Originally Posted by Arcanum
In terms of suffering, the fact that the fundamental nature of everything is essentially empty space isn't, by itself, of any real use.
That is why in my personal explorations with the LOA, I tend to stick very much to things which have practical value or, to use your phrase, "real use".
But then you already knew that, from previous discussions, and yet you somewhat disdained the practical approach (for whatever reason).
We could conclude that if the one being hit with a rock is 99% space, that might imply that what I am is not that 1% matter, which would be true, but it doesn't actually solve the problem of the rock hurting, or really alter the attachment to any experience that is being had.
Again that's correct.
However if you could easily and rapidly remove the pain or accelerate the healing, via some mind method, then firstly, that is of practical value, and secondly, it will conceptually seem less plausible to regard your pain as "real".
Now of course, there are all kinds of interesting reports about how people can and do remove (through the use of various mind methods) what should be great physical pain. Just to illustrate, I offer Alex Lenkei, whose thumb-bone was sawn off by doctors, without anaesthesia: BBC NEWS | UK | England | Sussex | Man hypnotises himself before op
| Man hypnotises himself before op |
A hypnotist from West Sussex has undergone surgery on his right hand without a general anaesthetic.
Alex Lenkei, 61, from Worthing, chose to sedate himself by hypnosis before undergoing the 83-minute operation.
He said he was fully aware of everything going on around him during the procedure but was free from pain.
The operation at Worthing Hospital involved removing some bone in the base of the thumb and fusing some joints in an attempt to improve his arthritis.
Consultant orthopaedic surgeon David Llewellyn-Clark said he was happy in agreeing to the unusual sedation on Mr Lenkei, a registered hypnotist who has been practising since the age of 16.
“ At one stage a hammer and chisel was used as well as a surgical saw, but I felt no pain ”
Mr Lenkei said Wednesday's surgery "went amazingly well".
"It took between 30 seconds to a minute for me to place myself under hypnosis, and from that point I felt a very deep relaxation.
"I was aware of everything around me, from people talking and at one stage a hammer and chisel was used as well as a surgical saw, but I felt no pain."
Throughout the operation, an anaesthetist was on standby to administer an anaesthetic if necessary.
Mr Llewellyn-Clark said he had been confident that Mr Lenkei was a skilled hypnotist and was "delighted all went well".
Since Alex could allow a hammer, a chisel and a saw to be used on his bones without any pain, the question then arises - how "real" is the pain that ordinary people experience, when they fall down, get scratched, suffer a burn, get cancer etc?
Is it just a state of mind? And if you merely change that state of mind (Alex just took about 30 to 60 seconds, to do that), and the pain is just not there anymore .... well, how "real" was it, in the first place?