stereotypes. They are still very pervasive in both men and women and many times it's inexplicable to me. I think that everyone can find someone who compliments them and wants the same set up as them. It just may not be as easy as more "traditional" ways .

Originally Posted by missing

i see.. I think a lot of people assume that cause men are in most positions of power, and that men are more aggressive, that all the wars and suffering in the world must somehow be due to male aggression. It's a great cliche that if women were in charge that we'd all sit around in a big circle holding hands discussing our "inner-feelings" rather than dropping bombs. But is there any real basis for this assumption? Especially considering that women can be just as calculating and cold as men.

I think we'd be just as screwed up with women in charge, it'd just look different. But who knows.

I am not one of those people who believes all the world's ills would be solved by women taking over power. All I advocate for, again, is rights for everyone (and not just women equal to men, but everyone equal to everyone else). We are all human. I think more could be done to change the world if people in power -- whoever they may be -- became more conscious and in touch with what connects us all.

Originally Posted by missing

well I think the general point is that men are more apt to be left alone than women. Especially younger women; they just attract more attention in public (and everywhere, really). Of course some of this (probably much) is unwanted and it's nice to not have to deal with that. But there are times when you want/need attention in which case as a guy it won't come to you. You have to work at getting it and I find this a real pain in the @$$ so I just chose to be alone even if it's not preferable. I think many women take for granted the attention they get. Worrying about being attacked is kind of an extreme example of "attracting attention".

I don't think I can agree with a blanket statement there. I am a woman and I don't get much attention at all!

Originally Posted by missing

well be careful what you wish for. Rights (i mean real rights more so than what society deems as a right) come with responsibility.

Don't worry, we can handle the responsibility .

If we all seek to understand each other instead of trying to be understood I think it would help a lot. Not everyone is willing to do that and so we struggle.