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Ilya · 11-14-2006, 05:13 PM

Well, I just caught myself defending hypnosis for some reason and I'm starting the post from scratch.

First of all, I'm not talking about stage hypnosis. I'm talking about what's called Ericsonian hypnosis - the kind that does not use pendilums and direct suggestions. It can be used on stage, though.
Then, the argument that you can not hypnotise the people against their will is missing the point. This argument is usually used by those who practice NLP and hypnosis to defend themselves against fears and accusations, to debunk the myths. Yes, hypnosis does not work the way most people think it does, but the fears are not unsound.
The real question is can you do something with hypnosis to another person would regret, once they get back to the "usual" state of mind. If you do, it doesn't really matter if it is against victims "will" or not. Yes, if the person knows that he is about to be hypnotised and does not want it or is being hypnotised without permission, it is much harder to put him into a trance and achieve malicious results.
But as Brutha suggests, it is possible to put a person into altered state of consciousness and achieve results before the person knows what's happening. It is even possible to use naturally occuring trance (when reading, when commuting) to do something bad.
In Russia we have these Gypsy "fortune teller", who are trained in hypnosis from their childhood and use it to steal. I'm not being nationalist here. Obviously there is just a small number of Gypsies who do it, but no other ethnic group is known for this. I once came under attack from such "fortune -teller" in broad daylight, and my NLP training allowed me not only to avoid the attack, but also to realize what exactly was happening. So I can attest that they indeed use hypnosis for their criminal ends.

So once you learn hypnosis, it brings a lot of responsibity. Is it the reason to ban hypnosis and learning it. I don't think so. I think the opposite. The people should be educated about the modern hypnosis, how to detect it, how to protect themselves from the negative effects. Why? Because it is used on us every single day. Most of it unconsciously. Potentially any phrase, a swearing, a phrase with negative meaning or just a phrase that might be understood as a negative command, an awkward pun, or something like that can be harmful. If it is said when a person is in altered state, it can trigger a subconscious response. It is used in advertising, sometimes intentionally, sometimes unintentionally, sometimes intentionally but unskillfully.
Why don't we notice it or the negative effects? We are not taught to. And the negative effects can be delayed, can be subtle, it can be just some irrational stress or fear, or poisonous belief we pick up. Most of the time we don't know where it comes from. What percentage comes from spontaneous use of hypnosis - it doesn't matter. Learning about it may reduce the possible ill effects. Using it for the bad purpose - well it takes a lot of motivation to learn this skill to the extend when one can intentionally do harm with it. There are thousands of much simpler ways to do it. If hypnosis was the biggest problem, we would be living in a much nicer world indeed.

11-14-2006, 05:13 PM	#19 (permalink)
Ilya Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 452	Well, I just caught myself defending hypnosis for some reason and I'm starting the post from scratch. First of all, I'm not talking about stage hypnosis. I'm talking about what's called Ericsonian hypnosis - the kind that does not use pendilums and direct suggestions. It can be used on stage, though. Then, the argument that you can not hypnotise the people against their will is missing the point. This argument is usually used by those who practice NLP and hypnosis to defend themselves against fears and accusations, to debunk the myths. Yes, hypnosis does not work the way most people think it does, but the fears are not unsound. The real question is can you do something with hypnosis to another person would regret, once they get back to the "usual" state of mind. If you do, it doesn't really matter if it is against victims "will" or not. Yes, if the person knows that he is about to be hypnotised and does not want it or is being hypnotised without permission, it is much harder to put him into a trance and achieve malicious results. But as Brutha suggests, it is possible to put a person into altered state of consciousness and achieve results before the person knows what's happening. It is even possible to use naturally occuring trance (when reading, when commuting) to do something bad. In Russia we have these Gypsy "fortune teller", who are trained in hypnosis from their childhood and use it to steal. I'm not being nationalist here. Obviously there is just a small number of Gypsies who do it, but no other ethnic group is known for this. I once came under attack from such "fortune -teller" in broad daylight, and my NLP training allowed me not only to avoid the attack, but also to realize what exactly was happening. So I can attest that they indeed use hypnosis for their criminal ends. So once you learn hypnosis, it brings a lot of responsibity. Is it the reason to ban hypnosis and learning it. I don't think so. I think the opposite. The people should be educated about the modern hypnosis, how to detect it, how to protect themselves from the negative effects. Why? Because it is used on us every single day. Most of it unconsciously. Potentially any phrase, a swearing, a phrase with negative meaning or just a phrase that might be understood as a negative command, an awkward pun, or something like that can be harmful. If it is said when a person is in altered state, it can trigger a subconscious response. It is used in advertising, sometimes intentionally, sometimes unintentionally, sometimes intentionally but unskillfully. Why don't we notice it or the negative effects? We are not taught to. And the negative effects can be delayed, can be subtle, it can be just some irrational stress or fear, or poisonous belief we pick up. Most of the time we don't know where it comes from. What percentage comes from spontaneous use of hypnosis - it doesn't matter. Learning about it may reduce the possible ill effects. Using it for the bad purpose - well it takes a lot of motivation to learn this skill to the extend when one can intentionally do harm with it. There are thousands of much simpler ways to do it. If hypnosis was the biggest problem, we would be living in a much nicer world indeed. __________________ Ilya.